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Archive 2016 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

minolta200
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Guys,

I have tried using the Batis 85mm on my A7rii. When hand held, I got blurry shots when looking at the image 100%. I suspect it was due to the conflict between OSS in the lens and IBIS on the body. I turned the Steady Shot off, the image improved a bit.

I'm wondering what would be the best way to use this lens on the A7ii/A7Rii both in handheld and tripod mounting scenarios. It seems to me, once the steady shot is turned off, all image stabilization functions are turn off, not just the OSS or IBIS, right?

Thank you for your help!

Mar 03, 2016 at 11:31 AM

AGeoJO
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

What is the shutter speed or are the shutter speeds of the images? Although the camera has IBIS, you still need to exercise the same technique in bracing yourself and hold the camera/lens combo really steady. Just to be on the conservative side, in your case, I would not exceed 2-stop than what you would normally set the shutter speed to get sharp images using a lens/camera without any stabilization feature. In other words, if you normally get that using 1/500sec. I would not go slower than 1/125sec using the A7r II and Batis 85mm. Please note that these are just hypothetical shutter speeds and not what you should set your camera under.

The IBIS in the camera and the OS of the lens should work together to give you 5-axis of image stabilization. Some folks suggest, and Sony mentions that in the manual, too, that you should turn off the IBIS when shooting on tripod. I haven't noticed any ill effect in leaving the IBIS on all the time but you need to be aware of that possibility.

Mar 03, 2016 at 12:05 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

I have been shooting for the last 18 years, proper shooting technique shouldn't be an issue. At first I thought it was the shutter speed, but I was shooting 1/125 sec with IBIS and OSS on.
I have tried having the IBIS on when using a tripod, the images are slightly blurry. Enough to be annoying. I'm sure if I reduce the image size, the blurriness will go away, but I prefer not to do that. I understand leaving the image stabilizer on with any lens mounting on the tripod will not be ideal.
Turning off IBIS, does it mean turning off Steady Shot? What about OSS? There is no separate switches on the lens.

Mar 03, 2016 at 12:29 PM

curious80
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

If I were to try and diagnose whats going on, here are the steps I will take:

1. Turn off both IBIS and OSS and shoot at high shutter speed (say 1/1000) to make sure I get blur free images with that.

2. If I get no blur with above, then I will reduce the shutter speed gradually (1/500, 1/250, 1/200, ...) until I find out the shutter speed at which I start getting blur (both IBIS and OSS still off). Remember that the old 1/FL rule doesn't hold for these ultra-high-resolution sensors (if viewing at 100%). So it is likely you might need faster than 1/125 to get totally blur free images.

3. Once I find the shutter speed needed to get blur free images without stabilization, I will then turn on one of the stabilizations to see how much it helps (or degrades) the performance.

Mar 03, 2016 at 12:43 PM

AGeoJO
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

minolta200 wrote:
I have been shooting for the last 18 years, proper shooting technique shouldn't be an issue. At first I thought it was the shutter speed, but I was shooting 1/125 sec with IBIS and OSS on.
I have tried having the IBIS on when using a tripod, the images are slightly blurry. Enough to be annoying. I'm sure if I reduce the image size, the blurriness will go away, but I prefer not to do that. I understand leaving the image stabilizer on with any lens mounting on the tripod will not be ideal.
Turning off IBIS, does it mean turning...Show more →

I didn't mean to offend you by suggesting to brace yourself when taking the images but merely pointing out that that could be the possibility. Again, I don't know you and I haven't seen any of your images. Plus, you didn't specify the shutter speed used for those images. But since you are confident that it is not your technique, then I don't know what may cause that slight blurriness in your images.

Mar 03, 2016 at 12:52 PM

TheEmrys
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Well, if you turn off all stabilization and shoot on a tripod, are the images crisp and sharp? Then how about handheld with all stabilization off?

Mar 03, 2016 at 01:18 PM

chmod
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

When shooting hand held, I leave both systems "on" and see no blur or degradation.

Ideally, I would try to find another identical system to test with, so YOUR lens with another body (perhaps in a store?) and then THEIR body with YOUR lens. Try to see if the issue moves.

Again, synergistically I have see no issue and don't even think about the two systems in use.

Good luck chasing this down.

FYI.

patrick

Mar 03, 2016 at 01:40 PM

HiredArm
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

I'd try to focus manually to see if it's the lens as well. The 85 Batis is known to hunt is less than perfect light.

Mar 03, 2016 at 03:02 PM

Rob L
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

This thread is referring to turning "both systems" on or off as if they are controlled independently. I must be missing something. My A7RII has a menu option called "Steady Shot". I assume this is "IBIS". I use it a great deal with manual focus at high magnification or with long lenses. Works great if you set the focal length under "Steady Shot Settings". I also have the Batis 85 and the Zony 16-35. I have assumed that the camera detects these lenses automatically and uses both systems (IBIS and the system in the lens) together as designed. I have not seen where I can activate IBIS and OSS independently of one another?

Mar 04, 2016 at 09:47 AM

MikeEvangelist
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

minolta200 wrote:
When hand held, I got blurry shots when looking at the image 100%. I suspect it was due to the conflict between OSS in the lens and IBIS on the body.

The two systems are not independently controllable - the camera knows what to do when the lens has stabilization. You can just turn it off or on.

It would be helpful to see one or more 100% crops of what you're seeing. (I've tested pretty extensively having stabilization on or off when on a tripod and the difference is usually invisible.)

Also, definitely try higher shutter speeds. The old guidelines about what shutter speed should be adequate for a given focal length are often not adequate for ultra-hi-res sensors.

Mar 04, 2016 at 10:20 AM

mcbroomf
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Are you shooting with EFC, or silent mode, or neither? As you may know the original A7r was prone to blur from shutter shock under certain conditions. The A7r2 added EFC to eliminate that and that's all I've used (ie I've not tested it against the old A7r when EFC is turned off). You could try all 3 modes. IBIS and OSS won't correct for shutter shock.

Mar 04, 2016 at 01:58 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

With image stabilization turned off, the images look very sharp.

Jun 14, 2016 at 03:11 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Good idea. Thanks! I may have to take my setup back to the store.

Jun 14, 2016 at 03:12 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Nope, you can't. I think it's all in or all off. Unfortunately, there is not a switch on the lens we can turn off the in lens stabilization.

Jun 14, 2016 at 03:14 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

I'm pretty sure I was shooting at 1/125 or 1/250 with image stabilizer on. That's really more then enough even for stabilization turned off.

Jun 14, 2016 at 03:15 PM

minolta200
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

I'm shooting with a A7Rii with EC on, also tried 1/200 sec with studio strobes.

Jun 14, 2016 at 03:17 PM

JLim
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

Can you post some sample images of what you're talking about?

You can return the lens after using it for 3 months?

Jun 14, 2016 at 04:14 PM

Matt Grum
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

I'm afraid I can't really add anything except to say this at I don't think this is usual behaviour, I have been greeting sharp images down to 1/25s with SteadyShot enabled.

Jun 14, 2016 at 05:33 PM

jaehoppa
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

quick question regarding steady shot. Is it only active when shutter is half pressed? does that mean it requires a certain amount of time to kick in and be fully effective? That would also mean, for back button focusing, the button has be pressed and held while actuating the shutter to get the benefit of steady shot, correct?

Jun 14, 2016 at 07:24 PM

MrTMan
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Zeiss Batis 85mm on Sony A7Rii Question

For what it's worth, I regularly shoot at 1/125 with EC off on my A7rII and have a good hit rate.

Jun 15, 2016 at 08:06 AM

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