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Archive 2016 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Does anyone have experience or knowledge about the Cambo Actus?

For example, could I mount a zoom lens and have a working zoomable TS lens, or would I need primes?
Could I mount a Canon 17mm TS lens and get better edge quality, by shifting the Actus instead of the lens (when at 10-12mm shift)?

My equipment: Sony A7R2, Canon 24-70 f2.8 II, Canon 17mm TS-E.
I'd like the 24mm and 45mm TS lenses, but the cost and weight is the downside.
Ideally, the Cambo Actus would be perfect in an ideal world.

Links to the product and demo YT vids:
https://www.cambo.com/en/actus-mini/cambo-actus-mini-view-camera/

Thank you

Feb 09, 2016 at 07:02 AM

freaklikeme
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

I have an Actus I use with my a7's. The only time I've mounted an SLR lens was to check the size of the IC, and I don't own the TSE 17, so I can't answer your questions about that lens specifically. However, I can say that, in general, most FF SLR lenses have their IC's optically or physically limited to less than 50mm in diameter. In the case of the 17, which is optically capable of producing an 85-90mm IC, the bellows on the lens may physically limit that so you can't use the lens in the manner you describe. There's a somewhat active Sony/Actus community on getdpi.com's Sony forum, so you might find someone there who has tested this set-up. I'd be surprised, though. Last I checked, the Canon lens adapter hadn't started shipping yet, and you'll need that if you want to change the aperture on the lens. Your best bet would be to contact a dealer (like Capture Integration) who has the camera on hand and can potentially test out the 17 for you once they have the adapter.

In general, the Actus is great when paired with medium or large format lenses. Using anything much wider than 50mm (in large format) or 35mm (in 645) takes an accessory WA rear standard and bellows for Sony and the lens performance with the sensor will likely decrease at extreme shifts. I use three Rodenstock LF digital lenses (55, 90, and 120) and a handful of enlarging lenses on mine and am overall very content with the system.

Feb 09, 2016 at 02:22 PM

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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

freaklikeme wrote:
I have an Actus I use with my a7's. The only time I've mounted an SLR lens was to check the size of the IC, and I don't own the TSE 17, so I can't answer your questions about that lens specifically. However, I can say that, in general, most FF SLR lenses have their IC's optically or physically limited to less than 50mm in diameter. In the case of the 17, which is optically capable of producing an 85-90mm IC, the bellows on the lens may physically limit that so you can't use the lens in the manner you...Show more →

Thank you very much for your help and the information

Feb 09, 2016 at 03:19 PM

Slalom
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Hi for shifting you need a large image circle with spare mm so that the image shifts without Vignetting, So I would guess the zoom would not be very suitable. It could even be visible in the viewfinder.

I would look to large format lenses first. 35mm SLRs and Mirrorless don't have big image circles otherwise they would need the scale of the tilt/shift or shift lenses.

Feb 09, 2016 at 05:40 PM

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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Slalom wrote:
Hi for shifting you need a large image circle with spare mm so that the image shifts without Vignetting, So I would guess the zoom would not be very suitable. It could even be visible in the viewfinder.

I would look to large format lenses first. 35mm SLRs and Mirrorless don't have big image circles otherwise they would need the scale of the tilt/shift or shift lenses.

Thank you for your help

Feb 10, 2016 at 07:16 AM

cdavis324
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

The water is a bit murky at the moment because there has never been a reason to measure(or even a way to test) 35mm lenses for image circle. Aside from the TS lenses, there are a few that work well - Canon 11-24 zoom(with hood removed), Canon 16-35 F4(almost as sharp as the 17 and 24 TS, but with a little distortion that is easily corrected), and Nikon 14-24. I'm sure there are some more, but each lens needs to be tested... Stefan who makes the H Cam Masters has done a bunch of tests, and posts results on his facebook page. The 16-35F4 has a plastic baffle on the rear of the lens that must be removed(just pop it out with your fingers) to access the entire image circle.

I've been using an A7r with an Actus for the past few months, and love it! I shoot interiors and architecture, and love using 1 lens for an entire shoot - the Canon 16-35F4. It's sharp, and I love being able to compose precisely without having to crop... There are 2 minor issues I have with the Actus. The first is that the vertical rise/fall isn't marked, so you have to guesstimate when recording movements for lens corrections. The second is that when shooting tethered and vertically you need a 90 degree usb connector - there isn't enough room for a normal cable between the camera and actus base rail.

Feb 10, 2016 at 10:02 AM

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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Feb 10, 2016 at 10:52 AM

cdavis324
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Also, from what I've heard(haven't tested myself) the Canon 24-70 doesn't allow for any real movement to speak of... I'm curious if any of the sigma art lenses have a decent size image circle - eventually I'll try the 24, 35 and 24-35 to see.

I'm using medium format lenses for longer than 40 - Hasselblad, RZ, P645, M645 all will work, but there are some great performers in each line, and others that don't work so well... And there can be a lot of sample variation(makes sense with lenses that were being used for 10-30yrs). I found the P645 zoom to be very good, which is quite surprising for a lens I picked up for just over $100, and others that were excellent performers on film just plain suck!

Feb 10, 2016 at 12:44 PM

freaklikeme
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

cdavis324 wrote:
The water is a bit murky at the moment because there has never been a reason to measure(or even a way to test) 35mm lenses for image circle. Aside from the TS lenses, there are a few that work well - Canon 11-24 zoom(with hood removed), Canon 16-35 F4(almost as sharp as the 17 and 24 TS, but with a little distortion that is easily corrected), and Nikon 14-24. I'm sure there are some more, but each lens needs to be tested... Stefan who makes the H Cam Masters has done a bunch of tests, and posts results on his...Show more →

Cool. Did you get the Canon adapter or are you using a different solution for your EF lenses?

How large is the IC at the wider end of the 16-35? That's a lens I wouldn't mind owning anyway, so if it worked out well on the Actus, that would probably push me over the edge on a purchase. Once you've popped the baffle off, it is easy to replace for normal shooting?

My chief complaint with the Actus is a lack of 0-position locks on the front standard, particularly on the swing.

Feb 10, 2016 at 04:10 PM

cdavis324
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

freaklikeme wrote:
Cool. Did you get the Canon adapter or are you using a different solution for your EF lenses?

How large is the IC at the wider end of the 16-35? That's a lens I wouldn't mind owning anyway, so if it worked out well on the Actus, that would probably push me over the edge on a purchase. Once you've popped the baffle off, it is easy to replace for normal shooting?

My chief complaint with the Actus is a lack of 0-position locks on the front standard, particularly on the swing.

I had a board custom made by SK Grimes before cambo made the dumb ef adapter. I'm still waiting for the electronic adapter! The dumb adapter isn't elegant, but it's a workable solution for me - I'm at f11 95% of the time.

17-18mm will give you like 5-10mm of movement, but once you get to 21-32 range, it'll be more than you ever need(like 15+mm)... I don't use a ton of movement, but there's a chart on the HCam.de facebook page.

The baffle is just a black piece of plastic that snaps into the rear of the lens(inside the mounting ring), so it's easy to remove or replace. I've been thinking of having the inside of my lens mount painted black so I don't have to be as careful with flare - flagging the lens is important, because there can be some internal reflections without the baffle. It's not a major problem, but something I've seen a couple times.

I'm not sure what you're talking about regarding lack of 0 - position locks... my actus has 0 detents on all the movements. There's also 10mm detents on the shift, and on the rise/fall.

Feb 10, 2016 at 08:11 PM

freaklikeme
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

cdavis324 wrote:

I had a board custom made by SK Grimes before cambo made the dumb ef adapter. I'm still waiting for the electronic adapter! The dumb adapter isn't elegant, but it's a workable solution for me - I'm at f11 95% of the time.

17-18mm will give you like 5-10mm of movement, but once you get to 21-32 range, it'll be more than you ever need(like 15+mm)... I don't use a ton of movement, but there's a chart on the HCam.de facebook page.

The baffle is just a black piece of plastic that snaps into the rear of the lens(inside the mounting...Show more →

According the Cambo website, the electronic adapter is now shipping, so the wait shouldn't be too much longer. Pricey piece, but it should be worth it to get a zoom TSE with aperture control. 21, 24, and 28 is a great set of focal lengths for that much movement. Unfortunately, it is one more thing to remember to charge.

Thanks for the info. I've never heard it called "flagging" before, but I assume that's the same as flocking.

The 0 indent on the tilt works well, but it's swing where things on my Actus aren't quite so clear cut. There's still a small amount of movement possible within the indent, which isn't a big deal until I forget to check it before starting a 7x5cm pano at infinity with one of my LF lenses. I'd prefer it if I could lock it in the 0 position, but a good indent like the one on tilt would be a welcome alternative.

Feb 10, 2016 at 11:00 PM

mcbroomf
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Flagging means warding direct sunlight off the front element of the lens when it's just out of the frame and the hood isn't doing the job. Often done with the hand, so I guess the term comes from something like "flagging down a taxi"

The Cambo intrigues me, I wish there was a way to try it.

cdavis, which P645 zoom are you referring to above?

Mike

Feb 11, 2016 at 03:35 AM

cdavis324
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

The 645 45-85 A - It's a surprisingly good lens, especially when you consider the price. I'm not saying it's an amazing lens, but quite competent for a lens I pull out very occasionally. I've found pentax lenses to have a big sample variation, so if you get a bad copy, try another.

@freaklikeme - I know what you mean regarding the detents, although I've never seen an issue on mine, but I'm always shooting a single frame stopped down. I could see it being an issue with such a large stitch!

As described above, flagging is what I use instead of lens shades(which are hard to control with movement) - just something to block direct light outside the frame from hitting the lens. I think flagging comes from the film world, and it's short for "french flag." I have a couple road rag kits that I use, but have used my hand, notebook, or even my body if we're racing the clock. Why do you think assistants always wear black!

@mcbroomf - I bought mine from Capture Integration, and I think they have one for rent.

If anyone starts testing other lenses, please post! I'm looking at the sigma art lenses, and wondering about the image circles... particularly the 24, 35, and 24-35. Now that I'm also shooting with Nikon(instead of canon) it would be nice to have lenses that work on both systems.

Feb 11, 2016 at 06:32 AM

mcbroomf
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Thanks for the info. I have several P645 primes and some M645 which I use on a Mirex. They don't get much time since I got the 24mm TSE II though. I'll have to check CI.

Feb 11, 2016 at 09:57 AM

freaklikeme
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Ah, well, at least now I'm less of a flagging idiot. Thanks, guys!

Feb 11, 2016 at 07:16 PM

naturephoto1
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

freaklikeme wrote:
Ah, well, at least now I'm less of a flagging idiot. Thanks, guys!

I wonder if this comes from using the term a flag (black to absorb light) versus a white (or silver) reflector that would be used in the studio or outdoors for lighting.

By the way, how does the Novoflex Ballpro Bellows compare with the Actus?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/379033-REG/Novoflex_BALPRO_T_S_BALPRO_T_S_Bellows.html

Rich

Feb 11, 2016 at 07:46 PM

freaklikeme
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

naturephoto1 wrote:
I wonder if this comes from using the term a flag (black to absorb light) versus a white (or silver) reflector that would be used in the studio or outdoors for lighting.

By the way, how does the Novoflex Ballpro Bellows compare with the Actus?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/379033-REG/Novoflex_BALPRO_T_S_BALPRO_T_S_Bellows.html

Rich

Seems possible, Rich.

The BALPRO's chief advantages are extension and price, but the movements are also a differentiation that can be positive or negative depending on your use. The amount of extension would allow you to get to 1:1 with quite a few 120mm macro heads (enlarging lenses or the like) and even a few 135's. To do the same with the Actus requires the purchase of the longer rail and bellows, which is both less convenient and more expensive. With the BALPRO in the vertical position, you have shift and swing on both the front and rear. Turn the unit horizontally, and you have rise/fall and tilt on both the front and rear. The Actus puts all of the tilt and swing on the front and rise/fall and shift on the back, which means you can engage all of them at the same time. Personally, I find that more useful than being able to tilt or swing both front and rear at the same time.

If you want a nice compromise between the two that's cheaper than either, the Mamiya Auto-Bellows N is a great option. You get independent tilt, swing, and rise/fall on the front and nearly the same amount of extension as the BALPRO. Add a Kipon M645 to Canon shift adapter and a Canon to Sony adapter and you've got most of the functionality of either system for less than half of the BALPRO. What you don't get are the nifty pre-made adapters, so you'll need to drill out a few Mamiya body caps and make your own.

Edited to add: While you don't get as much extension with the Actus, it is by far the more compact system. It's feasible to use it handheld, though it's not comfortable and there are arguments against buying a precision instrument to be used in an imprecise manner. I only mention it to illustrate the size difference, because "handheld" is not something I'd attempt with either the BALPRO or Mamiya.

Also, I forgot the BALPRO does have an optional shift adapter for the rear, so it is possible to get both rise/fall and shift on the rear at the same time, but it drives the cost up significantly.

Feb 11, 2016 at 09:16 PM

Javier Munoz
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

mcbroomf wrote:
Flagging means warding direct sunlight off the front element of the lens when it's just out of the frame and the hood isn't doing the job.

Mike

Good to know I used to called that sunny Hail. The fact that I have some resemblance to Germans and the extended arm gained me a few dirty looks.

Feb 12, 2016 at 08:07 AM

cdavis324
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

Anyone try any older Nikkor or Olympus OM lenses? Any other older lenses that have large image circles(other than the shift lenses)?

I'm wondering if the old Olympus lenses have at least 4-5mm of movement...

May 14, 2016 at 12:58 PM

harshdreams
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · "Cambo Actus" Tilt Shift equipment ??

cdavis324 wrote:
The first is that the vertical rise/fall isn't marked, so you have to guesstimate when recording movements for lens corrections.

Hi Davis, curious to know how to correct for distortion if there are movements even if one manage to record it? Thanks

Jun 17, 2016 at 02:31 AM

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