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Archive 2016 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

jhinkey
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p.4 #1 · p.4 #1 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I just weighed my RX1RII + domed shade+cap + small grip + strap (plus bat and SD card)
and
A7RIII + 35/2.8 + domed shade + cap + strap (plus bat and 2x SD cards).

625 grams
vs.
814 grams

That's significant to me.

Also, if I didn't have the small grip on the RX1RII it would be an even larger disparity.

So for me the lower weight and smaller size (mostly height) is what makes the RX1R-II nicer to have around the body when out and about.

Sharpness-wise, my copies are pretty similar and regarding the apparent "pop" - I think this is mostly a post-processing thing.

The 35/2 of the RX1RII is certainly way better looking and much sharper at close-in distances, but at infinity they aren't too far apart.

Won't be selling the 35/2.8 anytime soon though as there will be times where I can only have one body.

Someone please adapt the 35/2 for the A7RIII - I know the rear elements of the lens likely stick out pretty far, but I'd be willing to be careful to be able to have this on myA7RIII. Not holding my breath though.

- J

Jul 15, 2018 at 07:28 PM

jeffersoncasey
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p.4 #2 · p.4 #2 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I started my FF journey with RX1R and I was badly spoiled by the performance of the lens. There are definitely shortcomings on the functionality of the body but as a travel camera, it's not just great but so much joy to shoot with.

Unfortunately it was stolen last year and my quest of looking for a substitute hasn't stop.

I started out with a9, because of the same 24mp resolution and also silent shutter. Bigger battery and EVF is great, also snappy performance is worth the price and size weight compromise.

Then I started out with a 24-70GM zoom, but something about the color signature isn't very appealing especially under artificial lighting. And I sort of missing the bokeh, too.

I moved on to CV 40mm 1.2, all was great except close range rendering and color signature. The color sometimes work for me, sometimes don't. MF experience was a great learning process and it forced me to really look at what I'm focusing, rather than letting the camera decide. But then I sort of missing the AF convenience at the same time.

Then I finally convinced to look at the FE 35mm distagon. First copy was OK, but not great. It has some what I would call patchy color rendering although the bokeh was really pleasing. Color transition was not very smooth. At the same time it somehow lacking in bite or punch.

My 2nd copy of the lens was so different that I felt that I'm using a different lens. Micro contrast was a lot more apparent, sharper overall, and more contrasty. Funny thing is, the color transition also much smoother, and the bokeh is smoother too. Comparing to the shots I did with the RX1R, they looked really close.

So, at the moment apart from size and weight difference, there are a lot of similarity between the two with current combo, and so much more to offer from a9. At the moment, it's as close as I can get for an RX1R substitute.

Jul 15, 2018 at 11:44 PM

Audii-Dudii
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p.4 #3 · p.4 #3 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

chez wrote:
Well the biggest difference is the right hand grip making the A7R more ergonomic. Neither is big and heavy. Like I said, you can’t pocket either of them so the few mm and gm differences really aren’t huge.

FYI, there are ways to make the RX1-series cameras more ergonomically friendly without incurring a lot of expense or adding any significant amount of weight or bulk.

Such as modifying the grip and installing the AGR2 accessory grip for the RX100 series cameras:

Obviously, I didn't do the neatest job with mine, but even so, it still looks quite presentable -- almost factory-like, even, thanks to the "Sony" embossed in the AGR2 grip -- and it cost less than $15.00. Besides, this camera -- my first RX1 -- now looks scruffy enough that I'm no longer that concerned about its appearance.

And as for "pocketing" the RX1, I regularly do so with mine. Not a pants pocket (although I have managed to jam it into one when absolutely necessary) but frequently a jacket pocket. I usually install a wrist strap, too, so I can easily and comfortably carry the camera by the lens barrel, gripping it in my palm, which effectively makes it not much larger than my hand.

Jul 15, 2018 at 11:54 PM

philip_pj
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p.4 #4 · p.4 #4 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

What's a thread without gratuitous images? I sincerely doubt the ability of the FE 35/2.8 to deliver what the Sonnar 35/2 can give you, effortlessly. But I'm obviously a fan of the lens, albeit in knowledge of its shortcomings. [I use a Gariz half case for a little extra height at no real weight gain, lovely feel and still smells great.]

Jul 16, 2018 at 01:45 AM

nampramos
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p.4 #5 · p.4 #5 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Size and weight is very different, especially compared to the Mark 2 & 3 of the A7 series.

When it comes to image output, I'd say that can vary considerably, depending on how you shoot.

If you're buying brand new either one (A7RIII vs RX1RII) then I'd probably go for the A7RIII due to flexibility and a much better AF system. But if like you mention you just want the RII and will buy on the used market, then it starts to be harder to ignore the RX1RII.

If your goal is absolute portability and really don't mind not being able to switch lenses, then it's very hard to beat what the RX1RII can deliver in such a small and light form factor.

I have both the A7RIII and RX1RII and there's a lot of times I only take the RX1RII with me. Although lately I've been considering selling it since I haven't been photographing as much as I used to and could use the money to fund other hobbies. But still haven't sold since it's such a fantastic little camera.

The only thing that keeps bothering me (and this is Sony in general) is the lack of FW updates. The RX1 series never received a single update, which is quite shocking taking in consideration the amount of money these cameras cost!

Jul 16, 2018 at 02:06 AM

SonyRocks
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p.4 #6 · p.4 #6 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Which camera do you find more "fun" to shoot taking in consideration the pros and cons of each? I found the RX1RII makes me want to go out and shoot but the battery life does bother me. I'm not sure about the A7RIII with just the 35mm 2.8 zeiss . The battery life is great but the size of that might bother me in the long run.

Jul 16, 2018 at 04:07 PM

Jonas B
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p.4 #7 · p.4 #7 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I wrote:
I haven't checked the specifications myself but if the difference is 700 grams that is not a few grams. It is 700 of them. To me that makes a huge difference.
I agree, the camera is not for a pocket. But it slips, and very handily so, into one of the three padded spaces in my Domke satchel bag.

It's the low form factors making it possible. Then I got plenty of room for money, a phone, reading glasses, passport and something to drink. I never managed that with the A7(x) cameras.

It is of course very clear that our needs, when out...Show more →
chez wrote:
I'm afraid you are wrong here. The weight difference is 78 grams...hardly even noticeable. Don't know where you get your 700 grams from, but if you truly believe that is the difference in weight, then I can see your point...but your value is totally out to lunch. They are basically the same size with the A7R much easier to shoot with as I find the Rx1 a bit too cramped to shoot all day with. This of course is subjective.

Hi,
You are right. i was wrong. I sloppily read Fred's post and missed the 700 gram figure was for comparing the A7R3 with the ZM 35/1.4 to the RX1R2.
When comparing to the 35/2.8 the the weight difference is down to 300 grams, and even less than that in my case as I have a little grip mounted to the RX1R2.

but then again, the grip makes the camera great to handle (medium size hands here) and it certainly delivers, all the time.

I returned home yesterday after a two week journey through Germany and France. I brought the RX1R2 and a Sony RX100M5 thinking I might want some other focal length, or a capable little thing weighting even less than the RX1. i didn't use the latter once. Maybe i should have done so a couple of times but after years of traveling with the RX1 only the small sibling somehow came to stay in a trunk in the car all the time.

For some images i have to work harder not carrying a real WA lens, some shots are simply lost due to not loading up with a tele lens but on the whole I got what I wanted.

Cross posted from the RX1 image thread and the only processed not family related image this far:
https://photos.imageevent.com/jonas_b/fotoforum2012mixed/fmaltgear2012/z912_lavendel_stenhytta_Jonas_1807.jpg
The image above is an example of working harder as it is a stitch from two exposures. Not a problem, quickly done and in many cases I do fine with one lens only. no tripod involved.

So, I was wrong about the weight. Damn. But I won't agree about the size similarity as already described in how I carry the camera. I have some respect for people carrying several lenses and big camera(s). However, when visiting places with a lot of tourists you see them and they just look tired and not many care to switch lens or taking any images different from what everybody else with their cell phones takes.

I guess the OP has to do what everybody else does: find a solution fitting him or her.

Jul 17, 2018 at 11:19 AM

chez
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p.4 #8 · p.4 #8 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I agree with you that if one is happy to travel with only a single focal length, then the RX1 is a great choice. I'd never be happy with just a 35mm focal length. I need something wider. My go to travel kit is a 25, 35 and 85 and sometimes 18. I also travel with 2 cameras as both a backup and times when I'm out with both cameras with different lenses.

As far as image quality goes, I'm very pleased with what I get from the 35 2.8 lens. I never pixel peep into the far corners and my goal of the images I take are either prints or photo books. In this regard, the 35 2.8 holds up very well.

Jul 17, 2018 at 12:02 PM

Fred Miranda
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p.4 #9 · p.4 #9 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

chez wrote:
Hi,
You are right. i was wrong. I sloppily read Fred's post and missed the 700 gram figure was for comparing the A7R3 with the ZM 35/1.4 to the RX1R2.
When comparing to the 35/2.8 the the weight difference is down to 300 grams, and even less than that in my case as I have a little grip mounted to the RX1R2.

but then again, the grip makes the camera great to handle (medium size hands here) and it certainly delivers, all the time.

I returned home yesterday after a two week journey through Germany and France. I brought the RX1R2 and a Sony...Show more →

Jonas,
Even if the difference in weight is only ~ 300g (which I think is a lot), we are talking about f/2 vs f/2.8 lenses. A full stop! Not to count rendering differences which they could not be more different from each other.

Keep in mind that the Sonnar 35/2 is not as small as it appears. Actually 1/3 of the lens goes inside the body and almost touches the sensor! It's a marvel and unique design. Here is how the lens looks by itself:

Jul 17, 2018 at 08:54 PM

Jonas B
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p.4 #10 · p.4 #10 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Hi Fred,

I know... As I don't "need" a lot of different lenses very often I sold my A7R MkII because of the difference in size and weight compared to the RX1.

I have now used the RX1, and MkII, since the camera entered the market and I'm still very happy with it. From time to time I get interested in ILCes (?) again for the lust of trying other lenses but this far I have quickly returned to the RX1 again.
Part of this is about knowing your gear; I am now seldom bothered by the lousy manual focusing system or the button placement.
An RX1 with an elevated screw-in shutter release plate, a grip and some friction tape on the aperture ring is a great tool.

But enough about that. I see the OP left the area two years ago...

It's strange... but also satisfying, for me. I fully understand everybody with other preferences.

Jul 18, 2018 at 04:32 AM

justruss
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p.4 #11 · p.4 #11 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Couple notes:

1. Adding some grippy gaffers-type tape to the RX1rII aperture ring makes a huge difference. The ring is narrow, and too close to the body, but the biggest issue is that exactly where you are likely to grab it if you leave it resting at f/2... it's smooth and featureless. The ridges should go around the whole ring at minimum, even better if it was a different texture/material.

2. It looks like it shouldn't be toooooo difficult to engineer a version of this lens for A7(x) bodies, keep the size down, rendering similar, and still get f/2 that shines. Yes, it goes inside the body, but it also narrows from the mount and it appears glass diameter in the back part of the lens isn't an issue. Yes, it wouldn't be cheap to maintain tolerances (or get close) with such size/rendering characteristics. I know I'd pay Zeiss/Batis-price for such a lens.

3. After a couple of weeks using the RX1rII vs A7rII w/28mm f/2 (don't have the 35 f/2.8), I'll say that the size/weight/bulk difference is significant! It doesn't really look like it in comparison images, but in hand and use, from my perspective-- it's a world away.

4. As has been said before, it's a little stupid that we don't have the option to turn the camera on/off via the EVF. I'm getting proficient at popping the EVF latch as I lift the camera, then flicking the on/off switch... but it's a waste.

The camera has lived up to expectations. It also makes me even more desiring of its lens for my A7rII.

Jul 18, 2018 at 04:50 AM

realVivek
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p.4 #12 · p.4 #12 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I am probably one of the very few who went to a RX1 while owning/using a RX1R II.

I had it converted to a full spectrum monochrome.

Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

The 35/2 lens unit in the RX1 weighs 247g. It is quite compact.

Here is an image comparing with the tiny Samyang FE 24/2.8.

Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

The lens is unique and I think it is a telecentric lens. It is as good as it can get.

I now own a ZM 35/1.4. As good as that lens is (it really is superb, especially on my A7rII(m) ), I still have a slight preference to the Sony 35/2 (with a Zeiss sticker) in the RX1/RX1R II.

Jul 18, 2018 at 05:33 AM

Charlie N
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p.4 #13 · p.4 #13 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

You should give the 35 f2.8 a try. Due to the unique size, I grab it instead of the 28 most often by a wide margin. The size makes a big difference to me even if weight Wise it's only 100g less.

The rx1r is unique in that a 35f2 on the A7 body will be substantially bigger, and different class of size, while the 35 f2.8 is in the same class as the RX. I base this off of bags I can fit the combo into. Specialized bags like the think tank DH5 can fit the A7 and up to FE 85, but put in the rx1r or 35f2,8 and it's too big and the camera flops around in there. At that point, there are bags a notch smaller that fit better... So the decision is limited in that way. I'll take the truly fantastic R3 + 35 f2.8, however if Sony puts R3 features in an Rx1 body, that would make things a lot tougher.

I still think it's absurd that there isn't a small 35 f2 available, and at the same time, I've made peace with the 35f2.8. IMO, a truly special combo.

justruss wrote:
Couple notes:

1. Adding some grippy gaffers-type tape to the RX1rII aperture ring makes a huge difference. The ring is narrow, and too close to the body, but the biggest issue is that exactly where you are likely to grab it if you leave it resting at f/2... it's smooth and featureless. The ridges should go around the whole ring at minimum, even better if it was a different texture/material.

2. It looks like it shouldn't be toooooo difficult to engineer a version of this lens for A7(x) bodies, keep the size down, rendering similar, and still get f/2 that shines. Yes,...Show more →

Jul 18, 2018 at 05:42 AM

chez
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p.4 #14 · p.4 #14 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Like I said in a previous post, the images from the 35 2.8 don't disappoint. The size of the lens is truly amazing given what it produces. It's never left me wanting.

Jul 18, 2018 at 07:29 AM

ecarlino
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p.4 #15 · p.4 #15 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

that first image appears to have nothing in focus

chez wrote:
Like I said in a previous post, the images from the 35 2.8 don't disappoint. The size of the lens is truly amazing given what it produces. It's never left me wanting.

Jul 18, 2018 at 10:58 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.4 #16 · p.4 #16 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Has anyone compared the FE 35/2.8 vs Samyang 35/2.8 at different distances in regards to rendering (transition zone, smoothness on the OOF area), bokeh outlining, etc..?

Jul 18, 2018 at 02:00 PM

Jonas B
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p.4 #17 · p.4 #17 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Here is an reposted image, first posted here 2012. It shows the friction tape I and justruss mention in the earlier posts on this page.
I have since switched to the RX1R MkII model mainly to get the lower profile and faster AF but the bottom of the camera and the grips are looking the same way:
https://photos.imageevent.com/jonas_b/fotoforum2012mixed/fmaltgear2012/RX1_gadgets_4_bottom.jpg

With the friction tape on the grip the camera never slips, I don't use any straps of any kinds as they may get in the way and it's easy to change the aperture setting using one finger only.

Jul 18, 2018 at 02:23 PM

Nikon user
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p.4 #18 · p.4 #18 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

What is the purpose of the step-down rings?

Jul 18, 2018 at 03:33 PM

Audii-Dudii
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p.4 #19 · p.4 #19 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

Nikon user wrote:
What is the purpose of the step-down rings?

They serve as a lens hood, but are physically smaller than the typical lens hood. And because this "hood" is smaller than the usual hood, it also serves as a surprisingly effective lens cap, except it doesn't need to be removed before taking a photo.

Another option is to use a domed lens hood, such as the one sold for the Pentax DA 40/f2.8 pancake lens (the one in the photo below is JJC's generic version):

Jul 18, 2018 at 04:24 PM

Nikon user
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p.4 #20 · p.4 #20 · A7RII+35 2.8 or RX1RII ?

I'm surprised you don't experience vignetting with those lens hood ideas.
Very innovative though.
The RX100 grip is a nice addition also.
If only that camera had a 28mm lens I would buy one in a flash along with my RX100V.

Jul 18, 2018 at 08:57 PM

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