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Archive 2013 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

I have tried the few 35mm lenses I have together with the A7. They fall short when comparing to the results to what I get from the RX1. I'm not that surprised but thought something would get at least close.

I want a lens:
* with not too much CA,
* that is reasonably "sharp" from border to border at f/2 and "sharp" at f/2.8,
* at f/4 I would like to see decent corners allowing medium sized (A3) prints,
*not making too much axial CA,
* that is contrasty enough to allow for easy manual focusing,
* has at least medium good bokeh (technically that is with no sharp bright rings around background OOF highlights),
* not slower than f/2,
* that has no zone B MTF dip when shooting a flat subject (a wall, a building, a line of people, the horizon,
* which handles flare well

From experience, reading (this forum, MTF charts) and looking at images it seem to me as they all fall short. Perhaps the CV35/1.2 can do and I'm not sure about the Zeiss 35/1.4 incarnations. I would need to see more samples from these combos demonstrating the features I wish for. I have been thinking of the Minolta MD 35/1.8 but I'm afraid it is too flary. Size, weight and price aren't the most important factors here - image quality and versatility are.

What you say? Should I just ditch the A7 and stick to the RX1?

Dec 07, 2013 at 06:36 AM

davewolfs
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Curious to know if it exists! RX1 is a gem.

Dec 07, 2013 at 06:51 AM

Makten
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B wrote:
Size, weight and price aren't the most important factors here - image quality and versatility are.

Zeiss 35/1.4 ZF/ZE, but that sort of defeats the purpose of the camera. I'm on the hunt for a good 35 myself, and I can't find anything. Every M lens seems to have the "midzone dip" and the older SLR 35/2 lenses aren't very good.

Dec 07, 2013 at 07:05 AM

Jonas B
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Makten wrote:
Zeiss 35/1.4 ZF/ZE, but that sort of defeats the purpose of the camera. (...)

I know I wrote size and weight aren't that important in this case... but there are limits of course.

If the main reason to buy the A7 is size, yes, then it's a problem. I wanted a LIVE (or mirrorless system camera) camera with a good EVF. I'm hoping for a good enough 35mm lens making it possible for me to sell the RX1. That may turn out to be an unrealistic dream.

Dec 07, 2013 at 07:44 AM

wayne seltzer
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Good luck! Imho the m 35 lux is the only small 35 which I think compares with the RX1 for my IQ tastes. Since I have not seen any A7 shots with it, I assume it does not perform well on A7. I am keeping my RX1 for this reason and also the leaf shutter and small size. Hard to beat RX1 lens and sensor combo. CV 35/1.2 looks to be closest competitor to whatvyou want.

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:13 AM

Jonas B
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Yes Wayne, the CV35/1.2 is a candidate. Thank you for replying. The M Lux 35 ASPH I have owned (non-FLE, I'm not interested at all in the FLE version) but the zone B dip is not for me.

@Martin; I know you don't like the CV35/1.2. I know the lens very well from use with Nex cameras. Many pros, some cons, the later ones have made me hesitate buying it again but I may end up with anew copy anyway.
What is your main problem with the lens? The drawing style or something else? Any experience from a FF camera with the lens?

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:40 AM

Tariq Gibran
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B wrote:
I have tried the few 35mm lenses I have together with the A7. They fall short when comparing to the results to what I get from the RX1. I'm not that surprised but thought something would get at least close.

I want a lens:
* with not too much CA,
* that is reasonably "sharp" from border to border at f/2 and "sharp" at f/2.8,
* at f/4 I would like to see decent corners allowing medium sized (A3) prints,
*not making too much axial CA,
* that is contrasty enough to allow for easy manual focusing,
* has at least medium good bokeh (technically that...Show more →

The single lens which I have used that does that is the Samyang (Rokinion) 35 1.4. Since size and weight (just under a pound but HUGE) are not issues, that might work for you. It's certainly cheap enough. I really don't think you are going to find anything "smallish" in size that will match the RX1 in IQ on the A7's.

Edited on Dec 07, 2013 at 08:51 AM · View previous versions

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:46 AM

MaxBerlin
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Shouldn't the Sigma 35 or Zeiss Distagon 35 be close to what you're looking for ?

Edited on Dec 07, 2013 at 08:51 AM · View previous versions

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:50 AM

Jonas B
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Thank you Tariq, I forgot about that lens. I'll have a look at it. HUGE?

MaxBerlin; They would probably do. If somebody have an idea about something smaller I'm interested in that. We'll see where this ends. Thank you.

Edited on Dec 07, 2013 at 08:52 AM · View previous versions

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:51 AM

edwardkaraa
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

The ZE/ZF 35/2 comes to mind here. Maybe too much CA but otherwise exactly what's requested.

RF glass seems to need at least f/11 for good corners so I wouldn't look there.

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:51 AM

Tariq Gibran
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B wrote:
Thank you Tariq, I forgot about that lens. I'll have a look at it. HUGE?

It felt big size wise even on my DSLR. I think once you add the adapter, it will likely be around 5" long. It's listed as D x L: 3.27 x 3.04" (83 x 77.3 mm). EDIT. That spec was from B&H which is incorrect. It's actually over 4"'s long so figure 6"'s or more with adapter.

Edit: I also owned the ZF 35/2. The Samyang is much better with regard to corner to corner sharpness and lack of CA. The ZF has better micro contrast (typical Zeiss) while the Samyang will render more like Leica/ Minolta. The ZF will not give tack sharp corners by 5.6 and will always show a little CA even at F8 in those corners. Ultimately, the Samyang/ rokinon is better to the extreme corners at any aperture if that's what one is looking for.

Edited on Dec 07, 2013 at 11:02 AM · View previous versions

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:54 AM

MaxBerlin
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas,

Lloyd is having mainly good things to say about the native 35 2.8 lens for the A7's

Dec 07, 2013 at 08:58 AM

Makten
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B wrote:
@Martin; I know you don't like the CV35/1.2. I know the lens very well from use with Nex cameras. Many pros, some cons, the later ones have made me hesitate buying it again but I may end up with anew copy anyway.
What is your main problem with the lens? The drawing style or something else? Any experience from a FF camera with the lens?

It seems clearly optimized for close range photography, which I seldom do. At a few meters, it's just awful wide open (except for the middle). While oldish f/1.4 glass usually has some "glow" from spherical aberration, resolution is still there. Not so with the Nokton that gives high contrast but some sort of out-of-focus effect. It looks like you missed focus, even if you didn't.

It might be good stopped down, but then what's the point? It's a very heavy lens that feels unbalanced even compared to OM lenses sitting a lot further away from the camera.

What about Leica R lenses?

Edit: Have you tried the Voigtländer 40/2? It's a much better lens than the 35/1.2 in my opinion. Bokeh is reasonably smooth, but a bit funky towards the corners. Sharpness is great over most of the frame straight from f/2. The main weakness is that it's not bitingly sharp stopped down and doesn't give the best colors. But I haven't found anything that fits my needs better. Yet.

Dec 07, 2013 at 10:35 AM

naturephoto1
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Makten wrote:
It seems clearly optimized for close range photography, which I seldom do. At a few meters, it's just awful wide open (except for the middle). While oldish f/1.4 glass usually has some "glow" from spherical aberration, resolution is still there. Not so with the Nokton that gives high contrast but some sort of out-of-focus effect. It looks like you missed focus, even if you didn't.

It might be good stopped down, but then what's the point? It's a very heavy lens that feels unbalanced even compared to OM lenses sitting a lot further away from the camera.

What about Leica R lenses?...Show more →

I have yet to try my R 35mm f2 Summicron on my A7r. But, Jack (Jako) has some nice images with the lens in his set in the Leica R thread:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/895186/254#11981253

Rich

Dec 07, 2013 at 10:49 AM

galenapass
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

MaxBerlin wrote:
Jonas,

Lloyd is having mainly good things to say about the native 35 2.8 lens for the A7's

+1 I have read several reviews stating that the native 35mm is a great lens. Any reason not to consider it?

Dec 07, 2013 at 10:54 AM

naturephoto1
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

galenapass wrote:
+1 I have read several reviews stating that the native 35mm is a great lens. Any reason not to consider it?

Some have reported unusual color and bokeh under some situations. It could be sample variation and/or alignment (centering) but we still don't have enough information on the lens.

Rich

Dec 07, 2013 at 10:57 AM

Steve Spencer
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

naturephoto1 wrote:
I have yet to try my R 35mm f2 Summicron on my A7r. But, Jack (Jako) has some nice images with the lens in his set in the Leica R thread:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/895186/254#11981253

Rich

I had that lens and used it on my 5D. It is great for portraits and I really like the bokeh. The corners are nowhere near sharp, however.

Dec 07, 2013 at 11:09 AM

Tariq Gibran
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

The FE 35 native lens seems to be a lens that people like to "legitimize" due to it's supposed lower price (I don't find it that inexpensive myself given it's speed) and size/ system constraints of the A7's.

At longer distances, even on the 36MP A7r, the FE 35 seems to under-perform the 24MP RX1. Herb has a side by side comparison in his photostream which shows this here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/leicasonyzeiss/11104863796/in/photostream/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/leicasonyzeiss/11104913096/in/photostream/

found via this thread he started:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1257407/0

Tim Ashley recommends the FE 35 but once you read all the details and see the examples of random issues, it's easy to come to the opposite conclusion:
http://tashley1.zenfolio.com/blog/2013/12/sony-fe-35mm-f2-8-za-on-the-a7r-the-bisto-lens

Edited on Dec 07, 2013 at 11:13 AM · View previous versions

Dec 07, 2013 at 11:11 AM

naturephoto1
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Steve Spencer wrote:
I had that lens and used it on my 5D. It is great for portraits and I really like the bokeh. The corners are nowhere near sharp, however.

Hi Steve,

That is why I am expecting to use my Minolta CLE MC 40mm f2 M-Rokkor (I know the extreme corners are not sharp) and then to step to the R 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2 when I need the sharp corners for things such as landscape work.

Rich

Dec 07, 2013 at 11:12 AM

Steve Spencer
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Sony A7; is there an RX1 equivalent 35mm lens?

Jonas B wrote:
Yes Wayne, the CV35/1.2 is a candidate. Thank you for replying. The M Lux 35 ASPH I have owned (non-FLE, I'm not interested at all in the FLE version) but the zone B dip is not for me.

@Martin; I know you don't like the CV35/1.2. I know the lens very well from use with Nex cameras. Many pros, some cons, the later ones have made me hesitate buying it again but I may end up with anew copy anyway.
What is your main problem with the lens? The drawing style or something else? Any experience from a FF camera with...Show more →

Looking at the Lux 35 ASPH (non-FLE), MTFs it looks like the zone B dip clears up substantially by f/5.6. Here is a link to the data sheet from Leica:

http://www.summilux.net/m_system/images/Summilux35Asph.pdf

Was that your experience or does it never really clear up? It seem like it might be a really good option, other than the zone B dip it seems to meet all your criteria and it is quite small and the price is even more reasonable these days.

I can also comment on the Minolta MD 35 f/1.8. I had that lens and liked it very much. I got the lens from Patrick (weezeintrumpet) and you may remember all the wonderful pictures taken of models that he posted with that lens. The only reason I got rid of it was that on a full frame Canon it could only focus to about 3 meters. As you may know it has very nice Rokkor type bokeh and very nice colours. I also didn't notice any special problems with flare with the lens. It is an older lens and therefore doesn't have modern coatings, so I would guess that if pushed it wouldn't show the best flare resistance, but again I never noticed that as a problem. I can't comment on full frame corner sharpness either given the mirror hang issues on a Canon camera, but there should be no zone B dip given that the corners on APS-C were quite sharp.

Dec 07, 2013 at 11:13 AM

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