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Archive 2013 · Fall foliage advice please...

  
 
Sunny Alan
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Fall foliage advice please...


From India bitten by the fall foliage bug.
Need lot of foliage and landscapes of USA. Couldn't find any source to get them in large file size at reasonable price.

Traveling to US this September end.
ME and NH are the best for fall foliage and Utah for landscape wonders.
My base in USA is Atlanta.

Can I cover these places without a car ? (No USA License)
I will come with multi-sector Amtrack tickets. Been in US, know public transport is not covered everywhere though...

And is it safe generally and what about wild animals in Utah vast lands?
I plan to spent some 20 days.

How can I utilize these 20 days covering max. photogenic locations ?

General advises please...






Jul 15, 2013 at 11:28 AM
ben egbert
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Fall foliage advice please...


Not much public transportation in the Utah landscape areas. I would not worry about wild animals however. We have bears in mountain areas and snakes in the desert but I never see either. Lots of deer, elk and moose in non desert areas, give them space.

You could perhaps fly to some of the more popular locations like Moab for Arches and Canyonlands and take a tour. I see tour busses in these places and also individual tours. In fact a tour bus may be the best solution for a non driver.



Jul 15, 2013 at 11:51 AM
stanparker
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Fall foliage advice please...


Ben has a great suggestion for you to consider. I'm sure there are bus tours specifically for fall foliage in New England, and I've seen lots of National Park tour buses in Utah. Try google for these. Otherwise, I don't think you will make it, train service doesn't meet your needs, I'm afraid.


Jul 15, 2013 at 01:38 PM
Chuck Eklund
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Fall foliage advice please...


Another solution might be to take a class that is being taught in the areas you are interested in. The instructor typically moves you around in a van. The back of Outdoor Photographer magazine has many and I'm sure the internet does also.

Chuck



Jul 15, 2013 at 02:20 PM
JimFox
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Fall foliage advice please...


Chuck Eklund wrote:
Another solution might be to take a class that is being taught in the areas you are interested in. The instructor typically moves you around in a van. The back of Outdoor Photographer magazine has many and I'm sure the internet does also.

Chuck



Hey Sunny,

Without your being able to drive, Chuck I think has hit on a great point. Perhaps join up for 2 or 3 workshops. As already mentioned, in most of the places where the good fall color is, they are just too remote and you would not see any buses or public transportation to get your there.

With only 20 days, I would pick say 3 locations that you really like for fall color and work those areas. A lot will have to do with timing. Now you can pick the end of Sept and beginning of Oct and go to Colorado and shoot, also you could go up to the Grand Tetons and shoot. And more than likely get some good fall color in both places. But as far as the east coast goes, I think there fall color is a bit later than that, so I am not sure you could tie into both locations. You may just have to decide if you want Rocky Mountain area color (Colorado, Wyoming, etc ) or East Coast fall color (New England area).

Jim



Jul 15, 2013 at 02:56 PM
ckcarr
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Fall foliage advice please...


If you want to either torture yourself, or enjoy long train rides, check out the California Zephyr and the Empire Builder Amtrak routes.

The California Zephyr Starts in Chicago, but that segment to Denver isn't that interesting. However, from Denver through the Rocky Mountains and into the Utah desert is an amazing ride. You could get off in Granby (Rocky Mt. National Park), Glenwood Springs, Grand Junction, Green River Utah (next to Moab). Or, my understanding is that it will get you close to Yosemite in California, where you transfer to bus service. But... Chicago to California is around three days...

You could get off in Green River and have a guide meet you and drive you around if you're willing to pay for him....

The Empire Builder is supposed to be the most spectacular train ride, going from Chicago to points North and through Glacier National Park and eventually to Seattle.

Look into the website here: http://www.amtrak.com/west-train-routes

Be careful with debarking and then getting back on, as each segment counts...
See info here:
http://www.amtrak.com/take-the-trains-across-america-with-usa-rail-pass

Or, there's these deals: http://www.amtrak.com/deals




Jul 15, 2013 at 03:21 PM
skibum5
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Fall foliage advice please...


Sunny Alan wrote:
From India bitten by the fall foliage bug.
Need lot of foliage and landscapes of USA. Couldn't find any source to get them in large file size at reasonable price.

Traveling to US this September end.
ME and NH are the best for fall foliage and Utah for landscape wonders.
My base in USA is Atlanta.

Can I cover these places without a car ? (No USA License)
I will come with multi-sector Amtrack tickets. Been in US, know public transport is not covered everywhere though...

And is it safe generally and what about wild animals in Utah vast lands?
I plan to spent some 20 days.

How
...Show more

Gonna be rough to impossible to do it well without a car I think (or at least motorcycle), most places you really need to drive to get to.
Atlanta is pretty hecka far away from Utah or the Northeast.

September is a bit on the early side for amazing fall foliage. If it is near the end of September, perhaps the Northeast Kingdom part of Vermont (colors were beyond phenomenal in NEK of VT last fall and that area probably peaked around Sept 30th to October 4th or so; every year is different and sometimes it is a week plus early or late compared to average, it's often been late the last decade, the year before it was reallly late, although in some parts it was a bit early last year and some seasons are better than others, last year they say NEK had the best reds since perhaps the 60s or 70s or even 50s while NJ had it's second very subpar year in a row, shockingly, unprecedently poor color for two years in a row for NJ) and earlier turning parts of the Adirondacks in NY and some of the more northern and higher elevation portions of New Hampshire.

You can hit upon the odd snake and such, which could potential be dangerous if you don't spot it and step on it, but they are a pretty rare sight, most people never even see one, even when trying to see one. Grizzly bears were extirpated in Utah. Black bears can be dangerous, but are generally much less so than grizzlies and considering how spread out Utah is they are probably not seen all that often and well lightening strikes 'attack' far more people by a huge margin. Mountain Lions can decide to surprise attack and are found in Utah, but reports of attacks are very, very rare. Make noise when walking at dawn and dusk. Either stay away from kids or keep them close to you, as soon as you get no kids wandering off and more than one adult they are not likely to attack since like they surprise attack on single prey the smaller the better otherwise they'd probably run off afraid of humans (I haven't heard of them trying to chase anyone down in an open area no matter what either, they are ambush predators). There are TONS of people who hike all over, even alone, and barely any reported attacks in the area ever.





Jul 15, 2013 at 05:13 PM
Greg Campbell
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Fall foliage advice please...


Do you have a valid Indian driver's license? I'm pretty sure that will be acceptable. Contact a few US rental car agencies and ask.

Amtrak is fine for reaching major cities, you're going to have great difficulty reaching any of the remote areas of Utah.



Jul 15, 2013 at 06:18 PM
Tim Brooks
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Fall foliage advice please...


Sunny, It's about 4000 Km between the east coast and Utah so you may be on the train for several days. You could fly from Atlanta to Boston; Hartford, CT; Burlington, VT; or Albany, NY to get up to New England. All of those cities have Amtrak service. Joining a photo tour might be a good idea since most folks have a vehicle and you could carpool with someone. As someone has already noted, look in the back pages of Outdoor Photographer for some tour companies. You'll need to reserve your spot soon since many trips fill up in the spring and early summer. Here's one for Acadia NP in Maine that appears to have spaces.
http://www.americannaturephotographyworkshops.com/index.php/workshops-tours/workshop-info/acadia-national-park/

Have fun, Tim



Jul 15, 2013 at 07:25 PM
ckcarr
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Fall foliage advice please...


Here you go: http://www.amtrak.com/fall-travel-on-the-great-dome-car


Jul 15, 2013 at 08:01 PM
Sunny Alan
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Fall foliage advice please...


Thanks a lot dear friends. Good suggestions and many options.... Let me study one by one.

As per my preliminary plans, I will fly into New York by end of September and somebody will pick me up to NE locations for few days. (If at all my cousin back to US from China by then. If not I may have to look for those options suggested). Back from NY I will start Amtrack+Greyhound journey.

Ten years back I crisscrossed USA by train from NY through Chicago-Kansas-Flagstaff-Las Vegas- LA- Tucson-Houston-Jacsonville to Miami.
After one month tour I again catch train to NY throu Washington on return trip. But unfortunately I was no photographer then.
Surface travel, though slow, given me a feel of great American culture, people, landscapes and what not. Amtrak is comfortable, not at all boring. Best, cheapest option to crisscross the big, amazing land of diversity: USA.
The most important aspect of America I fount is respect to human life and personal freedom.

This time after finishing NE, I will entrain to Atlanta to my sister and family.

Is a car drive of 3+2 children from Atlanta to Las Vegas and the nearby Grand Canyon attractions possible /feasible?
Which are the landscape attractions on this route?
How many days to set aside for this drive?





Jul 15, 2013 at 11:00 PM
Sunny Alan
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Fall foliage advice please...


Greg Campbell wrote:
Do you have a valid Indian driver's license? I'm pretty sure that will be acceptable. Contact a few US rental car agencies and ask.

Amtrak is fine for reaching major cities, you're going to have great difficulty reaching any of the remote areas of Utah.


Are you very sure Greg? Can I drive in America with a valid Indian DL ?
If yes, it is great !
I am an avid driver, driven SOLO from Cochin, south India tip to Khardung la, "the highest motorable road in world", in northern tip of India, at Himalayas on Chinese boarder.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khardung_La
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pangong_Tso

It was some 3000+3000 miles through not very good Indian highways and about 1000+1000 miles through Himalayan terrains, where tarmac is not existing at most of stretches.
I advise this trip for you adventure-drive lovers....



Jul 15, 2013 at 11:19 PM
Greg Campbell
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Fall foliage advice please...


You're good to go!

From:
http://publicsafety.utah.gov/dld/documents/Handbook2011withphoto.pdf

"
PERSONS WHO DO NOT NEED A UTAH LICENSE
Nonresident Drivers

Nonresidents licensed by another state or country may
drive in Utah:
1. If they are at least 16 years old.
2. If they are temporary assigned by an employer,
religious or private organization, or governmental
entity.

Visitors with a valid out-of-state or out-of-country license may drive in Utah for up to six months.
"


Most, if not all, states have a similar reciprocal policy.



Jul 15, 2013 at 11:57 PM
Greg Campbell
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Fall foliage advice please...


"Is a car drive of 3+2 children from Atlanta to Las Vegas and the nearby Grand Canyon attractions possible /feasible? Which are the landscape attractions on this route? How many days to set aside for this drive? "

Yes, it's entirely feasible, but I don't know how much fun you folks will enjoy.
I'd say 3 days is a bare (sane) minimum. 4 or 5 days would be much more enjoyable. Make a slight detour north into the pretty mountains of Tennessee and northern Arkansas before launching yourself across the Great Plains. There are some National Grasslands along the way that can be very nice early or late in the day. Aim for southern Colorado (Great Sand Dunes National Park), before continuing toward the Grand Canyon/Vegas via the mountains and forests of southwest Colorado.

The interstate highway system is fast, but not terribly picturesque. When driving across Texas and Oklahoma, you might find a slow two-lane state highway to be a refreshing change of scenery and pace. I once spent roughly a week driving from Arizona to Wisconsin (a slightly shorter distance than your journey) and found the lazy local highways to be quite pleasant. Each small town is unique. Stop and visit the tiny museums and other local points of interest along the way.

Would this be tour be separate from your Utah parks loop?



Jul 16, 2013 at 12:27 AM
Greg Campbell
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Fall foliage advice please...


I'd agree that snakes are the dangerous animal most likely to be encountered. Even then, it's unlikely that you'll see a single example. Some of the eastern species can blend in fairly well with leaf litter on the forest floor. Stay on clear trails and you'll be fine. Out west, rattlesnakes are almost always visible it you're paying attention. None of our snakes are aggressive or territorial. Some can be 'cranky,' coiling and rattling before you're even aware of them, and others can be remarkably placid. A few weeks ago, I encountered a Black Tailed Rattlesnake that I'm 99% sure I could have picked up without risk. (Given the unpleasant consequences of a bite, that last 1% can be very dissuasive!) At any rate, a run-of-the-mill Cobra or Krait makes all our snakes look like cute little puppies and bunnies...


Jul 16, 2013 at 12:46 AM
Sunny Alan
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Fall foliage advice please...


"Would this be tour be separate from your Utah parks loop?"
>>>>>Yes, this is the same trip.
Do you think I am selecting a wrong route?

Well, I am naturally ignorant of the best route from Atlanta, covering best Utah landscapes.
If anybody help, I will be thankful.




Jul 16, 2013 at 06:41 AM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Fall foliage advice please...


How about getting an international driver license for a year?

I could drive in Korea with the International License which I obtained from AAA.

Good luck!



Jul 16, 2013 at 07:10 AM
Sunny Alan
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Fall foliage advice please...


IDL is good idea.
But it is good for frequent flyers.
Also, do not know how to obtain it.



Jul 16, 2013 at 09:01 AM
ckcarr
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Fall foliage advice please...


Here's a little information regarding the drivers license. Since you would be driving from Atlanta, you will cross through several states, not just driving in Utah. It seems the IDP will be especially valuable when renting a car also. It says, just go to your drivers license office in the country you're from.

http://answers.usa.gov/system/selfservice/selfservice.controller?PARTITION_ID=1&USERTYPE=1&LANGUAGE=en&COUNTRY=us&CONFIGURATION=1012&CMD=VIEW_ARTICLE&ARTICLE_ID=2815

I would seriously consider first routing from Atlanta to Denver. That's 1,400 miles, or two days. Once you get to Denver you are home free, in the catbird seat for fall colors. You can travel west toward Utah, stopping in Glenwood, up over McClure Pass, to Kebler Pass. Then over to Delta and Grand Junction, CO. Then you are only 100 miles from Moab, Utah. But, take highway 141 toward Gateway & Naturita, CO instead, then up Hwy 90 over to Utah and into the La Sal mountains.

In order of dangerous creatures in Utah, I say first, ordinarily nothing will bother you if you don't bother it. However, just use common sense. Facts are that the most common accidental deaths are falls off cliffs, then dehydration and heat stroke. Of course, every weird thing can happen in Utah, like getting stuck in quicksand, etc...

But the real creatures to watch out for are insects...
1) Bees & Wasps.
2) Black Widow spiders.
3) Scorpions.

Note that none of those will kill you, but may lead you to do something irrational! Like run off a cliff.

Rattlesnakes, in hindsight I've found them everywhere. On the road, hiding in ruins, on a trail in snow in a slot canyon during December. Southern Utah has the midget rattler, only about 1 1/2 ft long. Venom is more toxic than the average rattler however. Generally snakes are more active at night, and most common in April - June. You don't find rattlesnakes by looking however - suddenly they are just "there." And the rattle is not like the movies, it's a high pitched buzz. Often they don't even rattle though.

Black bears are pretty common in the La Sal mountains. Never heard of even a mauling up there however. They are so common, that they have a special unit hunting season going on right now up there for them. Still, I've only seen a handful of them.

Scariest critter to me is a bison with a baby when you are in the woods...
You won't find these unless you are totally lost in the Henry Mountains though. The bison would be the second most dangerous animal in the Henry Mountains, first being the mountain lion. But, again nothing ever happens there. You will never see either if you ended up over there. Weird though that there are no elk and no bears in the Henrys.

Passive photogenic creatures abound in southern Utah; deer, desert bighorn sheep, pronghorns, coyotes, eagles, hawks, wild turkeys...

So, circling back... I'd strongly suggest getting from Atlanta to Denver, then traveling at your leisure through Colorado to Utah....



Jul 16, 2013 at 11:32 AM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Fall foliage advice please...


Sunny Alan wrote:
IDL is good idea.
But it is good for frequent flyers.
Also, do not know how to obtain it.


IDL is Not necessarily for frequent fliers.
As I said, I obtained it from AAA office for $15 which would be valid for one year.
Just ask USA rental offices if they would honor IDL to drive.
In my opinion, they should.
Going around USA without a car is rather difficult and expensive.
Good luck.
Kee

--
Wow, Craig has given such a wealth of information. You are wonderful, Craig!



Jul 16, 2013 at 12:30 PM
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