I was looking through the Buy/Sell forum and noticed a person selling a camera stating it was new. Reading the posting the seller stated that they took x number of shots to verify it worked.
My feeling on this is that the camera is not new as it has been taken out of the box and x number of shots taken.
Or
Once a person has bought the item and tries to resale it, it is used as it is second hand.
I would try to get an actual shutter count from them. If it's just a few then I'd be willing to consider it "new" but obviously not if it's a good number of shots taken.
Guess there is a lot of grey area left for individual interpretation on this one.
ronfronberg wrote:
My feeling on this is that the camera is not new as it has been taken out of the box and x number of shots taken...
I agree. It's probably better to describe it as "Like New" (LN), or "Mint" (M). A common description for a very-rarely used lens in "new" condition, and with the complete "in the box" kit is LNIB (like new in box). If it was sold by a store where it had been used as a demonstrator for customers, it would be "demo", not new. The instant after a customer buys a new camera and walks out of the store (or opens the box that was delivered), it's no longer new, no matter how little it's been used.
Jun 09, 2012 at 12:11 PM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
Every camera that has been out of the box, is not new. One shot or 100k shots, it's still a used camera. Even if you only take it out of the box and keep it a few weeks without shooting, you have to sell it as a used camera. Like Jim say it's Like new or Mint
ronfronberg wrote:
Reading the posting the seller stated that they took x number of shots to verify it worked.
Agree with previous comments. The better question is what the seller did with the pricing of the "used" camera. Is it priced appropriately as an used camera or at retail price?
The other factor to consider is if this one of the high demand cam like the d800 or 5d3
ronfronberg wrote:
I was looking through the Buy/Sell forum and noticed a person selling a camera stating it was new. Reading the posting the seller stated that they took x number of shots to verify it worked.
My feeling on this is that the camera is not new as it has been taken out of the box and x number of shots taken.
Or
Once a person has bought the item and tries to resale it, it is used as it is second hand.
thanks for reading
ron
OK, but what's your point? If an item is being sold here on the B&S board it is USED…doesn't matter if it's still in the original packaging and un-touched…it's still used. As for the seller's description…again, so what…I think everyone knows what the seller meant. I don't believe every seller here is an attorney and understands the legal difference between 'new' & 'like new'…by the same token, I also don't believe that any potential buyer doesn't understand that a description of 'new' on the B&S board really means 'like new'.
I understand what you're saying but I don't understand why you're saying it…is this really an issue? Is anyone confusing a private transaction on a buy & sell forum with purchasing from an authorized factory dealer?
Tis a play on words. Unless you are a "authorized retailer" none of it is really "new" in my eyes.
On the flip side of that: I have purchased "new" glass at my local camera shack, knowing that other perspective buyers have already tried it out. At that point should it be sold as a demo?
Mark
Jun 09, 2012 at 09:13 PM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
Imagery NW wrote:
Tis a play on words. Unless you are a "authorized retailer" none of it is really "new" in my eyes.
On the flip side of that: I have purchased "new" glass at my local camera shack, knowing that other perspective buyers have already tried it out. At that point should it be sold as a demo?
Mark
Yes the glass on the shelf that the shop let the customers try, that's demo glass.
That is why dealers have lenses and cameras out for display so the customer can try the items. If the person is not sure and wants an extended use of an item, then rent it.
If the listing title says new in the box then the item should be as stated. If it has been used then the listing title should state that.
Yes, since the items here are not being sold be dealers then all the items are technically used.
Jun 10, 2012 at 01:52 AM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
ronfronberg wrote:
Yes, since the items here are not being sold be dealers then all the items are technically used.
Not really If the lens has never been out of the box it's still new. All the grey market lenses sold are new even if the people/shops selling them are not authorized dealers.
But as Omar wrote before. I don't really see your point here ? You know that every lens/camera sold in this forum is used. Especially if they have tested it with x number of shots
Lars Johnsson wrote:
Yes the glass on the shelf that the shop let the customers try, that's demo glass.
You don't really think a camera shop has a "demo" for every lens or product they sell? When you see that last 500mm sitting on the shelf, do you think it's a virgin lens that has never been touched or mounted? New is not always "new"....... Should that 500mm be sold and discounted as a demo? In my experience, that is never the case, it will still be sold for the full retail "new" price.
Jun 10, 2012 at 03:04 AM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
Imagery NW wrote:
You don't really think a camera shop has a "demo" for every lens or product they sell? When you see that last 500mm sitting on the shelf, do you think it's a virgin lens that has never been touched or mounted? New is not always "new"....... Should that 500mm be sold and discounted as a demo? In my experience, that is never the case, it will still be sold for the full retail "new" price.
When you buy a 500mm lens. You will get it in the original lens case. And the lens case is inside a big sealed box. No serious shop would brake that seal and take out the lens because a customer like to test it.
I have bought many of those super-tele lenses including the 500/4. I have always got a new lens. And I would not accept a broken seal when paying $ 5-10k for a lens.
No way a real and serious shop will let the customers unpack and test those super-tele lenses in the shop like you say. The really large shops have those lenses on the shelf for testing. But in most shops you have to buy it without testing the lens.
Do you really belive that you are allowed to test or try every product a camera shop sell?
You should know what's what, especially when buying expensive gear. A couple of years ago, I bought an EF 85/1.2L II from a local shop. When I asked to see one, the sales person brought out an open box and handed me the lens. It looked absolutely new, and he didn't say anything more about it. I asked, "Is it new?", and he said, "Yes, a lady bought it last week and brought it back a day later...". I said I want a new one. The manager overheard us and said, "We'll order the new one for you. It should take about a week to get here. In the meantime, why don't you use this one? We'll swap them when the new one comes in." That's exactly what I would expect from the manager. The sales person should have told me it was used, right up front.
Imagery NW wrote:
You don't really think a camera shop has a "demo" for every lens or product they sell? When you see that last 500mm sitting on the shelf, do you think it's a virgin lens that has never been touched or mounted? New is not always "new"....... Should that 500mm be sold and discounted as a demo? In my experience, that is never the case, it will still be sold for the full retail "new" price.
Shops don't open the big super tele boxes to have those lenses sitting on the shelf. It's not like the normal smaller and less expensive lenses. If they did then they can't sell them as new. Those boxes have a sealing unlike the smaller lens boxes
jcolwell wrote:
You should know what's what, especially when buying expensive gear. A couple of years ago, I bought an EF 85/1.2L II from a local shop. When I asked to see one, the sales person brought out an open box and handed me the lens. It looked absolutely new, and he didn't say anything more about it. I asked, "Is it new?", and he said, "Yes, a lady bought it last week and brought it back a day later...". I said I want a new one. The manager overheard us and said, "We'll order the new one for you. It should take about a week to get here. In the meantime, why don't you use this one? We'll swap them when the new one comes in." That's exactly what I would expect from the manager. The sales person should have told me it was used, right up front....Show more →
omarlyn wrote: OK, but what's your point? If an item is being sold here on the B&S board it is USED�doesn't matter if it's still in the original packaging and un-touched�it's still used. As for the seller's description�again, so what�I think everyone knows what the seller meant. I don't believe every seller here is an attorney and understands the legal difference between 'new' & 'like new'�by the same token, I also don't believe that any potential buyer doesn't understand that a description of 'new' on the B&S board really means 'like new'.
I understand what you're saying but I don't understand why you're saying it�is this really an issue? Is anyone confusing a private transaction on a buy & sell forum with purchasing from an authorized factory dealer?
The reason I am saying it, is that the seller will list it as New In The Box. I will look at the posting and it is not New In The Box. If the seller would have stated that in the title I would not have bothered.
Sven Jeppesen wrote:
Shops don't open the big super tele boxes to have those lenses sitting on the shelf. It's not like the normal smaller and less expensive lenses. If they did then they can't sell them as new. Those boxes have a sealing unlike the smaller lens boxes
Thanks Sven for speaking on behalf of all camera shops and how they operate;(
Imagery NW wrote:
Lars.... I guess they do things different in Bangkok. I'm not going to get into a pissing match about what you "think" you know.
Regards,
Mark
A little respect...goes a long way around here, dude.
When you grow up, maybe...just maybe...you'll have 1/10th the talent & experience Lars has. Maybe.
If the lens has never been out of the box it's still new. All the grey market lenses sold are new even if the people/shops selling them are not authorized dealers.
