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Archive 2011 · #469 Musical Valves

  
 
Navyblue
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · #469 Musical Valves


It's been a while, getting a bit rusty now. Had a hard time conceptualising it, and equally hard time naming it.

Obviously it is far from perfect, critique away!



Thanks for looking.

Edit: image changed.

Edited on Oct 04, 2011 at 11:39 AM · View previous versions



Oct 01, 2011 at 03:44 PM
mark fadely
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · #469 Musical Valves


I like the lighting and effect here. Maybe a little more space to the right of the sax would say thirds more to me. There is just a hint of an object in the BG that might be eliminated too.


Oct 02, 2011 at 06:33 AM
Navyblue
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · #469 Musical Valves


Thanks Mark. To be honest I didn't quite like it. When I was shooting my flash ran out of juice so I had to stop.

What do you mean by the "hint of an object in the BG"? Do you mean the headphone on the left?



Oct 02, 2011 at 11:47 AM
Navyblue
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · #469 Musical Valves


Here is another shot that I did, with different processings.








Oct 02, 2011 at 12:22 PM
mark fadely
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · #469 Musical Valves


I like the last one best. Whatever pp you did in the last three has eliminated the BG ghosting I see in your first image. The faint object in the BG on the first shot is just above the headphones and also there is a smudged area on the right edge of the frame 1/3 down from the top. They are not obvious, but if you view brightly you can see them. You may have to scroll the page up and down a bit to make it more visible. Neither BG element detracted from the image, it was just something I thought you might want to know about.


Oct 02, 2011 at 10:07 PM
Hightraxx
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · #469 Musical Valves


I like the first one.

Norm



Oct 03, 2011 at 09:51 AM
kellermsu
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · #469 Musical Valves


I like the composition of the first one and the crispness of the last one.

Jim



Oct 03, 2011 at 09:20 PM
Navyblue
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · #469 Musical Valves


Thanks guys for your inputs.

I changed my entry, decided to do something simpler.



Oct 04, 2011 at 11:14 AM
gt_me_jon
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · #469 Musical Valves


I really like the new entry. Simple and clean with interesting lighting as well.


Oct 04, 2011 at 05:52 PM
AuntiPode
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · #469 Musical Valves


New image is crisply done.


Oct 04, 2011 at 06:01 PM
Navyblue
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · #469 Musical Valves


Thanks guys.


Oct 05, 2011 at 01:07 AM
ckeilah
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · #469 Musical Valves


This doesn't meet the assignment topic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_thirds). But I like the picture. :-)

Apropos aside: It would really be nice if y'all would leave up your historical images, so we can see the process. All three of the photobucket pix above are now 404. :-(




Oct 06, 2011 at 10:26 AM
Navyblue
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · #469 Musical Valves


ckeilah wrote:
This doesn't meet the assignment topic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_thirds).


Care to explain why?

On the horizontal thirds, the empty space took up the top one third. The subject took up the botom two thirds.

On the Vertical zone delineation, the empty spaces between the vavlves separate the picture into three thirds.

I thought it looks pretty obvious? No? Even if it is not, "rule of thirds" is a guideline, and not a rule eventhough it is "called" one. There are lots of "rules" in text books, but there are really no rules in photography. Even your link is careful to point out the variable nature of it.



Oct 06, 2011 at 10:54 AM
ckeilah
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · #469 Musical Valves


Sure! This is the point of Assignments. :-) Here, I've overlain the ROT lines:



Nothing falls on any of the lines, so it doesn't illustrate the assignment.

Sorry about the "loading". Aperture is screwing with me, as usual. :-P



Oct 06, 2011 at 11:31 AM
Navyblue
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · #469 Musical Valves


Doesn't it looks perfect?

Rule of thirds is not about putting subjects along the lines.

May I quote the link that you gave me.

Analogous to this "Rule of thirds", (if I may be allowed so to call it) I have presumed to think that, in connecting or in breaking the various lines of a picture, it would likewise be a good rule to do it, in general, by a similar scheme of proportion;

The lines acts as zone delineation. If you have a subject along the line, the subject acts as a zone divider. But subject is not the only thing that can create delineation. s stated in bold, it is the about lines in a picture, and more elabrated below in bold.

In short, in applying this invention, generally speaking, or to any other case, whether of light, shade, form, or color, I have found the ratio of about two thirds to one third, or of one to two, a much better and more harmonizing proportion, than the precise formal half, the two-far-extending four-fifths—and, in short, than any other proportion whatever.

Using the example above, the ratio between the empty space at the top and the subject is 1:2. Man it deosn't get any more textbook than this. If you like a more classic landscape example, visualise the subject below as land, the empty space above as sky. The horizon falls exactly on the top horizontal line, eventhough horizon is not exactly a "thing", it is a border or zone lines.

The space (or if you like the terminology above, shade, or black) between the valves runs along the vertical lines and separating the picture into 3 equal vertical parts. Again, if you like a classic landscape example, visualise the valves as mountains and the space in between as valleys. The valleys runs along the vertical lines, eventhough valley is not exactly a "thing", it is a border or zone lines.



Oct 06, 2011 at 12:10 PM
ckeilah
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · #469 Musical Valves


That "analog" is pretty much the same argument I used to defend my photo, but I put the intersecting lines amid the two groups of people in the background, thereby using the ROT to ostensibly draw attention to them, behind the glasses in the foreground. Maybe I'm not understanding this whole concept; let's review:

The rule states that an image should be imagined as divided into nine equal parts by two equally-spaced horizontal lines and two equally-spaced vertical lines, and that important compositional elements should be placed along these lines or their intersections.

I don't think we can really say that negative space is an important compositional element - it's important, but precisely the opposite! Now, if you had something in the background, right between the valves, and right upon an intersection, then I'd say you nailed the assignment. But there's nothing there.

Also, the valve tops *just miss* being on the top horizontal line. Why not crop just a bit tighter and nail it? Like this, but you need more side space to get the valves aligned with the verticals (hope that makes sense)



PS: I like the B&W treatment, and the shadows are really nice! :-)



Oct 06, 2011 at 01:06 PM
ckeilah
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · #469 Musical Valves


Here's a better example, maybe:



Here the valve stems are placed on the lines, and the pads are centered on the intersections. We'll put the top of the valves across the bottom line. I think the fact that both valve pads have the same lighting is a violation of the rule though: Two distinct, equal lights, should never appear in the same picture. Some dodging and burning could fix that though.



Oct 06, 2011 at 01:27 PM
Navyblue
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · #469 Musical Valves


Actually, I disagree with pretty much everything you said.

- The lines are not absolute rules and a degree of flexibility is allowed (as stated in the link too), and to align things accurately to the pixel is thoroughly unnecessary. I see that this can be subjective. FWIW in my example, I consider them "close enough".

- You are insisting on placing objects centred along the line. This narrow interpretation is IHMO incorrect. As I have mentioned, any kind of boundaries, lines or change in colour, continuous or otherwise, can be considered as zone delineation. The link also did mentioned that.

- As for the light, aesthetic is the only consideration, I never intended it to comply to any rules whatsoever. But even then I also disagree with your interpretation. The phrase you quoted is referring to a picture in a whole and not separate parts of a picture.

But I can agree to disagree.

Thanks for the kind words, I didn't really do anything for the B&W conversion apart from converting it to grayscales. As far as I can I won't touch the adjustment slider as it would introduce grain, which I think is inappropriate for this particular scenario.



Oct 07, 2011 at 10:45 PM
ckeilah
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · #469 Musical Valves


Thanks for the lively discussion! Moving on to "negative space" now.... I haven't had time to even think about it yet. I'd better get shooting. Cheers!


Oct 08, 2011 at 06:57 AM





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