Curious to know how you would respond if you got this request...

"Hi,

I'm writing to you on behalf of XXXX regarding an upcoming education program.

XXXX would like to obtain permission from you for use of El Yunque waterfall image in XXXX.

XXXX would like to request the following rights:

World distribution
All Translations
All media/all delivery systems
Unlimited print run/end users
For a term of 20 years
To include multiple uses within the Program, ancillaries, derivatives and versions whole or in part
In formats accessible to individuals with disabilities
In promoting the program (in context)

I'm looking forward to hearing from you so that I can go ahead and send a license request.

If you are willing to grant the rights to your images for this type of use then an official license request will follow shortly.

Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Thank you in advance for your time in helping make this project a success.

Sincerely,

XXXX

Permission Specialist
XXXX, Inc. "

Keith, for this I would suggest you use something like fotoQuote which will allow you to plug in all of the licensing terms listed in the request. Or, you can go to the Alamay or Getty websites, pick an image similar to the one you've received the request for, and see what they would charge for a similar license.

I will offer an opinion: a 20-year term seems awfully long to me.

John

I get the impression from the wording of the request that they don't want to pay for such rights. If that's the case, it's up to you if you want to donate to that particular cause.

As John suggests, fotoQuote or similar can help with the pricing if that's not the case.

<Chas>

cwebster wrote:
I get the impression from the wording of the request that they don't want to pay for such rights. If that's the case, it's up to you if you want to donate to that particular cause.

As John suggests, fotoQuote or similar can help with the pricing if that's not the case.

<Chas>

I don't really see that this is a request for the image to be donated. Yes, fotoQuote or similar but I would assume that it's NOT a pro bono request.

If you closely read the email it sound like thy aren't interested in paying...the never use the word " license" but they do use the phrase "request the following rights "and " grant the rights". And the person is a permissions specialist, not license negotiator.
If you add in the absurdly broad rights they want, either they are fools or geniuses.

Sounds well into five figure if you axe me

Micky Bill wrote:
If you closely read the email it sound like thy aren't interested in paying...the never use the word " license" but they do use the phrase "request the following rights "and " grant the rights". And the person is a permissions specialist, not license negotiator.
If you add in the absurdly broad rights they want, either they are fools or geniuses.

Sounds well into five figure if you axe me


exactly what I was thinking, seems like they want your photo for free

Seem's like this is the norm with clients these days, everyone wants our work for nothing. I would trow out a quick figure like $20,000 and see what he says.

It makes sense for them to at least ask for something for nothing as there are plenty of people who will give away everything, not understanding the value that the images add to the client's project.

I bet if they ask 10 "photographers" that they find online 5 will either not charge at all or charge no where near enough.

Ask them to go ahead and send the license request that they mention so you can review it with your legal representative (be that yourself or an attorney).

Kinda hard to give a specific (legal) answer to an unspecified (legal) question. If they "balk" at your efforts to move toward legal/professional, with some song & dance ... that could be a red flag. If they respond with confident, certainly we'll divulge the legal details of what we want ... that could be a good sign. Either way, it can be a start to help "flush them out" a bit as to their reputability.

Get the details so that you understand what it is you are agreeing to ... THEN, negotiate. I suspect that the "educational" project is their code word for associating to cheap/free under a loose guise of "education".

They talk about a program and project ... yet want 20 year licensing with essentially unlimited rights for usage. That kinda goes against the concept of a program/project which is typically better defined timeline than 20 years @ all languages, etc.

Also, while they have pointed out in this communication that it would be "in context" with the program ... what does the official license request (that you would likely sign) say. I smell a "rat" that would take the pics for cheap/free under the guise of education program ... then the program amazingly fails ... yet they now have unlimited usage rights (oops they conveniently had language in the "official license request" allowing for that) for any and all purposes.

I would hope that this is not the case ... but, until you review the official / legal language involved ... you really don't know what you're agreeing to, despite what they sent you originally. I would also ask them for a prospectus / scope / overview of the project ... with some degree of detail.

I got burned by an educational program for about $10K many years ago ... part of a $300K scam that managed to fool a broadcast company as well ... FBI involvement, etc. They even had gone to the effort of fraudulently getting Hillary Clinton endorsement on their "educational project".

My point ... is that "educational" projects can be emotionally charged to have people let their guard down from a business/legal perspective. If it sounds fishy ... it just might be. Proceed with caution.

I'm guessing they are simply trying to build a "stock agency" from freely given pics and unlimited rights .. using the "educational" slant as a ruse that will somehow include reference to "fair use" when the request for $$$ comes into the picture and that they can't afford to pay anything, but won't be "collecting" anything either ... since it is for "education" ... but knowing they have language that allows it for anything. Don't be surprised if you see your pic on a calendar someday.

Micky Bill wrote:
If you closely read the email it sound like thy aren't interested in paying...the never use the word " license" but they do use the phrase "request the following rights "and " grant the rights". And the person is a permissions specialist, not license negotiator.
If you add in the absurdly broad rights they want, either they are fools or geniuses.

Sounds well into five figure if you axe me

+1

This seems sketchy. I am willing to bet that they will agree to whatever amount you want for the photo. I am also betting that they know you will ask more with their 20 year all(?) rights request. I'm also betting that they will want to send you a cheque for way more than what you are asking with them wanting you to send back the difference.

There's something about it that smells earily like some of those scams that circulate on the internet. It just doesn't seem right. Something about it has a bunch of red flags.

Sorry to just respond now. Thanks for all the replies. I believe they are looking for it for free, but wanted to see what photographers here had for advice. My gut was to ask for a low figure and if they balked pass on it. I am not trying to give my photos for free and dilute the professional waters. I am a hobbyist, but understand I get nothing out of saying I have been published, except for the feeling of being used.