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Archive 2011 · 5DII high ISO v 5D

  
 
garyvot
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


MrAdventure wrote:
Nice glasses....you didn't buy the camera to take better pictures of that right?

Show us something else.


I think that's a rather lovely shot... do you realize you sound antagonistic?



Jan 22, 2011 at 03:32 PM
James Cripps
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


haha I can't stop laughing. He said don't show cats and babies, so he showed dogs and adults!


Jan 22, 2011 at 03:36 PM
schristie11
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


James Cripps wrote:
haha I can't stop laughing. He said don't show cats and babies, so he showed dogs and adults!


I was thinking that about the dog too.

However, his photo of the adults dancing is above par, for online photo samples.



Jan 22, 2011 at 03:45 PM
James Cripps
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


Oh definitely. Great shot! Just funny to see how that worked out


Jan 22, 2011 at 04:08 PM
AaronNegro
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


OK, thanks for all replies done so far.

It seems to be a confuse matter from 1 to 2 stops depending on the user.

I take is about 1 Stop and 1 1/2 stops.

Nowadays I would get around 700 Euros for my 5D and I would need around 1000 more to buy a 5D II.

So 1000 Euros = 1.5 stops

Getting a Canon 50 mm 1.4 + 85 mm 1.8 for 650 Euros might be a better deal if we only consider low light capability.

All said, I'm a bit fed up with cleaning the 5D sensor and I would love having LV and more resolution... It is not a clear call!!



Jan 22, 2011 at 04:44 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


MrAdventure wrote:
Show us something else.


Lighten up, Mr Adventure...



Jan 22, 2011 at 04:58 PM
Don Clary
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


For what it's worth, Canon rates the normal range (before going to H range) of the 5D 1 to 1600 and the 5DII to 6400.


Jan 22, 2011 at 05:08 PM
AaronNegro
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


For the record too

I find ISO 3200 on my 5D only usable when using lightroom 3, I just dislike Lightroom, I do not seem to adapt well to it.



Jan 22, 2011 at 05:23 PM
garyvot
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


My take is that 6400 on the 5D2 is like 3200 on the 5D. Both are "usable" with optimal noise reduction (either process in ACR 6, or disable NR in RAW and use a separate tool like Neat Image), though I try to stay at lower ISOs.

Since the 5D2 has more resolution, it's possible to downsample the images to 10-12Mp and achive further improvements in visible noise at 100%. For my own workflow, I find the downsampling/sharpening algorithm in ACR 6 works a bit better at reducing apparent noise than processing the full resolution image and downsampling in Photoshop. This file size is sufficient for all of my event clients.

However, with good workflow, I think the 5D is quite solid up to 1600--it's really only beyond that that the 5D2 provides practical improvement.



Jan 22, 2011 at 05:37 PM
MrAdventure
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


gdanmitchell wrote:
Lighten up, Mr Adventure...


I'm cool but this high ISO talk between bodies is getting to be a circular argument on here. Nobody buys a 5D2 to take pictures of pets and glasses. Let's see some real world shots that actually matter. Like your shooting a wedding in a really dark church and you absolutely better get some decent shots. That's what we need to see.



Jan 22, 2011 at 09:05 PM
schristie11
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


MrAdventure wrote:
Let's see some real world shots that actually matter. Like your shooting a wedding in a really dark church and you absolutely better get some decent shots. That's what we need to see.


Most of these people are busy shooting and working and dont have time to post on the internet. lol



Jan 22, 2011 at 09:35 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


MrAdventure wrote:
I'm cool but this high ISO talk between bodies is getting to be a circular argument on here. Nobody buys a 5D2 to take pictures of pets and glasses. Let's see some real world shots that actually matter. Like your shooting a wedding in a really dark church and you absolutely better get some decent shots. That's what we need to see.


I posted a link earlier.

Someone else posted a link and you made fun of it. Classy.



Jan 22, 2011 at 11:28 PM
Dawei Ye
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


MrAdventure wrote:
I'm cool but this high ISO talk between bodies is getting to be a circular argument on here. Nobody buys a 5D2 to take pictures of pets and glasses. Let's see some real world shots that actually matter. Like your shooting a wedding in a really dark church and you absolutely better get some decent shots. That's what we need to see.


Why do we use crash test dummies in car safety testing? Do we really carry crash test dummies around in the car in real life?

Why not use real people for car crash tests? That's what we need to see eh...? How can we judge a car's safety using crash test dummies?



Jan 23, 2011 at 03:46 AM
patrickphoto
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


It is not a linear gain. At low iso it gains nothing, at mids it gains a stop and at highs (above 4000) it gains two... Worth every penny to upgrade.


Jan 23, 2011 at 03:50 AM
Dawei Ye
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


I am a camera collector and pixel peeper.

I own 6 SLR's, of which only 1 I regularly use (the 5D2), as I do more pixel peeping than photography

With that in mind, this is my professional opinion as a pixel peeper:

The 5D Classic is cleaner than the 5D Mark II




Jan 23, 2011 at 05:20 AM
Dawei Ye
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


Some objective evidence

Parameters:
RAW
ALO, PIC, NR, Sharpness all disabled manually/set to zero in camera AND in Canon DPP (Very important to do this)
DPP conversions at setting 8/10
Combined in photoshop and saved at setting 11/12
White Balance set to Kelvin - 2800K in both cameras
Manual Exposure under same lighting condition.

Slight difference in shadow intensity is due to different camera sizes affecting angle of lens to the target.

Slight difference in exposure must be due to the inherent design of the cameras as exposure parameters were identical

Slight difference in WB anc contrast must be due to tonal response curve and WB Shift as Neutral Picture Style was used during conversion and capture, and WB was maintained at 2800K on both

Lens used 85mm f/1.2L II at f/8

http://dawei.zenfolio.com/img/s1/v19/p1059404581.jpg

http://dawei.zenfolio.com/img/s8/v10/p880039694.jpg

http://dawei.zenfolio.com/img/s3/v25/p830488754.jpg

It is possible that my 5D2 is defective, but as it is cleaner than my 1D3 and 40D, so they must be very defective too. And so must my 1D2N and 400D as they are much inferior.

garyvot wrote:
My take is that 6400 on the 5D2 is like 3200 on the 5D.


gdanmitchell wrote:
I have shot both extensively, and my general feeling is that the 5D2 is worth one to two stops of higher ISO performance.



RobertLynn wrote:
5D2 is a stop or more better than 5D1.
/quote]



Don Clary wrote:
I had the 5D I for 4 years; now two 5DIIs.

Clearly better than one stop. 1 1/2 stops or 2 stops? Somewhere in that range. That fine a difference is difficult to tell.


timbop wrote:
I have to disagree - I believe if you downrez a 5d2 iso 6400 image it is more than a stop better than a 5d iso3200 image.




I'm really interested to know why I get different results, do you guys still have the 5D to do a comparison?

Edited on Jan 23, 2011 at 05:37 AM · View previous versions



Jan 23, 2011 at 05:31 AM
mttran
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


Newer cam is always overrated


Jan 23, 2011 at 05:35 AM
Dawei Ye
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


mttran wrote:
Newer cam is always overrated


I agree with you there Michael.

Everytime a new camera comes out, we hear claims of "2 stops better than XXXX". Who can forget the 50D "1 stop better than 40D" debacle.

Since starting with the 40D/400D (Rebel XTi) and moving to the Canon 5D Mark II, I really feel we have only really advanced about 1 stop in that time

ISO 6400 is about as usable as ISO 3200 on the 40D...so really we haven't made much, if any, progress.



Jan 23, 2011 at 05:39 AM
alundeb
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


Fellow Dawei, your opinion as a professional pixel peeper is taken seriously on these shores. However, during my own experience in the very same profession, I have gathered the impression that downsizing is not the most effective way to realize the noise advantage of having more pixels to start with.

These alternative methods should also be considered for possible validity:
1) Upsize the smaller file
2) Apply slight noise reduction on the larger file, until the amount of detail is similar to the other. This can also be done before downsizing.



Jan 23, 2011 at 05:42 AM
alundeb
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · 5DII high ISO v 5D


We should also remind ourselves that the true ISO sensitivity of the 5DII is 1/3 stop lower than the 5D. This means that if you take pictures at the same ISO setting, manual exposure, same shutter speed, you will have to push the 5DII image 1/3 stop to get the same brightness, effectively also increasing the noise 1/3 stop.



Jan 23, 2011 at 06:00 AM
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