5D II - wrong time to buy it?

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Archive 2010 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

dhphoto
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p.4 #1 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

I think it is interesting to note that the 60D still has basically the same AF as all the 5D's and xxD series, no attempt to update what is palpably the main weakness in Canon non-1-series cameras.

It's obvious that a 5D3 should inherit 7D features with a full frame sensor, but would that make it just too good to miss and harm sales in the long run?

Sep 09, 2010 at 06:20 PM

Future Man
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p.4 #2 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Maybe cause I'm a 5DII owner and my expectations are tainted, but there really isn't anything a 5DIII could do that would tempt me to upgrade at this point.

Maybe better video features? I mean, it's pretty much perfect as a photo camera for me.

Sep 09, 2010 at 06:22 PM

tuanv1980
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p.4 #3 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Buy what makes you happy. 5dIII might not be that much of an upgrade, maybe more pixels, flip out screen, and re-designed body....something similar to the 60D. I don't think the focus will be any better than the 5dII, since there is different market for that with 1series.

On a side note, technologies will always get better, why keep trying to catch up to it and pay full price ?

Good luck !

Sep 09, 2010 at 06:33 PM

dhphoto
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p.4 #4 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Future Man wrote:
Maybe cause I'm a 5DII owner and my expectations are tainted, but there really isn't anything a 5DIII could do that would tempt me to upgrade at this point.

Maybe better video features? I mean, it's pretty much perfect as a photo camera for me.

Focusing.

Just not good enough on a camera of this price.

Sep 09, 2010 at 06:42 PM

Mr.Lindy
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p.4 #5 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

I get by with a couple 2008 5D Classics I bought new.
They're 30 months old now.

I hope the articulated screen is included on 5D Mark III.

Seeing articulated screen included on 60D put a stop to me buying 5D Mark II.

Waiting for the next non existent camera allows me to buy lenses instead.

If 5D Mark III has articulated screen I won't wait many months or years to buy one like I did with 5D Classic(s).

tuanv1980 wrote:
Buy what makes you happy. 5dIII might not be that much of an upgrade, maybe more pixels, flip out screen, and re-designed body....something similar to the 60D. I don't think the focus will be any better than the 5dII, since there is different market for that with 1series.

On a side note, technologies will always get better, why keep trying to catch up to it and pay full price ?

Good luck !

Sep 09, 2010 at 06:49 PM

vpk24_astro
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p.4 #6 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

dhphoto wrote:
I'm afraid I'm not buying that. The 1D3 has a much higher frame rate. The 1Ds3 is 'crippled' just for that reason, it can't shift the data any faster.

As for 5DII banding, that is another issue, one that I haven't experienced.

The 1Ds3 can do 5 fps while the 1D3 does 10. So over a second, they transfer roughly equivalent amounts of data, However, the instantaneous rate on the 1Ds3 MAY be higher because the pixel count is twice that of the 1D3.
My understanding is that the frame rate on the 1D3 is limited more by mechanical considerations having to do with the reflex mirror than by the speed with which the camera can capture, transfer, process and write the data. If that is the case, then it is probably true that the actual transfer rate off the sensor is higher on the 1Ds3 than on the 1Ds3. I think only camera electronics engineers would be able to settle this.

As for the banding noise - it's there if you underexpose by a few stops and then push in post-processing. It's more severe on some unlucky cameras than others. Ours seem to be lucky - I can only see it on mine when I really push.

Sep 10, 2010 at 01:12 AM

vpk24_astro
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p.4 #7 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

n0b0 wrote:
vpk24_astro wrote:
Thats one of the big differences between the 1Ds3 and the 5D2 - the shadow banding that some people see in the 5D2 is a result of a lower quality data path.

I find it hard to believe that Canon would dare sacrifice image quality to differentiate their camera bodies. Not when their Rebel bodies have been known to have just as good IQ as the higher end APS-C bodies.

I don't think it's deliberate - they (the engineers) are asked to produce a certain product at a certain price-point with certain performance. Some corners have to be cut in the process. What I do know is that there is no smoke without a fire and there are a lot more people complaining about banding noise on the 5D2 than on the 1Ds3.
Let it be said though that under my shooting conditions, I usually find very little trace of banding in my images - I think you have to abuse the exposure and post-processing for it to be really bad. It also varies from body to body.

Sep 10, 2010 at 01:31 AM

n0b0
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p.4 #8 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

vpk24_astro wrote:
n0b0 wrote:
vpk24_astro wrote:
Thats one of the big differences between the 1Ds3 and the 5D2 - the shadow banding that some people see in the 5D2 is a result of a lower quality data path.

I find it hard to believe that Canon would dare sacrifice image quality to differentiate their camera bodies. Not when their Rebel bodies have been known to have just as good IQ as the higher end APS-C bodies.

I don't think it's deliberate - they (the engineers) are asked to produce a certain product at a certain price-point with certain performance. Some corners have to be cut in the process. What I do know is that there is no smoke without a fire and there are a lot more people complaining about banding noise on the 5D2 than on the 1Ds3.
Let it be said though that under my shooting conditions, I usually find very little trace of banding in my images - I think you have to abuse the exposure and post-processing for it to be really bad. It also varies from body to body.

That doesn't make sense. You said it's not deliberate but then said that they're just making a product to a guideline and having to cut corner because of that. I think that qualifies as deliberate.

Sep 10, 2010 at 01:50 AM

vpk24_astro
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p.4 #9 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

n0b0 wrote:
vpk24_astro wrote:
n0b0 wrote:
vpk24_astro wrote:
Thats one of the big differences between the 1Ds3 and the 5D2 - the shadow banding that some people see in the 5D2 is a result of a lower quality data path.

I find it hard to believe that Canon would dare sacrifice image quality to differentiate their camera bodies. Not when their Rebel bodies have been known to have just as good IQ as the higher end APS-C bodies.

I don't think it's deliberate - they (the engineers) are asked to produce a certain product at a certain price-point with certain performance. Some corners have to be cut in the process. What I do know is that there is no smoke without a fire and there are a lot more people complaining about banding noise on the 5D2 than on the 1Ds3.
Let it be said though that under my shooting conditions, I usually find very little trace of banding in my images - I think you have to abuse the exposure and post-processing for it to be really bad. It also varies from body to body.

That doesn't make sense. You said it's not deliberate but then said that they're just making a product to a guideline and having to cut corner because of that. I think that qualifies as deliberate.

Depends on what you consider deliberate. I don't think Canon has chosen to price the 1Ds3 at $7000 and the 5D2 at $2500 in-spite of having the same sensor and processing pipeline i.e. I don't think the difference in price reflects just the weather sealing. What the increased price probably reflects (amongst other things) is
a. Higher precision in the lens-mount, sensor alignment and sensor flatness.
b. Tighter tolerance in the actual electronics used.
c. Superior EM shielding between the channels carrying signals from the pixels to the ADCs.

So if you ask Canon's engineers to produce a FF sensor for a $2500 camera, you have to cut corners to meet that price point. In that sense, it is not deliberate. It is deliberate in the sense that the 5D2 sensor is not the best that it could be if cost were no object. In that case, even the 1Ds3 sensor would qualify as being deliberately crippled.

Sep 10, 2010 at 02:08 AM

sergiodg
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p.4 #10 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

I've just read this on Canon Rumours (affiliated to Canon):

http://www.canonrumors.com/2010/09/1ds-mark-iv-in-2011-or-2012-cr2/

It says, there will not be a 5D III until 2011. What? 28mp?

If that's true I should buy it soon.

Thank you all for your posts!!!!!

Sep 10, 2010 at 10:45 PM

Access
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p.4 #11 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

You can't win, if you buy early in the model cycle you risk getting the next 50D, or having to wait for firmware patches that might never come out, if you buy it later in the cycle you risk a new model coming out to replace it sooner rather than later. Honestly the best you can do is just resign yourself to buying the camera you need when you need it, and using that camera until your skills or your ability to capture photos with it demands something better (may be never). I only upgraded because I hit the point where I felt the gear was holding me back or that I could do more with better gear, and I'll probably stick with what I have for 5-10 years.

Sep 10, 2010 at 11:19 PM

vpk24_astro
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p.4 #12 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Access wrote:
You can't win, if you buy early in the model cycle you risk getting the next 50D, or having to wait for firmware patches that might never come out, if you buy it later in the cycle you risk a new model coming out to replace it sooner rather than later. Honestly the best you can do is just resign yourself to buying the camera you need when you need it, and using that camera until your skills or your ability to capture photos with it demands something better (may be never). I only upgraded because I hit the point where I felt the gear was holding me back or that I could do more with better gear, and I'll probably stick with what I have for 5-10 years.

+1
Sometimes you just gotta say, "What the frack, make your move."

Sep 11, 2010 at 08:36 AM

sergiodg
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p.4 #13 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

It is great to make happy both "hats", the artistic one and the business one.

Sep 11, 2010 at 08:50 AM

peterfriday
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p.4 #14 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

not worth waiting. if it was going to come out in the next 2-3 months perhaps worth the wait, but since that isn't the case just get the mk2. something newer and better will always come out, thats life.

Sep 11, 2010 at 09:53 AM

rhorta
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p.4 #15 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

I didn't want a 5D2, I was happy with the 5D (and 1D3) until Canon would introduce a significantly improved AF system (a la 7D) into a non pro FF (meaning anything but a 1Dsx).

Wound up trading my 5D for a 5D2 mainly to get MA and LV in April this year.

At c. 1750,- it was relatively cheap compared to the 5D I had bought 4 years earlier, and the upgrade only cost c. EUR 1000,-

In the end it became a surprisingly significant upgrade, if all minor ad not so minor improvements were added up.

Since April the 5D2 actually went up in price again here in Holland (by c. EUR 100,-)

Sure the 5D2 will eventually be replaced, it will drop in price etc, but in the time being I am having fun with it. Even if the replacement knocks on the door, the 5D2 will still have a good sensor and continue to function.

Besides I'm not expecting a 5D2 replacement this year or before the introduction of the flagship 1Ds4. Regardless what some may think, I don't expect Canon to introduce a strong competitor to the 1Ds4 before its release or even its 3-6 months in the limelight.

Ruy

Edited on Sep 11, 2010 at 11:52 AM · View previous versions

Sep 11, 2010 at 11:50 AM

Mr.Lindy
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p.4 #16 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

2011 is what, some 3 months away ?

I hope 5D Mark III has articulated screen like 60D has.

Thats the one feature I am waiting for in Eos mount:
Full frame with articulated screen.

Until then, I'll shop for glass

sergiodg wrote:
I've just read this on Canon Rumours (affiliated to Canon):

http://www.canonrumors.com/2010/09/1ds-mark-iv-in-2011-or-2012-cr2/

It says, there will not be a 5D III until 2011. What? 28mp?

If that's true I should buy it soon.

Thank you all for your posts!!!!!

Sep 11, 2010 at 11:51 AM

rhorta
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p.4 #17 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Mr.Lindy wrote:
I hope 5D Mark III has articulated screen like 60D has.

I sure hope it doesn't!!

AF is the word...

Ruy

Sep 11, 2010 at 11:53 AM

laidlow
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p.4 #18 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

^ Agreed - Those screens just scream "BREAK ME"!

Don't see how they have any business being on a pro body considering how much punishment they usually get put through.

Sep 12, 2010 at 04:02 AM

sergiodg
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p.4 #19 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

Are we going to see anything else from photokina is this basically it?

Do the manufacturers keep some supprises for later days?

Sep 24, 2010 at 10:06 PM

mttran
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p.4 #20 · 5D II - wrong time to buy it?

If you can wait this long why not for another year.

Sep 25, 2010 at 08:40 PM

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