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Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread
  
 
mortyb
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p.714 #1 · p.714 #1 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Hey, Luka! Good to see you here again! Nice sets and stories!


Jul 26, 2013 at 09:25 PM
sebboh
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p.714 #2 · p.714 #2 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


denoir wrote:
A tip: rent a small car.


+1, especially if it's just 2 of you. coincidentally, i also dinged up a rental mercedes on a narrow country road in tuscana, though i believe it was near lucca rather than firenze.

even better than a small car would be motorcycles, can't think of a more fun place to ride (the countryside i mean not in/around the larger towns).

great to see posts from you again luka!




Jul 26, 2013 at 10:12 PM
rscheffler
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p.714 #3 · p.714 #3 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Thanks guys!

Michael - love the motion in these and the moodiness of the first one.
Phil - lovely and very peaceful!

adamdewilde wrote:
Ron - Nice, I like the 28cron, but I'm surprised at the bokeh in the second photo.


Do you mean the busy bokeh in the tree branches at the top of the frame? I think that's pretty typical of wide angle lenses. Maybe there's a bit of field curvature contributing to this too? Could also be from running these through a basic downsizing function with a set sharpening value that I tend to find is too high for the 28 Cron, but good for the 21/50 Luxes wide open. You can see the center of the frame is much smoother looking, so it could probably stand a bit of cropping too. It would be interesting to also shoot the scene with the RX1 in comparison (a few steps back with it for similar framing). I'm sure the background would improve (blur more) by shooting closer, but I liked the composition like this. I do like the 28 Cron a lot for people pictures at around 1-1.5m. This one was probably more around 2.5ish.

Right about here is where I'm yelling "don't look at the sun!"












Both with 28 Cron wide open. Second one is probably around 1m or a bit closer.



Jul 26, 2013 at 10:39 PM
zhangyue
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p.714 #4 · p.714 #4 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


jojomon11 wrote:
Growing Grand Daughter! The only time I can capture her is when she is sleeping!

Use your Nikon, . So peaceful.

Ron, Love that skin tone! great!

adding one pic 35cron V1, Kauai.
f2.8. not bad for 50 year old lens. The focus also spot on from all my lens this time on my M9.








Jul 27, 2013 at 12:25 AM
rirakuma
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p.714 #5 · p.714 #5 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


^nice shots from the 28 cron Ron. I've been looking into that lens and I'm starting to feel that its probably the closest to a 21mm ZF that I can get on a Leica mount. I was thinking of getting an adapter for the Nikon-Leica mount just so I can use that lens but I can already imagine now it will be a pain to use regularly. I'll probably have to resort to the voigtlander ultron because the cron is so expensive.


Jul 27, 2013 at 12:41 AM
Bijltje
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p.714 #6 · p.714 #6 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


rirakuma wrote:
^nice shots from the 28 cron Ron. I've been looking into that lens and I'm starting to feel that its probably the closest to a 21mm ZF that I can get on a Leica mount. I was thinking of getting an adapter for the Nikon-Leica mount just so I can use that lens but I can already imagine now it will be a pain to use regularly. I'll probably have to resort to the voigtlander ultron because the cron is so expensive.


Did u try the 21 SE leica? Someone I know having used both zeiss 21 ZF and the 21 SE says the leica has the upper hand.



Jul 27, 2013 at 01:00 AM
Mitch Alland
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p.714 #7 · p.714 #7 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


adamdewilde wrote:
Yeah, but things like this take time to get right, once you're use to working a certain way..
Honestly though, I've not found myself in a situation where I could do a direct comparison [M240 vs M9]. Maybe I should borrow an M9 and do some side by side shots (although I'm sure someone on here will beat me to it, as I'm pretty busy the next couple of weeks)..., but then again I've never been good with these things.


Neither have I, and I couldn't get myself to do comparisons tests, so I understand that you're not dying to do that.



zhangyue wrote:
..About M240 color: I totally agree with people here that we need time to get familiar with particular camera. (I am the one always struggling, first with M9 and now with 6D ) The problem arise because we have our expectation/standard about M240ís file, we want it match M9. (In my case 6Dís file to match D700 or M9) This approach itself may be questionable.

Give or take, M9ís file usually have strong signature, you donít really need do anything to have that signature. M240 doesnít have that strong signature; it is more neutral, more like untouched raw file, raw
...Show more

There is truth in what you say, but up till now this look like an optimistic position, considering what's been coming out of this camera (I know, "early days") and mine is the pessimistic position. Within a year we'll know who's right. For Leica's sake, I hope that you are.



Ron, Jim Kasson joined the discussion in the thread I started on LUF, called
M9 Colors at Night ó Best Way to Shoot High ISO?. If you have any questions on the "ISO 600 + push in post" technique, you may want to ask him.

He's said a couple of interesting things (page 5 of the linked thread). One is that "one of the subtleties of "ISO-less" exposure is that not all raw processors push the same way...Lightroom Process Version 2010 works very differently than LR PV 2012. The PV 2010 Exposure control works like the ISO dial on the camera; it applies gain equally to all channels. In that regard, it works like the Exposure adjustment layer in PS...The LR PV 2012 Exposure control attempts to reproduce the soft clipped highlight behavior of film... I like the PV 2012 Exposure algorithm a lot. I have found the color shifts, although a theoretical issue, to be no problem at all in practice. Hard clipping causes its own color shifts, too. I don't like the hard clipping inherent in digital cameras, and always preferred the more forgiving behavior of film cameras, and consider the soft clipping of PV 2012 to be a beneficial sade effect of pushing in post."

Pushing with the M-Monochrom
I asked Jim how pushing might work in with the M-Monochrom in terms of where the breakpoint was between having better IQ from increasing ISO in-comera vs pushing in post, which for the M9 is at ISO 640. His response was, "If it's the same sensor and the only change is the removal of the Color Filter Array, then the ISO where the noise starts to fall off relative to pushing in post should be twice as high [as the M9], since the removal of the CFA makes the sensor twice as efficient at converting photons to electrons. Therefore, I'd expect that the point where you should stop increasing the ISO is 1250...If it's a different sensor, I don't know the answer, since I've never tested -- or even seen -- an M Monochrom."

M-Monochrom users might question the need for shooting ISO 1250 and pushing in post, since the M-Monchrom can produce good images at ISO 5,000 and ISO 10,000. The advantages would the same as for using the "ISO 640 + push in post" technique for the M9, i.e. producing less noise and more dynamic range, applying in post the minimum Exposure increase (the minimum "effective ISO") necessary for the look desired, and eliminating for the night shooting the need to change ISO once it's set at 1250. I'll have to try this when I resume shooting towards the end of next month when I'll be in Paris.


Now for some pictures. The following are all taken in Pak Nam Pran (a fishing village turning to tourism 20 minutes south of Hua Hin) with the Summilux-50 pre-ASPH, whose rendering I like better than that of the current ASPH version. In the past, I've done most of my street photography in B&W and with large depth of field. No 1 illustrates the sort of "Gaugain-type" color that I tried very successfully to get with the Ricoh GXR and the GXR M-Module (although the framing could have been different), while No. 5-6 point to a direction that I would like to go to with some of my pictures.



No. 1

Pak Nam Pran




No. 2

Pak Nam Pran




No. 3

Pak Nam Pran




No. 4

Pak Nam Pran




No. 5

Pak Nam Pran




No. 6

Pak Nam Pran



óMitch/Pak Nam Pran
Lanka Footsteps [M-Monochrom/Sri Lanka]



Jul 27, 2013 at 01:17 AM
charles.K
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p.714 #8 · p.714 #8 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Yes, this thread is on steroids!!
rirakuma, very nice! The scene does have the dark rainforest feel.
Luka, great set. Particularly #1, 3, 5 & 6. Nothing like having a Mercedes bogged in the sand . Also congratulations!!!
Ron, I am loving your recent images, and the PP'ing of them. They have an amazing sharpness, and color integrity to them.
Michael, wonderful shots with the 50 Lux!
Phil, lovely shot of your grand daughter.
Mitch, nice set.

I am in a quandry! I had my Sony RX1 drop on the lens two days ago in the office from a desk, and fortunately it is covered my insurance, where is will be replaced with the RX1R within the next week.

I had a call last night, that a new M240 black was finally available and had the weekend to make a decision by Monday. I am not sure about this now! I have my M9P Chrome on ebay, and see what kind of response it brings.

When the M240 was first announced, I put my name on the list, but now my gut is telling me to wait for about 6 months. If the response from ebay is good, I will no doubt go with the M240, but I feel reluctant more than ever to upgrade. I had no reservations about the M-M, nor the M9P. My low light preference if the Sony RX1R sensor, so in acquiring the M240 will mainly be for ergonomics, and I am sure with some practice the M240 files will be great.




Jul 27, 2013 at 01:41 AM
rscheffler
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p.714 #9 · p.714 #9 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Thanks Michael! Great colors! I believe I did some selective negative clarity on his face and arms in the close up shot.
Thanks Charles - the funny thing is I'm not really doing much to these files. No heavy lifting, etc. Trying to let the character of the lens stand on its own. Glad you're covered for the RX1. Yes, a bit of a quandary about the M240... I say go for it.
Mitch - I like the color and tension of the first image. Also the fourth. What is it about 5 and 6 drawing you in that direction? Thanks for linking to the LUF thread. I'll definitely check it out in the next couple days. I seem to recall reading that same comment elsewhere, or at least a similar one to that effect, about PV2012 vs. 2010. When the first unofficial M240 DNGs were released by that Dr. Dr. fellow, he had saved his adjustments to the files in PV2010, and wow, what a difference when it was switched to 2012. In 2010 some of his images had nasty highlight clipping that disappeared with 2012.

rirakuma wrote:
^nice shots from the 28 cron Ron. I've been looking into that lens and I'm starting to feel that its probably the closest to a 21mm ZF that I can get on a Leica mount. I was thinking of getting an adapter for the Nikon-Leica mount just so I can use that lens but I can already imagine now it will be a pain to use regularly. I'll probably have to resort to the voigtlander ultron because the cron is so expensive.


I agree with Robert, you should see about trying the 21/3.4. On paper it certainly rivals the Zeiss, but is a fraction of its size (though double the price). I think the 28 Ultron is a love/hate lens. If you're after technical perfection, you'll struggle with this lens, I think. I've only briefly tested it, but found it needed to be stopped down past f/8 to bring up the edges/corners to a reasonable level. It also has some focus shift, that might be irksome at more moderate apertures, though with the M240 you can live view. It's also lower contrast than the ZM 28/2.8 or Leica 28s. I'd have to find the test images again, but I wouldn't be surprised if it has purple fringing wide open and considerable CA, which many of the older, less corrected, Voigtlander lenses seem to have. 28mm is kind of a dry spot for the M system. The Ultron doesn't match what CV has produced recently with the 35/1.2 or 21/1.8. The ZM is also quirky with great central performance but weaker edges/corners. It's really only the Leica lenses that offer top technical performance, but at considerable cost. However, if you don't need great edge/corner performance for photographing planar scenes, then the Ultron might work. I think Michael (zhangyue) owned one for a while...

More with the 28 Cron - "want broom!":























Jul 27, 2013 at 02:11 AM
Mitch Alland
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p.714 #10 · p.714 #10 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


rscheffler wrote:
...Mitch - I like the color and tension of the first image. Also the fourth. What is it about 5 and 6 drawing you in that direction? Thanks for linking to the LUF thread. I'll definitely check it out in the next couple days. I seem to recall reading that same comment elsewhere, or at least a similar one to that effect, about PV2012 vs. 2010. When the first unofficial M240 DNGs were released by that Dr. Dr. fellow, he had saved his adjustments to the files in PV2010, and wow, what a difference when it was switched to 2012.
...Show more

Ron, your comments on my pictures are spot-on as far as I am concerned. The tension in the first and fourth images are what I have often done, and is what continues to interest me. The direction of Nos. 5 and 6 is more, at this stage, a matter of concept than of execution (obviously ) in these two pictures. What I am interest in is objects, through form, color and content expressing tension or referring to other psychological states, which you can find in some of the work of, for example, Ralph Gibson and William Eggleston ó the two of them in different ways from each other. That's where I'm in the thinking stage on this. All this also comes partially, for better or for worse from my reading and thinking about the TJ Clark book, Picasso and Truth, that I mentioned recently.

The color, look and processing of your pictures now is perfection for this genre. I like them a lot.

óMitch/Pak Nam Pran
Paris au rhythme de Basquiat and Other Poems [download link for book project]



Jul 27, 2013 at 02:38 AM
 

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adamdewilde
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p.714 #11 · p.714 #11 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


rirakuma wrote:
^nice shots from the 28 cron Ron. I've been looking into that lens and I'm starting to feel that its probably the closest to a 21mm ZF that I can get on a Leica mount. I was thinking of getting an adapter for the Nikon-Leica mount just so I can use that lens but I can already imagine now it will be a pain to use regularly. I'll probably have to resort to the voigtlander ultron because the cron is so expensive.



Mitch Alland - I like image #2

Ron - You know he's going to look into into sun.. Great captures though. And yea I was talking about the top of the trees. I did notice the more appealing soft bokeh/haze in the middle of the frame. I guess I don't shoot that lens enough to realize that's a characteristic.

rirakuma - From my experiance the 28cron has a way different drawing style, and the colors are not Zeiss at all.. The 21 SEM might be what you're looking for, but I don't have any personal experience with it, just what I've seen on flickr and here.



Jul 27, 2013 at 04:47 AM
rirakuma
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p.714 #12 · p.714 #12 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


^Ron & Adam, thanks for the input. I have to admit I've only briefly researched the 28 cron but I like what I see with the exception of the price. I'm not looking for Zeiss colors so thats not an issue. The Zeiss 21 feels like a Swiss Army knife of lens for me, it does landscapes, macro, pj and portraits with no issues (for me anyway). I've tried doing portraits with the WATE and the distortion is unacceptable. The SEM is also superb but I feel its more of a landscape lens with a slower aperture and not so great MFD. Maybe I will just get an adapter for the Zeiss but I know it won't be used anywhere near as much as it used to.


Jul 27, 2013 at 05:30 AM
rirakuma
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p.714 #13 · p.714 #13 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Bijltje wrote:
Did u try the 21 SE leica? Someone I know having used both zeiss 21 ZF and the 21 SE says the leica has the upper hand.


I've never tried the SEM but I love the samples I see from it. The thing is I like to use my 21 as an everyday lens including portraiture and I don't think I can get the composition I wan't with the SEM. The MFD for Zeiss 21mm ZF is 22cm and I usually take portraits wide open around 40-50cm. The MFD for 21 SEM is 70cm and I think I will feel very constricted using it.

This is an example of a shot taken with the 21 ZF. I was around 40cm away for this shot, if I took this with other wide angles I think her face would look really distorted.




Edited on Jul 27, 2013 at 05:53 AM · View previous versions



Jul 27, 2013 at 05:38 AM
rirakuma
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p.714 #14 · p.714 #14 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


charles.K wrote:
Yes, this thread is on steroids!!
rirakuma, very nice! The scene does have the dark rainforest feel.
Luka, great set. Particularly #1, 3, 5 & 6. Nothing like having a Mercedes bogged in the sand . Also congratulations!!!
Ron, I am loving your recent images, and the PP'ing of them. They have an amazing sharpness, and color integrity to them.
Michael, wonderful shots with the 50 Lux!
Phil, lovely shot of your grand daughter.
Mitch, nice set.

I am in a quandry! I had my Sony RX1 drop on the lens two days ago in the office from a desk, and fortunately it is covered my insurance,
...Show more

Charles, if you want to try out the M240 we should meet up for a hike . I've always wanted to try the M9 so maybe we can switch cameras during the hike? It says you live in Tallai so you should be pretty close to some of the local national park. I have Monday off if you're keen



Jul 27, 2013 at 05:45 AM
adamdewilde
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p.714 #15 · p.714 #15 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


rirakuma wrote:
I've never tried the SEM but I love the samples I see from it. The thing is I like to use my 21 as an everyday lens including portraiture and I don't think I can get the composition I wan't with the SEM. The MFD for Zeiss 21mm ZF is 22cm and I usually take portraits wide open around 40-50cm. The MFD for 21 SEM is 70cm and I think I will feel very constricted using it.

This is an example of a shot taken with the 21 ZF. I was around 40cm away for this shot, if I took this
...Show more

Yes, know exactly what you mean.. Owning all the ZE lenses, I found myself taking the 21 and 50mp out with me mostly.. And if I happen to have the 21 on camera, and wanted to take a portrait, I'd just do it exactly like you. And most of the time I loved the results. I don't think the 28cron is the lens for you, if this is what you're looking to do. I think the 28 Elmarit-asph is a better fit, if you're confident 28mm is the FL you want. Just my thoughts, but again, I haven't played with the 21 SEM either, so...



Jul 27, 2013 at 09:35 AM
adamdewilde
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p.714 #16 · p.714 #16 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Quick update.. I went out to buy another card for the M240 even though I have several. And the only cards they had around were the older extreme cards (45/mbps) so I figured heck why not, I have the ultra's and they're slow, and I have the extreme pro and they're slow (60mbps), so I figured why not just try another 16gb card, good to have on vacation where I don't bring my laptop anyway.
BTW I have like 6 cards, 4 16gb and 2 32gb..... All "slow" on the M240.

Now with the new card, the start up to photo taking has come down from 5 one-thousand to 3 one-thousand. So now it's three seconds from startup, instead of five seconds from startup.. Which believe me you, is a damn welcome improvement. I won'der if I should jump ship from Sandisk to something else?

Also, weird thing I've noticed.. happens only once and a while.. But take a look (this is what prompted me to go buy a new SD card):












So basically when I zoom into some images, the color goes out of whack.. Not only does the color shift, but it looks like it adds lens flare?! Actually cooler looking the zoomed in way



Jul 27, 2013 at 10:47 AM
rscheffler
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p.714 #17 · p.714 #17 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Adam, is that color shift only evident in the in-camera review, or also once you've downloaded the image? If the latter, I'd be concerned...


Jul 27, 2013 at 12:44 PM
rirakuma
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p.714 #18 · p.714 #18 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


^This happens in my camera too, it only affects in camera review. The file itself is fine once uploaded and viewed through the comp. By the way a member jaapv from the l-camera forum says he gets a 1s startup using Lexar 600x cards. I have the 400x and it takes about 2 seconds to start.

Edited on Jul 27, 2013 at 01:23 PM · View previous versions



Jul 27, 2013 at 12:50 PM
rirakuma
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p.714 #19 · p.714 #19 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Just for fun I thought I'd share some M files with you guys if anybody is interested.

Some previews of the files (after some quick WB and exposure corrections):


DNG 1


DNG 2


DNG 3


DNG 4


DNG 5



Jul 27, 2013 at 01:16 PM
adamdewilde
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p.714 #20 · p.714 #20 · Leica M/X/T/S/Q Picture Thread


Yeah exactly as rirakuma mentioned. I'm sure it's something that will be fixed w/firmware.

Just an FYI I've stumbled upon a few forums that mention the camera can startup and is ready to shoot in .5 for normal shooting, and 1second for liveview shooting... I think this is absolute rubbish, but I was willing to try, so I ordered a bunch of different brand top end cards, so we'll see how startup to shoot is delayed once I get the cards in.

I finally looked through some of my old M9 files, and I came to the conclusion that at ISO 800 both cameras have the same noise, maybe the slightest win goes to the M240... But at 1600+ you can definitely see that the M240 has a really clear advantage. However, I don't do much noise processing in LR, if anyone wants to bestow upon me, a secret formula, I'd be willing to try, as I have two files take at the same place, so it'll be easy for me to test noise at iso 800 with NR software implemented.
Oh and BTW, there was some mention that CCD produces "organic randomized noise" while CMOS produces "static patterned noise" I was pixel peeping for the better half of an hour, and on several photos, I don't see this to be true (mind you, I was looking at ISO800 files from 4 cameras M240, M9, D4 and the H3DII-39 was viewed on iso 400 if I'm not wrong [but could have been 800], and if I'm not wrong it's a CCD sensor in the Hassy-39 as well correct?)


BTW, a while back I posted an image from the same mural, but to be honest, it's not a fair comparison, as the lighting, and distance to subject are completely different. The M9p was in tungsten and the M240 shot below was natural light.


M240 50/1.4 @ 800 ISO








Jul 27, 2013 at 01:46 PM
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