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Archive 2010 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP

  
 
Yakim Peled
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Zeiss-85mm-f-1.4-ZE-Planar-Lens-Review.aspx

I must confess I expected more. The PZ review is better but it was carried out on a lower resolution APS-C D200 so it's not exactly comparable.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.




Mar 16, 2010 at 06:55 AM
MichaD
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Yea, not exceptional optically. But the mechanics of the Z* lenses always makes me drool.
Will be interesting what Sigma brings to the table with their 85/1.4 optically.



Mar 16, 2010 at 07:09 AM
HerbChong
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


i see sharper results from my Zeiss 85/1.4 over my Nikkor 85/1.4 when stopped down. whether this is because of better contrast or absolute resolution isn't relevant to me. i don't use the Zeiss wide open very much unless i am shooting on a tripod whereas almost all of my shooting with the Nikkor is at or near wide open.

Herb...

Yakim Peled wrote:
http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Zeiss-85mm-f-1.4-ZE-Planar-Lens-Review.aspx




Mar 16, 2010 at 12:11 PM
tsdevine
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP



I wonder if the test accounted for focus shift?? That could wreak havoc with resolution numbers.

-Tim



Mar 16, 2010 at 12:29 PM
Makten
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


I see the same thing with my 35/2 ZF. At 100% crop, pixel-to-pixel sharpness is less good than many other lenses. But as soon as you scale it down or look at it from a more normal distance, things turn out better for the Zeiss than the higher resolving lenses.
This is a very good reason not to judge lenses from MTF or small crops only. You just can't see how it draws, which is very important for the impression of sharpness at a more normal scale.

Maximum resolving power is one of the least interesting properties of a lens, to me.

Edit: Look at the example with the branches, and the (center?) crop at the top left. Click back an forth between the Zeiss and Canon f/2 settings. You might see that the Canon has slightly higher sharpness, right? But then look at the thickest branch/trunk. What's happeing there? Suddenly the Zeiss looks very different, with much higher (local) contrast. This is probably what you'll notice as "3D" if you scale them down. And it's there even at f/1.4, if you ignore the fringing.



Mar 16, 2010 at 12:44 PM
tsdevine
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


tsdevine wrote:
I wonder if the test accounted for focus shift?? That could wreak havoc with resolution numbers.

Edit: Guess I should read the review before posting, looks like focus shift came up in the review.

-Tim




Mar 16, 2010 at 12:59 PM
Grenache
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Reviews there are generally very helpful, but he sort of disavowed his approach and inexperience with manual lenses. He thought that he had covered for those but could not rule them out.

I also wonder what the distance was for the target. The ZE 85 that I used was very soft from MFD to about 5 or 6 feet. By 8 feet out to infinity, it was great. Focus shift was also really tough in the close ranges. Not sure why that is the case, but it was annoying that at distances where you can best differentiate features in the viewfinder, the shift was high.

The C/Y performs better in my opinion from MFD to mid range and is sharper than I remember the ZE being until you either stop down or get out to 8-10 feet to subject.

Jim



Mar 16, 2010 at 01:07 PM
edwardkaraa
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Grenache wrote:
The C/Y performs better in my opinion from MFD to mid range and is sharper than I remember the ZE being until you either stop down or get out to 8-10 feet to subject.

Jim


I found the same thing with the 50/1.4 but the Contax was also sharper at infinity wide open to just before f/2.8



Mar 16, 2010 at 01:14 PM
Jeffrey
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


I'm considering the ZE 85. I've been reading the reviews and stated opinions of all the Zeiss Zx lenses here for a while. It appears that most all determinations are based on tests at larger apertures, or wide open, and state that performance increased at smaller apertures. I take it to mean that many of the 'issues' that folks have with these lenses is only at the wider apertures. I usually shoot between f8 and f16 sometimes going to full stopdown (landscape, architecture, etc.). Am I to expect better results than so many tests have shown at my preferred apertures? I've never seen a review of a lens set to f11 or f16.


Mar 16, 2010 at 02:39 PM
Makten
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Jeffrey wrote:
I'm considering the ZE 85. I've been reading the reviews and stated opinions of all the Zeiss Zx lenses here for a while. It appears that most all determinations are based on tests at larger apertures, or wide open, and state that performance increased at smaller apertures. I take it to mean that many of the 'issues' that folks have with these lenses is only at the wider apertures. I usually shoot between f8 and f16 sometimes going to full stopdown (landscape, architecture, etc.). Am I to expect better results than so many tests have shown at my preferred apertures?
...Show more

Then you'd probably be happier with a much slower lens. What's there to be had from an f/1.4 lens at f/11, that can't be gotten from an f/4 lens?



Mar 16, 2010 at 02:58 PM
Jeffrey
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


You're right there, but that doesn't exactly answer my question. Most quality hi-end lenses are fast anyway. I don't see Zeiss offering the same lens in two speeds.....

I may sometimes use it wide open, just rarely.



Mar 16, 2010 at 03:01 PM
Lotusm50
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Makten wrote:
I see the same thing with my 35/2 ZF. At 100% crop, pixel-to-pixel sharpness is less good than many other lenses. But as soon as you scale it down or look at it from a more normal distance, things turn out better for the Zeiss than the higher resolving lenses.



My experience with the ZF 35/2 is different. It has remarkable sharpness at the pixel level. I am in fact amazed how sharp it is at the pixel level when I saw my first images from the lens. The difference is not subtle either. In printing it also requires substantially less sharpening than many other lenses (including other Zeiss lenses). This is one crisp lens.




Mar 16, 2010 at 08:44 PM
Makten
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Lotusm50 wrote:
My experience with the ZF 35/2 is different. It has remarkable sharpness at the pixel level.


I forgot to say at large apertures, which is the context where the 85 also looks "bad".



Mar 16, 2010 at 11:13 PM
philber
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Jeffrey wrote:
I'm considering the ZE 85. I've been reading the reviews and stated opinions of all the Zeiss Zx lenses here for a while. It appears that most all determinations are based on tests at larger apertures, or wide open, and state that performance increased at smaller apertures. I take it to mean that many of the 'issues' that folks have with these lenses is only at the wider apertures. I usually shoot between f8 and f16 sometimes going to full stopdown (landscape, architecture, etc.). Am I to expect better results than so many tests have shown at my preferred apertures?
...Show more
Jeffrey, I use a ZE 85, not because it is a f:1.4 lens, as I never use it wide open, but because of its drawing style, which is much more important for me than its absolute level of sharpness (copyright@Makten). Although in my experience, it peaks at f:8.0 rather than stopped down even more.


Edited on Mar 17, 2010 at 12:50 AM · View previous versions



Mar 17, 2010 at 12:47 AM
philber
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Lotusm50 wrote:
My experience with the ZF 35/2 is different. It has remarkable sharpness at the pixel level. I am in fact amazed how sharp it is at the pixel level when I saw my first images from the lens. The difference is not subtle either. In printing it also requires substantially less sharpening than many other lenses (including other Zeiss lenses). This is one crisp lens.




What Lotus writes



Mar 17, 2010 at 12:48 AM
Jeffrey
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Thanks all. I just ordered the 85 ZE. Then I'll have the 21, 35 & 85.

I recently posted some new ZE35 images on the ZE image thread.



Mar 17, 2010 at 02:38 PM
joekraft
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


I have to disagree. I have many wide open shots now from the 35/2 where the sharpness is notable, and more sharp than the 35L. Or let me put it this way. I've never gone "wow" looking at a wide open shot of a 35L in reference to it's sharpness. I do that all the time with the Zeiss now.

Makten wrote:
I forgot to say at large apertures, which is the context where the 85 also looks "bad".




Mar 17, 2010 at 02:43 PM
Makten
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


joekraft wrote:
I have to disagree. I have many wide open shots now from the 35/2 where the sharpness is notable, and more sharp than the 35L. Or let me put it this way. I've never gone "wow" looking at a wide open shot of a 35L in reference to it's sharpness. I do that all the time with the Zeiss now.


I've not had the 35L, but most Nikon 35 mm lenses, and they are all high resolving at f/2, but does not at all have the local contrast that the Zeiss has. I bet the old 35/1.4 has better pure resolving power than the Distagon, but yet it looks like crap when you compare them (yes I've had it, but not at the same time as the Zeiss).

What I mean is that the Distagon is not impressive when it comes to the smallest details at wide apertures, compared to most primes. They may be equal or better, but seldom lower resolving. But, at lower frequencies of a few pixels, none of those I've used and tried can beat the Zeiss. And that's the important part to me.



Mar 17, 2010 at 05:39 PM
philber
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


Jeffrey wrote:
Thanks all. I just ordered the 85 ZE. Then I'll have the 21, 35 & 85.



Congratulations on your new lens, Jeffrey!



Mar 17, 2010 at 11:30 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Zeiss 85/1.4@TDP


I have the C/Y 85 f/1.4 and I know it's not rated very highly wide open, but I actually find it reasonably good and much improved even at f/1.7, although you have to be careful of the high CA. Once you get to f/2.8 it''s tack sharp. From what I've seen the ZF/ZE 85 is similar and not worth updating to. It's at it's worst at or near mfd wide open.

Here's 2 shot's wide open
http://www.dphoto.us/forumphotos/data/2221/IMG_11860.jpg
http://www.dphoto.us/forumphotos/data/2221/IMG_11861.jpg



Mar 19, 2010 at 08:19 AM
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