The craziest thing about that is his power level: 7.0
It does seem to be a monolight, but that's a crazy amount of buttons and displays for a mono. Still, definitely not impossible. Hensel needs something wicked to compete with the other big 3.
The real question is "At what flashpower is what rate achieved". Don't expect 31fps at 500WS that's 45,000 watts - not going to happen. I would suspect maybe 10-20WS per pop - 300 to 600 watts. No magic here but maybe a good product. Remember - a $29 Radio Shack strobe light can do the same thing at about 1WS per flash.
Paul Buff wrote:
The real question is "At what flashpower is what rate achieved". Don't expect 31fps at 500WS that's 45,000 watts - not going to happen. I would suspect maybe 10-20WS per pop - 300 to 600 watts. No magic here but maybe a good product. Remember - a $29 Radio Shack strobe light can do the same thing at about 1WS per flash.
Einstein has all the ingredients to do this.
On the "Euro" scale, 7.0 equals 900 joules (w/s).
However, 7.0 was shown just at the 8 fps rate.
5.0 was the power setting at 31 fps, which is still a mind numbing 225 joules (or as Paul calls it, "true w/s")!
From my experience Hensel has been very accurate and consistent with their power scale ratings. But Paul could be correct in assuming that 225 ws is divided by 31, similar to speedlights in stroboscopic mode. Even still, at 8 fps that's a phenomenal 112 w/s per shot! Can Einstein do that too? Comparing with the D4, at 18 fps this unit would probably come in somewhere around 25 w/s per shot based on this premise. Hard to tell if this pack or self contained from what is shown.
I'd also be interested in how it synchronizes at these speeds.
The teaser appears to be a calculated effort to generate buzz for an interesting new product. I hope they are not departing from their consistent ratings of the past or over hyping a stroboscopic feature. Either of these would fall flat IMO.
Carmen Miranda wrote:
On the "Euro" scale, 7.0 equals 900 joules (w/s).
However, 7.0 was shown just at the 8 fps rate.
5.0 was the power setting at 31 fps, which is still a mind numbing 225 joules (or as Paul calls it, "true w/s")!
From my experience Hensel has been very accurate and consistent with their power scale ratings. But Paul could be correct in assuming that 225 ws is divided by 31, similar to speedlights in stroboscopic mode. Even still, at 8 fps that's a phenomenal 112 w/s per shot! Can Einstein do that too? Comparing with the D4, at 18 fps this unit would probably come in somewhere around 25 w/s per shot based on this premise. Hard to tell if this pack or self contained from what is shown.
I'd also be interested in how it synchronizes at these speeds.
The teaser appears to be a calculated effort to generate buzz for an interesting new product. I hope they are not departing from their consistent ratings of the past or over hyping a stroboscopic feature. Either of these would fall flat IMO.
Euro scale - 10 = 6400WS, 9 = 3200WS, 8= 1600, 7= 800, 6 = 400, 5 = 200, etc.
No way it does 200WS 31 times a second. That's 6200 output watts and about 12,000 AC line watts. Got an outlet the can supply 12,000 watts? The US limit is 1800W. Does Hensel have a coolling system that can cool 12,000 watts inside a shoe box. A lot of uniformed junk science and knee jerk conclusions here.
I'd suggest a better review of actual specs and performance. Amazing the conclusions people can draw from a U Tube video that says nothing of substance.
I can be wrong now and then, but this is ridiculous.
WS and Joules are different expressions of the same thing. I say True WS to remove any question.
Also, some European companies deviate from the core EU rating and adjust it such the "10" is not 6400WS, rather it can refer to the maximum power of the particular light they are using. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Bron does this, or allows you to do this. Dumb idea because it destroys the whole meaning of the standard.
Sort of like a Guitar amp that goes from zero to 10 . . . 10 is 2W on a little amp and 10,000 watts on a gigantic one.
Paul Buff wrote:
No way it does 200WS 31 times a second.
Paul,
For the record this is not what I was suggesting. I'm thinking, like you, that 200 w/s (5.0 on the Euro scale) would be divided by 31 fps. Even so that equals 6.45 w/s per shot, which I'm sure you would agree is not only more realistic, but pretty amazing as well.
But of course this is all based on pure speculation, but then so is trying to figure out when Einstein will be shipping. Should be fun to see how both come out in the end.
Just for the (pre) record the total capacitor power is about 500Ws. IGBT control uses the ascending part of the discharge curve. Press release to be expected in about a fortnight.
Paul Buff wrote:
... Also, some European companies deviate from the core EU rating and adjust it such the "10" is not 6400WS, rather it can refer to the maximum power of the particular light they are using. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Bron does this, or allows you to do this. Dumb idea because it destroys the whole meaning of the standard.
If D4 is any indication, then Profoto is similar to Bron: "10" means full power, and you dial it down from there.
Paul Buff wrote:
No magic here but maybe a good product. Remember - a $29 Radio Shack strobe light can do the same thing at about 1WS per flash.
Einstein has all the ingredients to do this.
Paul Buff wrote:
I'd suggest a better review of actual specs and performance. Amazing the conclusions people can draw from a U Tube video that says nothing of substance.
Paul Buff wrote:
This one is believable and can be done with Einstein by shooting motor drive rates. Cyber Sync can only do 13 fps though.
What's the deal? This thread isn't about the einstein, or the cybersync, or any of your products. Why are you trying to turn this into a thread about your products instead of Hensel's? Aren't there enough threads on here about PCB stuff?
Furthermore, you bashing a product sight-unseen, seems a bit ridiculous/jealous/snobbish. Being "amazed" by people making conclusions from youtube videos (i.e. a video of something that actually exists)...but you continue to push CAD drawings on people and inflated specs for products that never make it to production.
Please, oh please, can we not turn this into "PCB is bullied/PCB is a victim/PCB is better than any other product" thread, and can we just leave this to discussion about the HENSEL product that the OP discussed?
From what I have briefly looked at, Bron gives you the option of "classic" EU numbers, or numbers re full power. For me, this destroys the base value of the EU Number system. So if you have an 800WS unit and a 400WS unit and dial them both to 9, one is doing 400WS and one is doing 200WS. In the classic EU Number system one would say 5 (400WS) and the other would say 4 (200WS) and you would know what power they are relative to each other. Congrats Europe - you have made a $10,000 system act like a Fender Guitar amp!
In Cyber Commander we use the classic EU Number system, so if your have four lights with four WS ratings, and set them all to EU 4, they are all 200WS and all produce the same amount of light.
Back to the magic strobe that started this thread, assuming the number "5" refers to full power = 500WS? then "5" is 1/32 power = 15.6 WS, not 200WS. 15.6WS times 31 shots per second is 484 output watts . . . this is possible. Not hard at all to achieve by an IGBT controlled flash. Same formula . . . "7" at 8 flashes per second is 1/8 power = 62.5WS, equals 500 output watts. Isn't math amazing?
No miracle or breakthrough here . . . just a 31Hz 15.6WS disco strobe.
What's the deal? This thread isn't about the einstein, or the cybersync, or any of your products. Why are you trying to turn this into a thread about your products instead of Hensel's? Aren't there enough threads on here about PCB stuff?
Furthermore, you bashing a product sight-unseen, seems a bit ridiculous/jealous/snobbish. Being "amazed" by people making conclusions from youtube videos (i.e. a video of something that actually exists)...but you continue to push CAD drawings on people and inflated specs for products that never make it to production.
Please, oh please, can we not turn this into "PCB is bullied/PCB is a victim/PCB is better than any other product" thread, and can we just leave this to discussion about the HENSEL product that the OP discussed?
Thank you!! I was beginning to think I was the only one who get's tired of this. Can you imagine someone posting on an image thread always saying, " yeah, I could take that photo just as good..."
What's the deal? This thread isn't about the einstein, or the cybersync, or any of your products. Why are you trying to turn this into a thread about your products instead of Hensel's? Aren't there enough threads on here about PCB stuff?
Furthermore, you bashing a product sight-unseen, seems a bit ridiculous/jealous/snobbish. Being "amazed" by people making conclusions from youtube videos (i.e. a video of something that actually exists)...but you continue to push CAD drawings on people and inflated specs for products that never make it to production.
Please, oh please, can we not turn this into "PCB is bullied/PCB is a victim/PCB is better than any other product" thread, and can we just leave this to discussion about the HENSEL product that the OP discussed?
Ever see a Paul C. Buff thread that didn't do exactly the reverse . . . become a thread about some other light? I did not introduce any commercialism here any more than if someone said Alienbees are great . . . they perform magic, and someone else (a competitor for example) said "that's BS - no magic here . . . brand x can do the same thing . . . what is claimed, or believed to be claimed is wrong and misunderstood."
That's not hijacking a thread . . . it's correcting bad information in a thread based on a fantasy misunderstanding of the original topic content or the meaning of EU numbers, or believing in the physically impossible because they doesn't understand what it's actually about.
Your'e welcome (to the world of accurate scientific analysis).
Brent Ward wrote:
Sure can - see it regularly. Particularly if poster 1 says his shot is magic and revolutionary and poster 2 says "No magic here . . . anyone can take that shot". By the way, you are in the 6% that would rather I not post here, not in the 88% that think I should because I supply information they want to see. Check the pool - you're not the ONLY one, you're one of the few.
