5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

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Archive 2009 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Astragony
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p.1 #1 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Am I crazy?

I was considering getting some Leica glass for my 5DmkII but now I am considering just selling the whole Canon stuff and getting a used M8 and a couple of lens.
For the kind of pictures I like totake (snapshots with style) the M8 seems perfect.
Was thinking maybe an M8 with a nice 50 and a 28, maybe add a 90 later.
I don't want external viewfinders and such

Again, am I crazy?!?

Jul 07, 2009 at 09:43 PM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #2 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Only you know gear will help you get the reulst you want. No-one else can tell you that you are crazy!

Jul 07, 2009 at 10:10 PM

dave chilvers
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p.1 #3 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Astragony wrote:
Am I crazy?

I was considering getting some Leica glass for my 5DmkII but now I am considering just selling the whole Canon stuff and getting a used M8 and a couple of lens.
For the kind of pictures I like totake (snapshots with style) the M8 seems perfect.
Was thinking maybe an M8 with a nice 50 and a 28, maybe add a 90 later.
I don't want external viewfinders and such

Again, am I crazy?!?

The Leica range finder cameras have that special feel and if I could afford to run one side by side with my Canon gear I would jump at it. they certainly lend themselves to certain type of photography but IMHO are not really a replacement for a DSLR.

Jul 07, 2009 at 11:57 PM

bigreen505
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p.1 #4 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Using Leica R glass on your 5D will help you get closer to the Leica look, but the shooting experience is no different than using your Canon lenses. The M8, or any rangefinder is a different shooting experience entirely. For snapshots with style (LOVE THAT) the M8 is a better tool for the job, largely because of how people react to it. The Canon is very versatile and the M8 is quite limited, but if what you do fits within the limits of the M8, there is nothing like it.

Don't be put off by the 10 mp sensor, there is a lot more to life than numbers.

I am in a similar situation and recently sold my DMR because it no longer fit my needs. Right now I have decided to pass on the M8 in favor of the more flexible Sony, but as soon as I can afford to own more than one digital camera system I will own an M8. Until that a rangerfinder and film take care of my snapshots with style.

Jul 08, 2009 at 12:05 AM

TWoK
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p.1 #5 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Yes, you are crazy.

Jul 08, 2009 at 12:16 AM

TWoK
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p.1 #6 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

bigreen505 wrote:
Don't be put off by the 10 mp sensor, there is a lot more to life than numbers.

Right, 10 mp is plenty, unfortunately the 1.3X is not, nor is the requirement for IR filters for every lens.

Jul 08, 2009 at 12:17 AM

JimBuchanan
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p.1 #7 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Astragony wrote:
I was considering getting some Leica glass for my 5DmkII but now I am considering just selling the whole Canon stuff and getting a used M8 and a couple of lens......Was thinking maybe an M8 with a nice 50 and a 28, maybe add a 90 later.

Again, am I crazy?!?

Well, I'm not giving up the flexibility of the 5D and a few good primes, but I do have a 28 and 50mm lens, and even a 90mm, just in case I happen to acquire a M8. I even thought of selling the 90 to make the barrier of entry a little less expensive. Another way is to look at Zeiss ZM lenses, and/or consolidate the 28 and 50 into a single 35mm lens.

It is true that the 1.3 crop effectively increases DOF, by about a stop, compared to full frame, and the higher ISO noise costs about a stops worth of DOF, but a good f/1.4 lens will get you back in the ballpark of fast shooting style.

Jul 08, 2009 at 12:41 AM

makron
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p.1 #8 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Go for it! You can always switch back without much pain ....

Jul 08, 2009 at 01:19 AM

Spyro P.
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p.1 #9 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Hey Astragony, I had a look at your flickr, it looks like you mostly work with models for set up portrait/commercial type shots with strobes and shallow dof? For that type of stuff I dont thing it really makes a difference to be honest, whatever camera with a fast lens will do. You can take your time to focus & compose, the ISO is low, the light is controlled, I dont see how size or weight can be an issue. Many people would use medium format for this type of photography for less dof and a bigger file to work with. I'd say get whatever camera inspires you the most, if its a Leica then Leica be it. By looking at your gallery I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "snapshots with style".

Jul 08, 2009 at 01:39 AM

Astragony
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p.1 #10 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Spyro P. wrote:
Hey Astragony, I had a look at your flickr, it looks like you mostly work with models for set up portrait/commercial type shots with strobes and shallow dof? For that type of stuff I dont thing it really makes a difference to be honest, whatever camera with a fast lens will do. You can take your time to focus & compose, the ISO is low, the light is controlled, I dont see how size or weight can be an issue. Many people would use medium format for this type of photography for less dof and a bigger file to work with. I'd say get whatever camera inspires you the most, if its a Leica then Leica be it. By looking at your gallery I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "snapshots with style".

Haha, those pics are mainly my commercial stuff, the pics I love are... Snapshots with style as I call them, like table shots and such.

I have a few examples in my stream:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Jul 08, 2009 at 08:42 AM

forestmage
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p.1 #11 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Honestly for what you are doing, and this is some nice work, an M8 might be just perfect for you. Give it a go!

Jul 08, 2009 at 02:48 PM

Pavel
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p.1 #12 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

I was in a similar situation as you a little while ago. My D700 and a bunch of nice Nikon glass. But I was bored and tired of the same ol'. The same ol' megapixel peeping and focus. The same ol look to my images.

I jumped .... and got the M8 while the getting is temporarily good. When the old stock of the M8 dries up - most of us can't afford full Leica rates.
I am very happy with my decision. Leica and rangefinder life is different and requires more ... what is the word .... "input" from the photographer. I don't have any issues with my level of output from DSLRs ... except for the sameness of it all - but this style of shooting is more demanding - and more rewarding. More like "real" photography ... to me.

The D700 and the 5D are both superb imagers ... but while the Leica sensor gives very very different results - it is eaqualy good. Nothing is as crisp except Medium format backs (which I can barely afford to rent - never mind buy)
The image quality is different but hold its own against ANY dslr. It upsizes better than any other cam so dont' get swayed by some of these who always chase more pixels.

Mostly, however, it is about the rangefinder experience. Some hate it and don't know what to do with the limitations. Some love it. Me? It was time for a change. I feel like I've found new life.

YMMV.

Jul 08, 2009 at 03:02 PM

Pavel
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p.1 #13 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

one more thing. The Leicas from the film days were the most rugged long lasting there was ... right up there with other bricks like the Nikon F.
The M8 is leica's first foray into digital and I think it is not at the same level yet as Canon and Nikon in some ways. Reliability in particular. I have done much research into it and I think that they have more funky issues that other brands. There is the green line issue in a few cams and stories of shutter failures that despite the Leica acolytes discomfort with the mention of - are a real issue.
It does not dent my enthusiasm one bit ... but something to mention, I though.

Jul 08, 2009 at 03:13 PM

dave chilvers
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p.1 #14 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Pavel wrote:
one more thing. The Leicas from the film days were the most rugged long lasting there was ... right up there with other bricks like the Nikon F.
The M8 is leica's first foray into digital and I think it is not at the same level yet as Canon and Nikon in some ways. Reliability in particular. I have done much research into it and I think that they have more funky issues that other brands. There is the green line issue in a few cams and stories of shutter failures that despite the Leica acolytes discomfort with the mention of - are a real issue.
It does not dent my enthusiasm one bit ... but something to mention, I though.

If Leica bring out a FF 20million pixel M camera with the technology that matches my 5d2 it will be a killer. I won`t be able to afford it let alone the £2k a time for lenses but I can dream

They are special for sure and I often sit and remember my last M being an M6ttl, 21 asph, 50 sumi and 90asph apo, all pocketable, no back or front focus and felt like carved from solid.

I`ve still got an old 1C(or maybe it`s a 2C) with collapsible 50 elmar, separate range finder window that (the last time I tried it maybe 5 years ago) was still working 100% and took colour slides to equal many a modern camera. They don`t make them like that anymore

Jul 08, 2009 at 05:22 PM

geoffreyg
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p.1 #15 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

You aren't nuts. The issue which we are all stumbling with is the new found ease of taking many many shots.... in fact, too many. The sheer volume (hard drives x # = ?) and this then raises the question of how to get more quality?

The M8, and MFDB as well, aim to involve you more - and are slower as a result. A bit more thoughtful you become.

Is this an advantage? Not if comparing to the prior camera of choice - how can it be? Its purpose is totally different. For me, the joy is in the number of "keepers" - they just seem to be higher with the M8 than with a DSLR. can't do everything my son's D20 does, so I'm glad he's happy. But I like where it takes me, and there are special images and ideas as a result.

You are not nuts. The market may be, Leica's pricing may be, but there is something there.

Jul 09, 2009 at 01:13 AM

Spyro P.
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p.1 #16 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

I guess try/rent/borrow it is the correct answer.

Jul 09, 2009 at 02:28 AM

Rob Chisholm
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p.1 #17 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

The Leica M8 is a wonderful camera! I have had a 5D2 and D700, and sold both. I invested in some nice (used) glass and could not be happier. I have used the M8 for about 2 years, and have owned 3, buying and selling, trying new cameras (5D2 and D700) but always coming back to the M8. And, if your photographic style is amenable, manually focusing, manually setting shutter speed -- well, that's just plain fun!

A mint condition M8 can be purchased for $2400-2500 and many come and go on getdpi.com forums.

The 35 1.4 summilux, the Canon 50 mm 1.2 LTM rangefinder lens and the 75 1.4 Summilux are sweeeet fast lenses that would favor your shooting style.

For me, the ability to carry all my Leica gear in a small bag is a real plus. The camera IQ is great at low ISO -- the high ISO performance, or lack thereof, being the only real negative to the camera, compared to the new Canon and Nikon SLRs. The UV/IR filter is a nonissue, really. Protects the front element. I use the filters and do not have any gripes.

One real benefit of the M8 is the lack of the AA filter. I really have never had any problems with moire, and the sharpness of the dng files right out of the camera is amazing. I almost never use unsharp masking, and sometimes add a little high pass for pop. --Rob

Jul 09, 2009 at 04:02 AM

dasrocket
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p.1 #18 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

forestmage wrote:
Honestly for what you are doing, and this is some nice work, an M8 might be just perfect for you. Give it a go!

+1! Your work screams LEICA M :-)

Jul 09, 2009 at 04:44 AM

molson
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p.1 #19 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

Wait for the M9. If the recent rumours are true, it will have the 5D Mark II's sensor.

Jul 09, 2009 at 03:28 PM

Astragony
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p.1 #20 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

molson wrote:
Wait for the M9. If the recent rumours are true, it will have the 5D Mark II's sensor.
That's a pretty intense rumor!

Haha, I need to find someone that has one so I can really try it out.

Actually my major turnoff is the crop factor, it's really a pain.

I could live with just an M8 and a 35 lux, I have a crapload of gear to sell (not just body and lens, but flashes radio transmitters and all).

Gotta think this over, I see used M8s for about 2200 euros here, it's not so bad...

Jul 09, 2009 at 09:26 PM

Pavel
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p.1 #21 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

I've got mixed feelings about the 1.3 crop ... but mostly I like it. I really like that the 50 is a 65, which to me is the perfect long end on a rangefinder. 75 is about the same but you pay big bucks for it.

The 25 is my 35 and I may get the 28 which becomes 40 basically. For one thing the crop factor gives you frame lines up to 24 which are visible fairly easily, whereas the 4M-P is only good with 35 in the same way.

So basically it is easy to substitute one focal length down and get an equivalency with more depth of field.
I works for me.

If you drop by down here in Raleigh ... you can take my for a spin.

Jul 09, 2009 at 09:42 PM

Astragony
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p.1 #22 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

that aint really a close drop

So yeah, I think the only lens I would need is a nice 28.

Jul 09, 2009 at 11:19 PM

thrice
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p.1 #23 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

molson wrote:
Wait for the M9. If the recent rumours are true, it will have the 5D Mark II's sensor.

Haha are you serious!? I suppose all it will need is a new micro-lens design and no AA filter and they could use it... I'll be selling my 5DMarkII and all my lenses and getting the M9 if that is true. If I can get a rangefinder that takes equivalent shots to my SLR I'd switch in a heartbeat. The one thing that might hold *me* back is if they don't implement live-view, simply for the fact that I use it for checking hyperfocus and ND grad orientation in landscapes.

Jul 09, 2009 at 11:36 PM

Pavel
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p.1 #24 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

I've had to fight this built in control type of feeling inherited from years of slr shooting (or just my personality?

) where my approach has been to try to frame in the viewfinder (100 percent please) and see exactly what it is that I want. No this is a transition for me. what you see and what you get is very approximate.

I really do like being able to see around the sides of the framelines, I didn't realise how different that can be and how it may affect shooting style. The slr is like looking down a telescope. The rangefinder is more like the way it feels to simply be looking at things the same way as we are accustomed to and imagining (seeing in this case) a scene sliced out of that view. I don't want to overstate it but it for me really feels different from the ground up - about how one sees the world.

It is odd though that the framelines are so approximate. One type of coverage close up ... another farther away. So now 32... 34 ... 37 hardly a difference to me.

Od course keep in mind that these are the comments of someone very new to rangefinder life. They are no subsitute for slr's ... but I've found it a surprisingly pleasant adjunct to one

Jul 10, 2009 at 11:22 AM

Pavel
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p.1 #25 · 5DmkII kit for a leica M8 kit

I for one would not want a sensor that looks like anything remotely similar to the 5D. The 5D sensor is fantastic, but then the M9 would give fantastic images (maybe - since the flange distance is so different) that look "me too", the same as every other cam. The M8's images are very different, right now ... and I really like that look - but especially value the choice without having to buy a a medium format back after I sell my cars.

But I think that the thought of canon pairing up is unlikely. It just seems like too much R&D for canon with no payoff - and why would they help, perhaps, make a competitor successful and take the focus off of their own products? I think that this rumor is simply a wet dream of those in the Leica camp that are pixel peeping chasers of more for mores sake. They have them there too. In spades.

Jul 10, 2009 at 11:36 AM


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