PORSCHE917 wrote:
Naurescapes.net now has available a bottom plate machined from 6061 aluminum that you connect with a bolt to the base plate of Gitzo systematic tripods.
It seems that there are two different issues being discusssed. There is nothing wrong with my top plate; it was simply not tightened properly. Others may have a different problem. Now if the Gitzo had any sense, they would either ship the tripod with bolts properly tightened or very loose, or design a better plate that does not fall out so easily if it is slightly loose. Unfortunately there is little competition, so they are probably not losing enough customers to care. Lesson here is that even an expensive item can suffer slipshod assembly and mediocre design. In future I will assume everything Gitzo is unreliable, and look into other brands if there are any.
Paul B wrote:
Don't know. I'd suggest emailing them at the address they provide on the product page. FWIW, the NSN thread that started all this also has some "homemade" fixes with pics.
I submitted an e-mail query to Naturescapes the day the thread started, but there was no response. I even asked a basic question about another $300 product on the site. Apparently they are not interested in my money. Is it a home/garage business?
The two piece design is a design flaw and a feature. How can it be both? If you thought you were getting a single piece top plate, It's a flaw because the 2 piece design can (and apparently does) fail resulting catastrophic loss. It's a feature if you bought it because you want to be able to remove it and add accessories ect. The real problem isn't necessarily the product, its Gitzo's silence about it. For instance, if Gitzo included the 2 piece design in the list of features and included a reminder that you need to check that bolt periodically, then the consumer would know exactly what he or she was getting and if they wanted a single piece design, could simply shop elsewhere.
That said, a design like where a failure could result in catastrophic loss should absolutely without question have a built in redundancy in the event it fails. For instance, my Really Right Stuff BH55 ballhead has a redundancy feature to protect against a partial opening of the lever clamp. If the clamp open part of the way. the plate it secures will be loose and slide around, but a small bolt in the plate will prevent it from coming all the way out. This gives me a chance to fix it right away before my gear goes crashing to the ground.
We pay top dollar for Gitzo and this is an issue it should address. Now where did I put that welding torch?
Wow...that looks like an overkill solution from naturescapes.
Bitmaker: what did you end up doing for a safety? The only thing I could think of was lashing the tripod head to the legs with some rock climbing rope...
EB-1 wrote:
I submitted an e-mail query to Naturescapes the day the thread started, but there was no response. I even asked a basic question about another $300 product on the site. Apparently they are not interested in my money. Is it a home/garage business?
EBH
Well they're not Amazon.com. But I've always had very fast service from them. However, when brand new products first hit the street things can get pretty busy, unpredictable and supply chains are not always operating initially at peak performance (MarkIII anybody?) I'm no expert on metallurgy but from my days of worrying about the weight of various bicycle parts, I'd guess that the weight of a piece of aluminum that size is pretty insignificant compared to the tripod/camera/lense combo.
Recalcitrant wrote:
For instance, if Gitzo included the 2 piece design in the list of features and included a reminder that you need to check that bolt periodically, then the consumer would know exactly what he or she was getting and if they wanted a single piece design, could simply shop elsewhere.
What do you mean if they included the 2 piece design as a list of features? It's the systematic series of tripods! Just take a look at the Gitzo catalog. What does it do if not emphesize the interchangeability of the center mount from a single plate to column, geared column, video bowl, etc. I'd say it was made pretty clear, and I had no doubt as to what I'd be getting when I ordered it.
My 3500 series had a bowl so I changed it out to a plate, and tighten it with a dab of locktite, but I'm still interesting in a back up solution like the naturescape item.
Although I monitor the plate adjustment it still leaves you open for possible failure with the present design. A failsafe system seems like a reasonable investment with 10K+ balanced on your tripod.
I like carrying my tripod, lens, and body over my shoulder and it will be nice not to worry about whether I got the plate clamp tight enough.
if you use a halfbowl with a MP/video camera or a leveling assy from gitzo thats who. the idea behind it is interopability. my feisol does it too just by a different method using 3 machine screws.
jhom wrote:
I'm curious how many of the individuals who had the top plate of their systematic come off ever tightened the clamping base? Also, I wonder what went through their minds when they got their systematic accessories bag accompaning the tripod. Three wrenches are included in the bag. I would assume that it crossed their minds that these wrenches were included for some purpose other than increasing the shipping weight of the legs. Just a thought.
Jim
bravo. a thinking individual. not referring to the proper support equipment as "sillt wrenches"
PORSCHE917 wrote:
Naurescapes.net now has available a bottom plate machined from 6061 aluminum that you connect with a bolt to the base plate of Gitzo systematic tripods. This product appears to be of high quality and should provide a higher level of security for users of Gitzo systematic tripods who do not use a leveling base or center column. Of course, this assumes that both the bolt connecting the base plate and bottom plate is properly tightened; and it would be a prudent secondary measure to check all of the bolts and screws on those tripods, including the bolt through the collar that secures the base plate....Show more →
you mean checking your equipment out before using it would be the intelligent thing to do? because that would have, most likeley, prevented 95% of the issue here.
Recalcitrant wrote:
The two piece design is a design flaw and a feature. How can it be both? If you thought you were getting a single piece top plate, It's a flaw because the 2 piece design can (and apparently does) fail resulting catastrophic loss. It's a feature if you bought it because you want to be able to remove it and add accessories ect. The real problem isn't necessarily the product, its Gitzo's silence about it. For instance, if Gitzo included the 2 piece design in the list of features and included a reminder that you need to check that bolt periodically, then the consumer would know exactly what he or she was getting and if they wanted a single piece design, could simply shop elsewhere.
That said, a design like where a failure could result in catastrophic loss should absolutely without question have a built in redundancy in the event it fails. For instance, my Really Right Stuff BH55 ballhead has a redundancy feature to protect against a partial opening of the lever clamp. If the clamp open part of the way. the plate it secures will be loose and slide around, but a small bolt in the plate will prevent it from coming all the way out. This gives me a chance to fix it right away before my gear goes crashing to the ground.
We pay top dollar for Gitzo and this is an issue it should address. Now where did I put that welding torch? ...Show more →
no actually your right you shouldn't go out and by a top $ item that you do not understand its form and function.
You should always consider alternatives. At this point the problem is known and others have borne the brunt. Really crank down that POS and you should be fine, at least for the lighter gear. I won't be using my 3 series again this year, so I'll let others buy the NSN plate before going that route. I'd use that safety plate for longer lenses/Wimberley.
You should always consider alternatives. At this point the problem is known and others have borne the brunt. Really crank down that POS and you should be fine, at least for the lighter gear. I won't be using my 3 series again this year, so I'll let others buy the NSN plate before going that route. I'd use that safety plate for longer lenses/Wimberley.
oysterboy wrote:
I was just going to order a 3541LS and found out about all this?
Should I consider other tripods?
would this be enough of a possible problem for you to consider buying other tripod?
I have the 3541LS, and consider it a non-issue. Just pay attention to your equipment. If you use a super-tele on a gimbal, you might consider a supplemental plate or a loop of wire around the bolt if you're not the type to double-check it before using.
Ok, I'm now even more curious. How many of the individuals have had their top plate fall out since the unfortunate users have warned others about the problem. Once you tighten the clamp bolt, shouldn't it solve the problem? I'd like to know as I'm a new user of a 3541LS with a Wimberley gimbal and a 400 f2.8L IS.
I agree with you that most of these unhappy experiences are attributable to user error, not a design error. Greg Downing of naturescapes.net has made the same observation. Unfortunately, in America these days, it is more common to blame others than to accept responsibility for one's own mistakes.
Clearly, checking one's equipment is a prudent thing to do. Although I do not know you, the tenor of your comments suggests to me that you periodically check out your camera gear, including the bolts, screws etc. on your tripod; and I know that I check out my equipment every time before I use it. Further, although you raised a gratuitous question about my "mechanical ability," I would point out to you that I have fairly good "mechanical skills," at least good enough, among other things, to set the valves on a solid lifter Porsche 930 turbo. Nonetheless,, as I believe that you will agree, little if any "mechanical skills" are necessary for the subject that is being discussed in this thread, only reasonable care or prudence.
I agree with you that most of these unhappy experiences are attributable to user error, not a design error. Greg Downing of naturescapes.net has made the same observation. Unfortunately, in America these days, it is more common to blame others than to accept responsibility for one's own mistakes.
Clearly, checking one's equipment is a prudent thing to do. Although I do not know you, the tenor of your comments suggests to me that you periodically check out your camera gear, including the bolts, screws etc. on your tripod; and I know that I check out my equipment every time before I use it. Further, although you raised a gratuitous question about my "mechanical ability," I would point out to you that I have fairly good "mechanical skills," at least good enough, among other things, to set the valves on a solid lifter Porsche 930 turbo. Nonetheless, as I believe that you will agree, little if any "mechanical skills" are necessary for the subject that is being discussed in this thread, only reasonable care or prudence.
