True, from a business perspective, it might not make them the most to not appeal to the largest possible demographic BUT,
looking at it from another perspective, the consumer side of the market has hundreds of choices they can enjoy. But how many products do we "serious shooters" have to pick from in this class with the kind of specs the E-P1 will likely have ?
I don't see many choices, or certainly not the endless supply consumers have. There's the DP2, soon to be E-P1, G1/GH1, maybe if you push it a Pentax K-7 with some pancake lenses, and of course compacts like the LX3 and G10 but that's not really the same class to me. More realistically though, just the DP2 and G1.
mawz wrote:
The problem I see is that at 60% more than an LX3 or G10, Oly may well have priced themselves out of the consumer side of the market. It looks very much like the serious shooter's compact, but potentially too expensive to be the 'retro' compact that will sell in a wider market.
Thats the E-P2!
Oly is smart to introduce a "better" model and subsequently a lower one than try to work up the chain: establish a good camera followed by great reviews and then base the line on that.
dasrocket wrote:
Thats the E-P2!
Oly is smart to introduce a "better" model and subsequently a lower one than try to work up the chain: establish a good camera followed by great reviews and then base the line on that.
The thing is that based on what Oly has said, the E-P1 IS the lower-end model. They strongly indicated that there will be a higher-end model come the end of the year.
Sam Bennett wrote:
They've already done that by focusing on prime lenses. I think they know full well that they're appealing to a smaller market segment.
Right now there's a zoom and a prime from Oly (unannounced, but the kit zoom will be a 14-42 f3.5-5.6) and 4 zooms and 2 primes from Panny (all the zooms are announced and available or just becoming so, the two primes, the 20/1.7 and 45/2.8 OIS Macro, have been shown but not officially announced). That's hardly focusing on primes.
Mind you, I'd really to see a 'focus on primes' for m43.
mawz wrote:
Right now there's a zoom and a prime from Oly (unannounced, but the kit zoom will be a 14-42 f3.5-5.6) and 4 zooms and 2 primes from Panny (all the zooms are announced and available or just becoming so, the two primes, the 20/1.7 and 45/2.8 OIS Macro, have been shown but not officially announced). That's hardly focusing on primes.
Mind you, I'd really to see a 'focus on primes' for m43.
Their prototype and now these photos, both have prime lenses which to me is a clear indication of the market they're aiming at. Panasonic has even put out their own M-mount adapter - the association with rangefinder systems is not accidental. Neither Olympus nor Panasonic have any illusion that this is a camera for the masses. They're filling a niche that the more discerning dSLR owners have been articulating for years.
mawz wrote:
The thing is that based on what Oly has said, the E-P1 IS the lower-end model. They strongly indicated that there will be a higher-end model come the end of the year.
Then it's the E-P3 Oly also showed a colourful gold prototype too, so obviously initial concepts and first models are far apart from each other.
I agree with Sam: this is not a camera for the masses, it is executed for a very well established niche market as the first camera. I am personally glad they did as I have been waiting for this one a while, but also that they did not follow the G1 DSLR-clone styling. Instead of "another model" they are going after a different line of cameras.
Sam Bennett wrote:
Their prototype and now these photos, both have prime lenses which to me is a clear indication of the market they're aiming at. Panasonic has even put out their own M-mount adapter - the association with rangefinder systems is not accidental. Neither Olympus nor Panasonic have any illusion that this is a camera for the masses. They're filling a niche that the more discerning dSLR owners have been articulating for years.
Panasonic at least distinctly tried to market the G1 to the masses, it is and was marketed as a 'super-P&S' for someone who wants the advantages of an SLR in a bridge camera package. The M adapter was more an admission of reality than an open change in their marketing
mawz wrote:
Panasonic at least distinctly tried to market the G1 to the masses, it is and was marketed as a 'super-P&S' for someone who wants the advantages of an SLR in a bridge camera package. The M adapter was more an admission of reality than an open change in their marketing
Fair enough - but again, Panasonic's strategy has been primarily focused on zooms. And while I think they are hoping to sell a lot of G1's, I don't think they have any illusions of this becoming the choice for people looking for a $200 P&S, which is more the "masses" that I was referring to. In any case, Olympus seems to be aiming more for the audience that likes the cachet that comes with Leica, etc. They're in a partnership with Panasonic, and part of good partnerships is having products that are differentiated enough to not step on each others toes, especially with the market in general contracting.
As long as it has full manual controls, the live-view implementation works well, and the AF is as good as (not worse than) the G1 - I'm still in for one. I hope they publish a model roadmap at the introduction, if they're going to introduce a higher end body later this year - I might wait for that.
+1: and if the prime shown is a good one, an external VF will be plenty good for me. Interesting that this camera may just kill the DP2 -bad timing and all
theSuede wrote:
As long as it has full manual controls, the live-view implementation works well, and the AF is as good as (not worse than) the G1 - I'm still in for one. I hope they publish a model roadmap at the introduction, if they're going to introduce a higher end body later this year - I might wait for that.
I expect all three of those to be true.
personally I'm mildly tempted on the body. The 17 pancake is a LOT more interesting since I already have a G1. unless of course it's as mediocre as the 25 pancake proved.
This is super exciting. The ideal walk-around digital for us snobs that won't use a small-sensor P&S. Thanks so much for sharing, time to quell any other camera purchases until this is released.
Makten wrote:
Then you'd need to stop down quite a bit, and the advantage over cameras with smaller sensors would disappear.
Not really. I used to shoot my CV 21 (32mm effective on my RD-1) at 4 with focus from about 6 feet to infinity. In moderate light, I would shoot at ISO 400 and 1/60 sec. With longer lenses you have to be more precise, for sure.
This is for not for all types of shooting, and neither is this camera. There is no comparison with PS's though: having just sold both my LX3 and my G10, the lag I found in both of those even with MF and zone focusing made them unsuitable for fast, from-the-hip street photography.
Makten wrote:
Then you'd need to stop down quite a bit, and the advantage over cameras with smaller sensors would disappear.
One of the advantages of 4/3rds here (and m43 too) is that you're getting enough DoF at f2.8 or f4 to zone focus, or go hyperfocal at f5.6-f8, but you can still achieve shallow DoF effects unlike the smaller sensors.
The big issue with this is that none of the m43 or 4/3rds native lenses small enough to be interesting have focus distance scales let alone hyperfocal markings.
