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Cableaddict
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p.1 #1 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

I looking to get the best anti-dust system possible for my Canon 5D.

I've done the standard ton of research, read threads till my eyeballs watered, but I see almost no mention of this device at all. Weird. You know the one::

http://www.nrdfirefly.com/?gclid=CLbXsfHF-JQCFQJtFQodwzO6qg

It seems like a good idea to me to use this anti-static device first, then only swab when absolutely needed (using the "Visible Dust" system or similar.) -if it actually works.

The other way to look at it is, lots of folks get by just fine with swabbing, why is this $200 doo-hicky needed?

Any thoughts or reports from actual users?

Edited on Aug 06, 2008 at 06:19 AM

Aug 06, 2008 at 06:15 AM

Alistair Watson
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p.1 #2 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

Personally I would go with a Visible Dust cleaning solution such as the Arctic Butterfly and the new sensor swabs, the loupe is very useful as well.

Aug 06, 2008 at 08:48 AM

Roy Pertchik
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p.1 #3 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

That thing looks hokey to me. I do not believe it.

I use a Visible Dust brush (probably no better than an art store nylon brush at 1/10th of the price) and a bulb blower. And when necessary, Eclipse and Pec pads.

Aug 06, 2008 at 11:29 AM

plnelson
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p.1 #4 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

Cableaddict wrote:

As they point out, your sensor can have a net positive or net negative charge, so how does blowing a combination of negatively and positively charged ions at it help? Indeed, why wouldn't these ions recombine as soon as they're created, long before they ever make it to the sensor? The science doesn't make any sense.

Aug 06, 2008 at 04:41 PM

Cableaddict
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p.1 #5 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

Well, maybe that's why no one is talking about it much!

But actually, they would NOT combine with each other, so the science DOES make sense.
If I remember my HS chemistry correctly:

Ions typically do not bond with other ions. They bond with unbalanced molecules.

But I could be wrong.

So, which of the two high-end "swabbing" systems is typically considered best? I did a lot of reading, and my head hurts from all the data. I shoot a 5D, so I have to worry about which fluid touches the filter.

Edited on Aug 06, 2008 at 09:26 PM

Aug 06, 2008 at 09:21 PM

HerbChong
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p.1 #6 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

IOW, you don't remember your high school chemistry. ions in air have little to do with chemistry and lots to do with physics.

Herb....

Aug 07, 2008 at 01:20 AM

Cableaddict
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p.1 #7 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

Ions have LOTS to do with chemistry.

-Though in this particular case I guess you're right & it's a physics issue. So, good point.

I think the difference is between ion molecules & ionic atoms, but Physics isn't my thing. (obviously, I guess.)

Edited on Aug 07, 2008 at 04:43 AM

Aug 07, 2008 at 02:13 AM

plnelson
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p.1 #8 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

Cableaddict wrote:
Well, maybe that's why no one is talking about it much!

But actually, they would NOT combine with each other, so the science DOES make sense.If I remember my HS chemistry correctly:

Ions typically do not bond with other ions.

Sure they do. An ion is simply something that wants an electron or has one to share (i.e. where the electron count doesn't match the proton count) Take Na+ and Cl-, for instance.

I have no idea what the ionization products are this gizmo so I have no idea how they might interact with each other on their way to the AA filter. But even if they arrive there still ionized, then what? How does that help?

Aug 07, 2008 at 04:24 PM

HerbChong
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p.1 #9 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

just ionized air.

Herb....

plnelson wrote:
I have no idea what the ionization products are this gizmo so I have no idea how they might interact with each other on their way to the AA filter. But even if they arrive there still ionized, then what? How does that help?

Aug 07, 2008 at 04:46 PM

plnelson
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p.1 #10 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

HerbChong wrote:
just ionized air.

Herb....

But air is a mixture of different gasses, so what are the specific ions that are produced, and in what relative quantities?

Aug 07, 2008 at 05:47 PM

HerbChong
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p.1 #11 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

the only ones that realy matter are nitrogen. for this application, the exact mixture is irrelevant.

Herb....

Aug 07, 2008 at 06:12 PM

plnelson
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p.1 #12 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

HerbChong wrote:
the only ones that realy matter are nitrogen. for this application, the exact mixture is irrelevant.

Herb....

Doubtful. Nitrogen doesn't ionize easily. It has very low affinity for extra electrons and it takes a lot of energy to knock electrons off of it because atmospheric nitrogen (N2) is based on a triple bond.

That's why industrial processes that need to create nitrogen ions do it using amonia via nitrogen free radicals, instead of trying to ionize nitrogen gas.

Aug 07, 2008 at 07:31 PM

HerbChong
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p.1 #13 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

given that most of the remainder of air is oxygen and that has many side effects in its ionized forms, there isn't much choice unless they are ionizing something that needs replenishing. in this application, industrial levels of ion production efficiency are irrelevant. the old Discstat record cleaning device produced lots of ions by piezo electric effect. it neutralized static charges on records quite effectively. however, i would never put one near any electronics and i seriously doubt any industrial process would ever use free electrons produced in this manner.

Herb....

Edited on Aug 07, 2008 at 08:05 PM

Aug 07, 2008 at 08:05 PM

plnelson
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p.1 #14 · Firefly sensor cleaner?

HerbChong wrote:
given that most of the remainder of air is oxygen and that has many side effects in its ionized forms, there isn't much choice unless they are ionizing something that needs replenishing.
Herb....

Still, if they're ionizing anything it's more likely to be oxygen, because that's easier to ionize. (it has lower ionization energy) But he's claiming to produce an equal number of positive and negative ions but that's not how ionization works - some things readily give up electrons; some things readily accept them but few things do both equally. (and even if he could, it's no obvious benefit to cleaning your sensor)

So I'm not convinced it's ionizing anything that actually shoots out the business end toward the camera. You can impart a static charge to something like brush bristles or that record-cleaner you mentioned, but when you do that you're not ionizing them; you're just giving them a static charge.

Bottom line, as I said originally, it makes very little sense scientifically but it has a lot of buzzword appeal to people who weren't very good at science in school.

Edited on Aug 07, 2008 at 09:53 PM

Aug 07, 2008 at 09:52 PM


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