Logic of Locking AIT

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Archive 2007 · Logic of Locking AIT

TeamSK jay
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p.1 #1 · Logic of Locking AIT

Hi Fred,

I don't understand the logic behind locking the Alternative Image Thread. Images that are linked from other servers don't affect your bandwidth and for those on your server - isn't that what those people are paying for?

jay

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:20 PM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #2 · Logic of Locking AIT

I must admit I'm a bit confused too. Why lock the very threads that keep people coming to the site?

It isn't just locked. In fact it will soon be deleted after a certain period of no new posts and lost forever.

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:24 PM

Andi Dietrich
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p.1 #3 · Logic of Locking AIT

This is the thread which made this place different. Why not limit it to latest 30 pages and lock the early posts?

Does not make sense to forbid to post pictures in a photography forum

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:27 PM

pdmphoto
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p.1 #4 · Logic of Locking AIT

It looks like some users of FM hosting might have overstepped what's considered normal usage? OK, then make some change to your hosting policy that includes limitations.

I have always used my own host so it's no issue for FM. Locking a user like me out seems ridiculous. If the lockup of the AIT continues I will rename all the files on my host so the links no longer work - in protest.

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:40 PM

pdmphoto
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p.1 #5 · Logic of Locking AIT

I think that's his main purpose...

foto-z wrote:
It isn't just locked. In fact it will soon be deleted after a certain period of no new posts and lost forever.

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:41 PM

ISO1600
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p.1 #6 · Logic of Locking AIT

Paul, don't go and martyr yourself for a lost cause.

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:45 PM

pdmphoto
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p.1 #7 · Logic of Locking AIT

foto-z wrote:
pdmphoto wrote:
If the lockup of the AIT continues I will rename all the files on my host so the links no longer work - in protest.

What's the point? It's on the way to deletion.

My images would still come up in Google when users are searching for alterntive lens info. They might see the text, but no images. Also any newer posts on other threads won't be there.

If it continues, I'll probably go back to the DPReview Kodak SLR community. I'd be outa here 100% before long.

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:46 PM

StevenPA
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p.1 #8 · Logic of Locking AIT

The thread was getting cumbersome to navigate. When was the last time anyone looked at a pic on page 153? 227? And the page turn thing was really getting out of control. In recent days/weeks the first few posts of new pages were just TP and no pics.

But then there's paying for a service and being told how to use it? I'm on PBase too, so no server burden coming from me at all.

In the end, what we need is a special gallery page or something like that that doesn't create as much server load, if in fact that's a problem. A gallery would load only thumbnails every time unless someone wanted to see a pic full size.

I'd like to see a return to an Alt Image Thread as soon as possible. What's the best alternative now?

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:50 PM

htbyron
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p.1 #9 · Logic of Locking AIT

This is very frustrating. I have been a member here for a while, and for the last couple of years I have spent almost all of my time here on the Alt. forum. The AIT is always the first thread I check, as I am inspired by the images produced by this (smaller) community of photographers and their unusual equipment. First the nonsense about the M8 & DMR threads, and now this? (I realize Fred is not directly to blame for the former.)

Fred: What about starting up a new AIT, and then locking it after, say, 30 pages or so (or less)? Then letting a new one start up. Would that help the bandwidth concern (which I admit I don't understand)?

Nov 05, 2007 at 11:56 PM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #10 · Logic of Locking AIT

or a policy of externally hosted images only?

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:01 AM

ISO1600
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p.1 #11 · Logic of Locking AIT

flickr is the heat.... haha

there are plenty of groups on there

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:01 AM

TeamSK jay
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p.1 #12 · Logic of Locking AIT

StevenPA wrote:
The thread was getting cumbersome to navigate. When was the last time anyone looked at a pic on page 153? 227? And the page turn thing was really getting out of control. In recent days/weeks the first few posts of new pages were just TP and no pics.

But then there's paying for a service and being told how to use it? I'm on PBase too, so no server burden coming from me at all.

In the end, what we need is a special gallery page or something like that that doesn't create as much server load, if in fact that's a problem. A gallery would load only thumbnails every time unless someone wanted to see a pic full size.

I'd like to see a return to an Alt Image Thread as soon as possible. What's the best alternative now?

I looked at page 227 just the other day. Sometimes I just put in a random page number and browse some oldies.

Most everyone stopped making TP posts without a photo attached, especially once Guy left again. Maybe a new thread did need to be started for this technical issue but that isn't how I interpret Fred's comments.

I have little interest in posting to the presentation boards, and I fail to see how that is any different than posting to the AIT as concerns bandwidth. Photos taken with alt lenses and systems directly supports all the other thread discussions on the alt board.

What are our alternatives??

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:02 AM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #13 · Logic of Locking AIT

TeamSK jay wrote:

I have little interest in posting to the presentation boards, and I fail to see how that is any different than posting to the AIT as concerns bandwidth.

+1

Something doesn't add up

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:09 AM

FranchiseJuan
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p.1 #14 · Logic of Locking AIT

TeamSK jay wrote:
Photos taken with alt lenses and systems directly supports all the other thread discussions on the alt board.

I think this is probably the most important point to make.

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:10 AM

StevenPA
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p.1 #15 · Logic of Locking AIT

TeamSK jay wrote:
I looked at page 227 just the other day.

No way.

Sometimes I just put in a random page number and browse some oldies.

Have to admit I've done this too, but with only 5 or so page links shown for navigation, only the really diehards would do such a thing.

Most everyone stopped making TP posts without a photo attached, especially once Guy left again. Maybe a new thread did need to be started for this technical issue but that isn't how I interpret Fred's comments.

It was still annoying to see that a new photo had been posted, but no viewable until another photo was posted to turn the page over.

A new thread was needed, but relegating the "old" AIT to Cyber Heaven is sad. Once again this site is suffering from poorly explained drastic measures, which is where some of our frustration is surely coming from.

I have little interest in posting to the presentation boards, and I fail to see how that is any different than posting to the AIT as concerns bandwidth. Photos taken with alt lenses and systems directly supports all the other thread discussions on the alt board.

Agree 110%. Fred's homebrew forum software, and it's some of the best homebrew on the net, seems to have not been built for large threads. Could it be the size and not the pics that's the issue?

Either way, we need to get another AIT up as soon as possible. A clean start. That's probably our only choice. Fred can then come back and lock anything that he feels is too unruly in size/server burden when that happens. Let's not let this speed bump push us elsewhere, to other forums or sites.

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:11 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #16 · Logic of Locking AIT

When we have a thread with over 300 pages mostly with image posts, we will have a substantial degradation of the forum performance. That goes for images hosted from the site and external images. It still takes bandwidth to open pictures from other sites.
I have ways to control which threads / boards / posts are slowing the forum the most and this thread is on the top of the list.

How about coming up with an alternative? I will think about something we can do instead of having threads like the "AIT".

I will unlock the thread for now but keep in mind that sooner or later, we will have to deal with it..
Fred

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:12 AM

StevenPA
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p.1 #17 · Logic of Locking AIT

Thanks, Fred! Working together is much healthier for FM.com than simply being locked out. If the AIT is a burden, then how can we create and sustain one place on this forum for pics? That's what I want. I don't want to use the presentation boards.

Is it possible to have a gallery link at the top of the page? A gallery that could link to external sites and allow for brief commenting?

Edited by StevenPA on Nov 06, 2007 at 09:17 AM GMT

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:15 AM

FranchiseJuan
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p.1 #18 · Logic of Locking AIT

How about instead of embedding the images into the thread, we post a link to the image instead. Would that help the load?

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:16 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #19 · Logic of Locking AIT

I don't want to use the presentation boards.

Ok, what's wrong with the presentation boards?

Never mind, let's concentrate for an "AIT" alternative.

How about something like what we have on the WA and MA boards. Submissions are posted as thumbnails on the top of the page as a link. Take a look at that and let me know.
Fred

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:19 AM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #20 · Logic of Locking AIT

Thanks Fred!

FranchiseJuan wrote:
How about instead of embedding the images into the thread, we post a link to the image instead. Would that help the load?

That is the same load as posting externally hosted images. The user's browser does the work of downloading the images from the relevant server.

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:20 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #21 · Logic of Locking AIT

foto-z wrote:
Thanks Fred!

FranchiseJuan wrote:
How about instead of embedding the images into the thread, we post a link to the image instead. Would that help the load?

That is the same load as posting externally hosted images. The user's browser does the work of downloading the images from the relevant server.

It's not the same as members would open thumbnails individually instead of for example going to page "225" and seeing 8 images or more at once. There is a big difference here.
This is how it would look like:
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/WA/

This is just a suggestion...

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:22 AM

StevenPA
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p.1 #22 · Logic of Locking AIT

Fred Miranda wrote:
Ok, what's wrong with the presentation boards?

Never mind, let's concentrate for an "AIT" alternative.

Too many normal lenses to wade through.

How about something like what we have on the WA and MA boards. Submissions are posted as thumbnails on the top of the page as a link. Take a look at that and let me know.
Fred

That's actually not a bad proposal, but can we add commenting to that? We need to be telling people what lenses we've used, and we also need space to pat each other on the back.

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:23 AM

Graham Mitchell
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p.1 #23 · Logic of Locking AIT

Yep, we need to see the info. We'll get there...

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:26 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #24 · Logic of Locking AIT

That's actually not a bad proposal, but can we add commenting to that? We need to be telling people what lenses we've used, and we also need space to pat each other on the back.

If someone decides to post an image on this board, on the subject line, something needs to be added. For example:
AIT: my image

So, all threads with the word "AIT" on the subject line would contain an image that would be transformed into a thumbnail and added to the thumbnail page. Once members browse the thumbnail page and like that particular image, they would be able to click on it and go to the thread in question. (And post comments, find out which gear was used, etc...)
Too complicated?

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:31 AM

TeamSK jay
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p.1 #25 · Logic of Locking AIT

Fred, thanks for working with us on an alternative! But I most admit I'm still bewildered that a link to an image on an external host requires bandwidth on you server, aside from the URL link text.

So I click to open page 225 and it has a post with a link embedded in it as ttp:www.teamsk.org/photo/1.jpg (no h in this example so it will just show as text). My browser reads that link and then makes a direct connection to the teamsk server and the data is sent directly to my browser. Would you mind explaining why bits of that data stream pass through your server?

Thanks, jay

Nov 06, 2007 at 12:33 AM


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