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Archive 2007 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)
  
 
AGeoJO
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


I am not trying to be a PITB here but I noticed a few things (judging only by the small size of web images, of course ):

- The image taken with the Leica appears to be a tad softer either due to camera movement (did you use a tripod for both shots?) or slightly out of focus. Not sure which. Being able to focus correctly on a crop camera is one of the pitfalls, BTW. Yes, you can change your focusing screen more easily on a 1D type camera than on the crop camera although it is also available from a third-party supplier.

- I believe, the Canon 50mm MkII is not known to have a good bokeh rendition. I am not sure about the number of aperture blades and the shape they create if stopped down (it looks like it has 5 blades and the shape is pentagonal). The rounder the shape the more pleasing the bokeh, in general. My point is, maybe it would be a little bit more fair to compare the two with a 50mm f/1.4.



Jul 19, 2007 at 06:47 PM
RGS65
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


The background looks like butta on that Leica.


Jul 19, 2007 at 07:01 PM
SmegHead
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


true.. I'm deffinatly not saying this is a scientific comparison.. and yes.. the leica IS a tad softer.. definatly. I did the comparison with the 50mm MKII for two reasons.. one.. its what I have :P and also because the two lens's are closer in price.. I paid $119 for my 50mm MKII and $200 for the Leica used.. and the 50mm f1.4 is about $479 here in canada... so I thought it was pretty fair comparison. And I do agree with AGeoJO there are definatly canon lens's that will give a similarly pleasing bokeh.. but they're more expensive $300-$500 for the 50mm 1.4 or the 85 1.8.. or in the thousands for the 50 and 85L's. Plus manually focusing is much nicer on the Leica (though I havent tried the L's)


Jul 19, 2007 at 07:03 PM
Hammerli
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


mh2000 wrote:
yup, I agree... all the little self-appointed policemen should just get over themselves...


How ironic; if people were self-policing we wouldn't have alternative lens threads in the Canon forum when there exists a forum specifically for this kind of posts. Suggesting that the inclusion of Canon references is justification is a slippery slope; what Leica lens can't (and hasn't been) compared to a Canon alternative? There is a reason the appropriate forum is called the Alternative Digital Systems & Lenses forum.



Jul 19, 2007 at 07:04 PM
mh2000
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Canon is a system. People don't blast people that ask about using Pocket Wizards and stuff with their Canon gear, do they? They don't blast people asking about Metz or Sigma... those aren't Canon brands either. Heck, we probably need 3rd party lenses in Canon mount forum as well, right?


Jul 19, 2007 at 07:38 PM
jweaver
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Just relax, man. It will be alright. Some here do not check that board at all. I know I could not care less about Pentax or Konica so i would not even think to look there, so it is a boon. If you do not care to read these posts, you could just move on. Sometimes the tone here is pretty negative and it does not have to be that way. If you are troubled that this is on the wrong board, boycott the thread...


Jul 19, 2007 at 07:56 PM
Emile Gregoire
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Jesse, love the image of the Leica - thanks for sharing. However I can hardly believe it has been shot at the same aperture as the Canon image, seeing the DOF is totally different. Size of the OOF highlights is totally different as well - different shape is what could be expected but twice the size is doubtful. Are you sure it was shot at f/3.5?


Jul 19, 2007 at 09:07 PM
mh2000
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


a number of Canon lenses tested against a Summicron 50 and others:

http://www.markhahnphotography.com/russian/f28_lens_tests/normal_lens_tests28.htm



Jul 19, 2007 at 09:17 PM
fourfa
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


I'd agree - there's no way those two shots were made at the same aperture. look at the blur gradient in the leaves.


Jul 19, 2007 at 09:26 PM
AGeoJO
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


In addition, it is also possible that the plane of focus on the Leica shot fell a little bit in the front of the red fruit (berry?), rendering the bokeh softer/smoother than if the focusing plane was exactly on the fruit itself. Nothing behind the berry is in focus on that image. The image taken with the Leica, for my taste, is a little bit too soft and definitely not characteristic of a Leica fingerprint had the focus been right on the money, uh, I mean, the berry .

Edited by AGeoJO on Jul 19, 2007 at 02:09 PM GMT (Reason: typo )



Jul 19, 2007 at 09:39 PM
 

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jjlphoto
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Whoa- slow down pardners. Focus can shift with aperture changes.
http://www.vanwalree.com/optics/spherical.html

lots of articles on focus shift using Google.



Jul 19, 2007 at 09:59 PM
EricH
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


If you calculate DOF you will get the same number for both Leica and Canon 50mm set at the same aperture, however my tests and the images posted here reveal something different.

I have read that the transition from in focus to out of focus is sharper with the leica glass and I think that is what I have been seeing. Until the original poster confirms his setting there is no way to know, but from my experience the usable or apparent DOF is smaller with the leica glass than with canon. I don't have a technical explanation, just empirical evidence.



Jul 19, 2007 at 11:11 PM
cogitech
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Isn't there also a chance that the aperture on the Leica was not, in fact, stopping down as the OP turned the ring? I know I have seen it before due to either lack of holding aperture engage pin/lever, or due to sticky blades.


Jul 19, 2007 at 11:37 PM
SmegHead
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Like I said.. these where hardly scientific test.. and I'll concede that I did not look down the barrel and confirm the blades where in the proper position, so I will concede that it's possible the blades could have stuck open wider than the canon. I've only had the lens a few days now and this post was originally more about my first impressions of my new lens and my copy might have a sticking problem. I'll do a more rigourous test when I have a chance to set up my tripod under controlled conditions.. just bare with me work's kinda hectic right now


Jul 20, 2007 at 03:28 AM
AGeoJO
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Jesse,
I understand your excitement and I understand you didn't do the comparison in a rigorous way. We are just avid photographers and not optical engineers.

Actually, Paul may be pointing at the right direction, explaining the difference in bokeh rendition between the two lenses. Since the shooting circumstances are close to be the same, you can look up the actual shutter speed used to take both shots. If the shutter speed of the Leica is different (faster) by one stop or even faster, then indeed the aperture used was not the same.

BTW, what version is your 50mm Summicron? There are 4 versions altogether.

Joshua



Jul 20, 2007 at 04:46 AM
EricH
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


I have two 50mm summicrons, a type 2 and a type 4. Both are quite nice but the latest is razor sharp even at full aperture. I recently bought the 50mm summilux so am not using either of my 'crons right now and in fact have them both for sale. But I'd say that the type 4 cron is sharper at f/2 and may have more contrast and 3d to it. Really should do a test... The funny thing is when I got out to shoot with my 5D, I always take the zuiko 55 f/1.2 instead of the lux or cron. And oddly when I go out with the DMR, I use the 35-70 elmarit. I think I have too many lenses. Okay this firms it up. This weekend I will shoot with the cron, lux, and zuiko and report back...


Jul 20, 2007 at 05:00 AM
SmegHead
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Good idea Joshua, I'll look into that, the originals are on my workstation back at work. I'll post my findings tommorrow.

btw, my version is a 2 cam made in germany in 1968 if I'm translating the serial number right.



Jul 20, 2007 at 05:33 AM
jweaver
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


Why was this moved and not stated as such. I am really tiring of the constant nanny-like police state that my fellow posters have assumed. Really this belonged in Canon forum, but I give up.


Jul 20, 2007 at 12:44 PM
cogitech
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


If the moderator had read the thread instead of listening to all the whining he would have seen that it does, in fact, belong in the Canon forum.

People talk about all kinds of non-Canon crap over in the Canon forum, even tons of non-Canon lenses (as long as they have an EOS mount) but try to spread the word about a Zeiss of a Leica on your *Canon* body and "poof", it gets dumped into a forum where nobody cares because they all know it already. Only politics could explain it.



Jul 20, 2007 at 01:08 PM
SmegHead
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Another Leica convert (PICS ADDED at page 5)


If the moderators think this thread belongs in the Alt forum, so be it, it's their forum, not mine and I have to respect that. They've put together a great site that I've gotten a ridiculous amount of help from, so I'm not going to be pissed if we differ in opinions, oh well its not the end of the world. And I give them credit for being able to do their job and make up their own minds, there are those that posted here saying it should be moved and gave constructive reasons why.. and those that didn't agree with my assesment.. GOOD, I'm not always right.. no one is, and if there weren't those here that could constructively disagree who knows what kind of false information would be floating around. Just don't post "This shouldnt be here" and that's it.. it's not constructive and it doesn't teach anyone anything.

And if you dont agree with me.. well.. just remember.. I've got a Leica 50mm that's already beat down a puma.. you want to be next



Jul 20, 2007 at 01:14 PM
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