•Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

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Archive 2007 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Roland W
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p.33 #1 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I have not had a hot spot problem, but I have read that Photoshop CS3 makes the hot spots go away when you open the picture in that environment. They must have a scheme that detects hot spots automatically, and does some form of averaging replacement of the data.

Sep 10, 2007 at 06:48 PM

TV21
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p.33 #2 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I'm using CS3 with Bridge and I see the spots in Bridge.

However, when I preview the image in ACR, the spots go away. Same for opening the raw file in PS.

Nice one, Adobe!

Sep 10, 2007 at 07:10 PM

TV21
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p.33 #3 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

By way of an update, I contacted canon support regarding getting the unit replaced as this is only a few weeks old.

They replied basically saying "tough" and that the warranty is for repair not replacement. My photo store has a 5 day(!!!) return policy so it looks like I HAVE to send it to Canon who should then fix it.

What irritates me is that I now have to spend my money to mail it to Canon and lose 2 weeks of use (if I'm lucky) while Canon fixes this. Again, this is for a brand new camera that I paid $4500+tax for. yeah I know.

I looked into the fabled Canon Pro Services but that appears to be Europe only.

I like the camera, but Canon's service and support on this matter really gives me pause to consider future purchases.

At the very least they should provide shipping both ways.

This is what I get for being a (moderately) early adopter.

Sep 13, 2007 at 04:03 AM

slau
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p.33 #4 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

How come your camera store does not want to look after you when you have problem? My local store will just take the defected unit back and replace with it with a new one. It has been done before.

Or, did you buy your camera on-line?

Sep 13, 2007 at 08:55 AM

sjms
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p.33 #5 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Roland W wrote:
I have not had a hot spot problem, but I have read that Photoshop CS3 makes the hot spots go away when you open the picture in that environment. They must have a scheme that detects hot spots automatically, and does some form of averaging replacement of the data.

actually no. as thats where i noticed mine when i first started shooting the camera at 1600.

Sep 13, 2007 at 09:30 AM

gbee
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p.33 #6 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I hear that, loud and clear.

I left Nikon for sloppy work and even sloppier service, if seems like Canon has hired all these old Nikon guys, but is it safe to jump back into the Nikon pool? That's the question.

But certainly Canon has made me mad and THEY have started me thinking about Nikon again, it's their [Canon's] fault.

TV21 wrote:I like the camera, but Canon's service and support on this matter really gives me pause to consider future purchases.

Sep 13, 2007 at 10:16 AM

Valerie S
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p.33 #7 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I shot a band in a club last night using my standard 35L for close up work. Every shot turned out soft (I always shoot for the eyes). I was really bummed out and then I noticed that everything was front focused to a varying degree, some more than others. I thought maybe it was a problem with the Micro Adjustment but my camera was set to 0 and was in focus under test conditions. Everything was shot in AWB and Tungsten. I also switched between Servo and One Shot.

This was a club I've shot in many times before with the 35L and never had this problem with my 30D. Any idea what could be the problem? The camera seems fine (focus right on) under daylight. All shots done with a single AF point with AF Expansion turned off. As I write this, it sounds like I'm 180 degrees off of the RG problem.

Sep 15, 2007 at 08:00 PM

XsigmaSD
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p.33 #8 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Interesting, haven't heard of any low light issues with focus. Were you using one of the off-center points, or the "focus and recompose" method? Have you checked the RAWs in DPP to see what focus point the camera was using?

Sep 15, 2007 at 09:29 PM

Valerie S
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p.33 #9 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I was using the Center and outer 9, but that shouldn't matter as they are all cross sensors. I never Focus/Recompose. I can't figure out how to show the focus points in DPP (is that available on the Mac version? I can't see how. ), but I only use one focus point which is always on the eyes.

Sep 15, 2007 at 11:09 PM

Caleb Williams
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p.33 #10 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Did you try micro adjustment?

Sep 15, 2007 at 11:23 PM

MSC
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p.33 #11 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

DPP does not show focus points. Canon Zoombrowser does. And BreezeBrowser Pro does. But that is not really useful as it shows what the camera setting was, not what point the camera was actually using. It might be useful if you can see that some part of the photo was in focus and it is not what the camera is set for...but this is not reliable because AF jumps around looking for contrast. If you saw a whole series of the exact same problem then it may help identify a front or back focus issue.

Are you contantly pressing the shutter to keep the lens focusing?

Maybe the low light did not provide enough contrast to make focusing work? But the MkIII should be better than the 30D for this. Can you post a few shots?

You can also pull it out at your house in a darkened room and do some testing of your own. Which may be smart to do before you use it again for a live shoot. See if you can identify what is going on. Try different lenses, etc.

Sep 15, 2007 at 11:32 PM

Valerie S
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p.33 #12 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I'm on a Mac so ZoomBrowser and BreezeBrowser won't work for me. I'm saying that it was front focusing because Id see something in the foreground much more in focus tan the targets eyes. Don't judge my work by this shot, but notice how her jeans and the bridge of her bass is sharper than the guy's head? I targeted for where his eyes are/would be (no PP other than resize on this one):

I went and shot a band in the daylight today and everything was fine. Full size you can see the eyelashes clearly and the crow's feet. One Shot but with my 24-70:

Fooling around the house tonight with my 50/1.4, I think that the problem seems to be the camera not wanting to refocus on a new target quick enough under low light conditions (1600@1/160, f1.4). I'm going to try to shoot a punk band tomorrow night using Servo and constantly tapping the shutter. I set the sensitivity up one notch on Cf. III-2. I used to tap my 30D, but always in One Shot Mode. Hopefully this will work and I'll follow up tomorrow night.

Sep 16, 2007 at 05:48 AM

Normcar21
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p.33 #13 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Why are these shots bad? The focus is on the head of the guitarist and the shutter was a bit slow so you see some blur in guitar and hands. The second shot has perfect focus on the face, saturation is excellent, what is your complaint for goodness sakes. It looks to me like your camera is working great. What exactly are you wanting beyond this?

Sep 16, 2007 at 05:56 AM

Normcar21
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p.33 #14 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I'm amazed that you are posting these shots as problem shots

Sep 16, 2007 at 05:57 AM

Richard Nye
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p.33 #15 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I don't know, they look OOF to me.

Sep 16, 2007 at 06:01 AM

Valerie S
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p.33 #16 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Normcar21 wrote:
I'm amazed that you are posting these shots as problem shots

Richard Nye wrote:
I don't know, they look OOF to me.

Well...
The first one seem OOF to me, especially considering the foreground bass ridge being more in focus. His strumming hand should be OOF at 1/160, but notice his fret hand is just plain "soft". The second one is spot on when viewed at 100% on my CRTs, I just posted to illustrate that it wasn't under all lighting conditions. That was done in One Shot, which is the opposite of what I'm going to try tomorrow night. This stuff is a PITA.

Sep 16, 2007 at 07:06 AM

Jammy Straub
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p.33 #17 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I often have to resort to using the AF assist lamp on my speedlight in clubs for reliable focus (but with a xxd body). You're right the first shot's focus is off.

Sep 16, 2007 at 07:30 AM

Alistair Watson
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p.33 #18 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I shoot alot of netball in poorly lit sports arenas and found as long as I can keep the shutter speed up the 1D Mark 3 performs wonderfully. A good ISO 3200 gives us so many more options.

Sep 16, 2007 at 07:46 AM

Valerie S
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p.33 #19 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Background: I've always used One Shot and my fast primes (35L, 50/1.4, 85/1.8 and 135L) for my music work with my 30D. I'm able to nearly "mash" the shutter or constantly tape the shutter and I've had a high percentage of keepers consistently when using the center AF point. I've been satisfied with the results, though some may not be. Some of my work is on my site in my profile. I've never used Servo for this type of work because y primes seem to "wobble" in and out of focus and it didn't seem to acquire focus as quickly initially as in One Shot.

Last night I shot in the same club using my 50/1.4 instead of the 35L. I tried to shoot using Servo mode since I've had great results shooting polo with it. My 35L was too "jumpy" in and out of focus, so I thought maybe it was the lens and not the camera. Also, the cam (an other 2 I've had) seem more responsive in low light in Servo more in regards to AF than in One Shot. Low light is between 1600 and 3200, 1/160 and 1.4

Initially, things seemed OK, but chimping proved that things could be better so I set the Servo sensitivity to the fastest setting. I noticed the AF point getting bolder faster, so I though, "ah ha!" and shot the rest of the set and left. Go home and opened some chardonnay while I transfered my files and... bummer.

I few shots seem OK, but many/most seem to be front focused. The webbing on guitar straps shows detail which is out in front of the players eyes. So, I set the AF Microadjust to backfocus a bit (5) and walk around the yard and house testing and everything seems backfocused. Here's a unsharpened sample in which the eyes are soft (the AF point), yet the bottom of the strap and high E string are sharper (and closer to the camera than the eyes). It's 100% crop but still too big for FM's restrictions:
Here

I've shot at this club a number of times and have never experienced a problem with back or front focus issues. Could it be the lighting that is messing up the AF system? My 24-70 seems to be fine but it's too slow to even bring into the clubs I shoot in. Using a flash for AF assist only is out of the question.

I'm really frustrated in trying to suss this out. I've got a paid shoot coming up for a print job and love the IQ. I thought about a 40D, but I haven't seen the same "je ne sais quoi" from the sample shots. I also have some more polo to shoot into October and really need the camera's Servo ability for that so I can't send my body and primes into Canon. Plus I'm afraid they might much up my Servo mode.

Any more suggestions or ideas to try, please let me know. I'm thinking about renting another 35L or 50/1.4 and testing against mine, but I've picked those lenses over numerous other copies and haven't had anything less than good results with them on my 30D.

Sep 17, 2007 at 06:59 PM

Alistair Watson
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p.33 #20 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Thanks for the background Valerie.

First off, forget +2 on the AI Servo tracking sensitivity. This is the frequency that the AF emits to gain focus lock. I have had good results in 0 and sometimes +1 but as you say, +2 just makes the focussing totally hyper and the results speak for themselves.

Do you still have the 30D? If so, I would use that for your paid gig.

My experiences with the 1D3 in very low light are outstanding, it is in normal sunlight conditions that I have my problem. To that end, after a long conversation with Canon CPS today I am going to send all my gear into Canon next Monday to get it calibrated and body matched. I tend to do this once every 1 1/2 years since my gear has a hard time, cleaning, service and calibration I find ensures each lens is spot on. Perhaps you might find this worthwhile. I certainly do. After a 'free' fun rugby match 2 days ago I have the feeling that my 1D3 is backfocussing and since I cannot be bothered to mess about with micro adjust, it is a short term emergency fix so I have been told by Canon, service centre calibration seems the only way. Certainly working at very wide apertures is going to highlight any front/back focussing issues.

Sep 17, 2007 at 07:11 PM

Valerie S
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p.33 #21 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Alistair Watson wrote:
First off, forget +2 on the AI Servo tracking sensitivity. This is the frequency that the AF emits to gain focus lock. I have had good results in 0 and sometimes +1 but as you say, +2 just makes the focussing totally hyper and the results speak for themselves.

I don't understand that, I thought it controlled how quickly the AF jumps between subjects. If you have a moment, could you elaborate?

Alistair Watson wrote:
Do you still have the 30D? If so, I would use that for your paid gig.

The problem I have isn't in daylight and this is a cd single cover shot in the afternoon. I shot yesterday with a 300/2.8 from noon to 3pm and my Mk III was great in Servo. It's just the primes in club lights that's the problem. I'd be kicking myself using the 30D when the IQ is noticeably better on the Mk III.

Alistair Watson wrote:
My experiences with the 1D3 in very low light are outstanding, it is in normal sunlight conditions that I have my problem. To that end, after a long conversation with Canon CPS today I am going to send all my gear into Canon next Monday to get it calibrated and body matched. I tend to do this once every 1 1/2 years since my gear has a hard time, cleaning, service and calibration I find ensures each lens is spot on. Perhaps you might find this worthwhile.

I've thought about sending them my Mk III and my primes, but I'm not a CPS member and need to better Servo functions that my 30D can do (more polo) for some gigs in early October. I'm worried that the turnaround is going to mess me up. Ironically, this issue with the primes hurts me as much as the Servo issue does for the hardcore sports shooter. Maybe I can find someone to trade with depending on the job

By the way, thanks for your time and concern. I really appreciate it.

Sep 17, 2007 at 07:42 PM

tonyfield
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p.33 #22 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

I am surprised at this problem. If this contines, you might be inclined to have it serviced by Canon. I normally shoot centre spot only - I will give other spots a try to see what happens.

I shoot a lot of very low light events (dance, theatre, jazz, etc) and find that the focus is better than any other camera I have used - for example:

Dance image ISO 6400

Sep 17, 2007 at 07:58 PM

mill4570
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p.33 #23 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Alistair Watson wrote:
Thanks for the background Valerie.

First off, forget +2 on the AI Servo tracking sensitivity. This is the frequency that the AF emits to gain focus lock.

What

Sep 17, 2007 at 08:32 PM

mill4570
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p.33 #24 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Valerie,

If you do not like the idea of carrying a flash unit just for the assist beam, try an ST-E2. It is light and doesn't get in the way and would help the 30D as well as the MKIII. It only works in One Shot AF though.

As others have posted, I do not have a problem with my MKIII in low light. I believe you may have a bigger problem than the RG syndrome.

Richard K.

Sep 17, 2007 at 08:38 PM

Alistair Watson
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p.33 #25 · •Hands-On• Eos 1D Mk III body

Valerie S wrote:
I don't understand that, I thought it controlled how quickly the AF jumps between subjects. If you have a moment, could you elaborate?

I had a long conversation with Canon UK this morning about this very topic.

AI Servo tracking sensitivity controls how often the camera will focus on a subject, ie how often the camera will acquire the camera to subject range data. It also controls how quickly the camera will re-focus on a subject when AF lock is lost. I understand it works very very closely with CFn III 4. If you have CFn III 4 set to 0 (default) then any subject coming between your camera and your subject will cause the camera to instantly (speed determined by AI tracking sensitivity) refocus on this nearer subject. Setting CFn III 4 to 1 maintains the existing subject range data and also uses the predictive algorithms to determine range so any person walking between you and your subject won't cause the AF to jump on the closer target.

This CFn existed on the 1D2N as well but I never felt the need to change it. Canon UK said that few photographers are capable of using the camera set to +2. They gave the example of setting at +2 during a Formula 1 race, and that you were skilled enough to maintain the centre AF point on the driver's helmet at all times then focus lock would never be lost. As crazy as this sounds it kind of makes sense, or maybe my brain is screwed from reading every single technical document to hand on the Mark 3 AF and taking thousands of shots experimenting with each CFn! Either way, I certainly don't know of any sports photographer who uses it successfully, either on the Mark 3 or the Mark 2. I shot at length using +2 at a rugby match and the focus motors worked overtime, I could feel the lens continually hunting, not much but enough to feel the optics moving back and forth slightly, totally hyper and the results were rubbish.

Setting it to 0 or +1 should be fine for what you are doing.

Valerie S wrote:
The problem I have isn't in daylight and this is a cd single cover shot in the afternoon. I shot yesterday with a 300/2.8 from noon to 3pm and my Mk III was great in Servo. It's just the primes in club lights that's the problem. I'd be kicking myself using the 30D when the IQ is noticeably better on the Mk III.

First off, for a CD single cover I don't think anyone would notice the difference between a 1D3 shot and a 30D shot due to the image size. Perhaps I am wrong, I have no experience in this area. but the smaller the print, the less visible the flaws become though it sounds like we both share the same perfectionist traits!

Should I assume that the 300/2.8 works perfectly well wide open in daylight? Are you able to get sharp focussed shots right on the focus point with your other primes in daylight? If so, then this isn't likely to be a calibration issue. If you can't get a sharp shot on your primes in daylight then I would absolutely say send it all in for body/lens matching.

Valerie S wrote:
I've thought about sending them my Mk III and my primes, but I'm not a CPS member and need to better Servo functions that my 30D can do (more polo) for some gigs in early October. I'm worried that the turnaround is going to mess me up. Ironically, this issue with the primes hurts me as much as the Servo issue does for the hardcore sports shooter. Maybe I can find someone to trade with depending on the job

Even if you are not CPS, I would still choose 1 lens and your Mark 3 body and send it in. That way, you can still shoot with your 30D and other lenses. If the Mark 3/lens come back sharp as a nut then you found your problem. Either way, I have become so desperate with my 1D3 this seems like the only viable alternative left to me. Turnaround shouldn't be anymore than a week but I would call your nearest Canon service centre to find out more. It should be free as well since the body is within warranty.

I would rather have an in focus sharp 30D shot with a little more noise (not so visible at the size of your output anyway) than a higher IQ unfocussed shot from a Mark 3 so don't be so hard on your little 30D. Trust me, I have the same opinion of my Mark 2N, it delivers the shots I need, sure it has a little more noise but the results speak for themselves. My 1D3 is now in retirement until it gets calibrated.

Edited by Alistair Watson on Sep 17, 2007 at 08:59 PM GMT

Sep 17, 2007 at 08:47 PM


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