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Archive 2006 · Nikon: No FF!

  
 
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #1 · Nikon: No FF!


Tom Conte wrote:
Yes that's why I switched to Nikon. The 5D was the final straw. For over $3k, that's not nearly as many features nor build quality as it should have. The D200 beats it hands down. I felt like Canon was playing a marketing game and I was the pawn.


Personal preference I guess. 3K was a bargain for me, and it is built *Tough* as nails, fairly resistant to weather intrusions. 20,000 frames and counting, 20 below cold, snow, rain, splashing pool water.

Sorry it did not work for you, but for those who need full frame, it blows the socks off the D200 you are so enamored with.

What are 90% of your shots by the way? How much high risk, danger level, weather level do you incur in your living? It's a daily thing for me.



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:08 AM
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #2 · Nikon: No FF!


Nicodad wrote:
IMHO Things should be measured by what they yield. Did we see a substantial FF breakthrough in the artistic field of photog.? Mostly I saw the same fences, numberplates, and brickwalls I did after 10D, 20D, 300D, 350D. Only difference is corner vignetting at wideangle end.


I and the other pros around me saw a significant improvement in our styles, the ability to articulate DOF better and use lenses the way they were designed. The reason you are seeing the same fences, number plates and brickwalls is because that is what the photographer wanna-bees are most adept at doing. Look elsewhere for the how the limits are bieng pushed.

Edited by Film_Ruled on Feb 01, 2006 at 04:46 PM GMT



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:13 AM
tomasis
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p.3 #3 · Nikon: No FF!


Osai, you better calm down. This is forum. If it disturbs you, why dont you shoot now`?

Pawel, you seem often forget about other aspects of photography. Where are DX primes? If I want use equivalent 50/1.4, 35/2 reasonably priced? because 50mm is normal lens. Why is Nikon waiting with to release simple primes low light if they are selling dx sensors already a few years.

The guy with 300mm and 1d mark takes MUCH better shot, therefore he can also shoot with 70-200 and crop the image. VOILA, it is nearly same shot as 20D. Like as with D2x with crop mode.

IF the body has same size with dx or FF , so it doesnt matter about convenience except prices of 35mm sensors. Only Canon will set lower price point for those things in future.. Nikon is waiting for it.



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:22 AM
Mark Jamison
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p.3 #4 · Nikon: No FF!


Tom Conte wrote:
There are two Canons that hold a special place in my heart for out of camera picture quality, and they are the 1D ("mark I") and 1Ds (also "mark I). Both have their operational shortcomings on the digital side, namely the 1D has no zoom in image review and the 1Ds is slooow when reviewing images (although not Oly E-10 slow, that was silly-slow... the 1Ds is liveable, just not up to the standards of today).

That being said, I do like the "Nikon look" quite a bit.

Tom


Hi Tom,

I noticed that your special Canon cameras are the ones I remember wanting and loving. I would also add the D30, which was also something special, even if it was limited. Have you noticed though that Canon's best cameras were "before" they became noise obsessed?



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:34 AM
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #5 · Nikon: No FF!


Pavel wrote:
The cropped cameras have their advantages being felt very strongly - and growing.
Just go to a soccer game and shoot with a canon 20D next to a 1Ds. If you need the same reach you have a 70-200 on the 20D and are doing the same work as that guy with the 1Ds who needs that huge 300 for the same reach. The 70-200 is now used by many sports shooters on a budget or for caryability - due mostly to the cropped sensor making it a viable length. Thats convenience.
Convenience and miniaturization wins every time.

So yes there are advantages
...Show more

Why dude? Why, ALWAYS such utter BS!!!!

The statement of going to a soccer game about says it all. Pure amateur nonsense filling the heads of all the other amateurs with more nonsense, incredible.

Growing, huh? How you know this? And the weight and reach thing? Good GOD dude, let it be, it is BS too!!! I have posted the same weight stats more than 5 times on the net and the Nikon gear is no size or weight advantage. A 35mm 1.4 weighs more than a 50mm 1.4.

The only argument you can come up with is the lame 70-200 one. It does not give you more REACH!!! It is still a 70-200, not a 300mm, it is just C R O P P E D! Remember? Your cameras crop the image, not reach out and touch someone.

And lastly, the only lenses that are needing a redesign are poor on cropped cameras too!!! The 16-35 is so-so, the 20mm 2.8 is blah, the 14 2.8 is too film specific. But the rest? Phenomenal!!! Now, would it NOT stand to reason that Canon is designing new glass on that end? Are you just a total.....never mind? Get a *Clue* mister know it all.

Read this loud and clear: Nikon makes good cameras and lenses, the ergos are better but not so much that a good pro can't be as fast on a Canon. Personal preference. But some of the best gear in the world. We can all agree on that, right? But, Canon? It is really good too, SHOCKER!

The full frame and Canon bashing has GOT to stop guys, it makes you all look SO incredibly insecure and to be without an ounce of talent and needing of a life. Canon makes full frame cameras because that is what many want and need. They do a fantastic job at it and even with all the drawbacks, in practice and in print, this full frame gear allows a full range of styles and techniques to be employed by the talented and discerning pro or advanced amateur. JUUUUUST have respect for those who have made the choice based on real world needs, not marketing or envy.

STOP THE BS.....and once and for all, be happy with your choice, but for F_ck sake, stop filling the net with unfounded BS!!!! It is sickening!

So while you are having a "We are ignorant" party, some of us are breaking new ground withe right gear for our needs. Try moonlit aerial landscapes for size. Can't do the same shots with Nikon because they CROP!!! Oh, I know, that is not a 3A podunk soccer game so you can't relate..

Enjoy your cameras, but stop the BS. I mean really...STOP IT!

Sound off the charts harsh? Perhaps, but it is only to the level of ignorance and brand-boy BS I see on an otherwise great forum.

Edited by Film_Ruled on Feb 01, 2006 at 04:45 PM GMT



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:39 AM
Mark Jamison
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p.3 #6 · Nikon: No FF!


tomasis wrote:

The guy with 300mm and 1d mark takes MUCH better shot, therefore he can also shoot with 70-200 and crop the image. VOILA, it is nearly same shot as 20D. Like as with D2x with crop mode.


I honestly cannot believe someone actually wrote the above. In what reality do you live? While better shooters tend to be drawn to professional grade cameras it is by no means an exclusive club. No body has to pass some test to get a Canon 1 series or a Nikon 2 series camera, they merely have to pony up the requisite cash.

If you really believe that a camera, regardless of the type, means you take better shots, well then I suggest you find another hobby or profession.



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:41 AM
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #7 · Nikon: No FF!


Mark Jamison wrote:
I honestly cannot believe someone actually wrote the above. In what reality do you live? While better shooters tend to be drawn to professional grade cameras it is by no means an exclusive club. No body has to pass some test to get a Canon 1 series or a Nikon 2 series camera, they merely have to pony up the requisite cash.

If you really believe that a camera, regardless of the type, means you take better shots, well then I suggest you find another hobby or profession.


Welcome to the sickening wanna-be world of the internet. My FTP is done now so back out the door into the real world I go.

There are those who watch the Discovery channel. And there are those who don't have time to because they are on it.



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:49 AM
jmcfadden
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p.3 #8 · Nikon: No FF!


Mark Jamison wrote:
Hi Tom,

I noticed that your special Canon cameras are the ones I remember wanting and loving. I would also add the D30, which was also something special, even if it was limited. Have you noticed though that Canon's best cameras were "before" they became noise obsessed?



Mark

My favorite Canon's are in this order

D30, 1D , and 1Ds and it ends there I am afraid


J




Feb 01, 2006 at 11:53 AM
Cliff L.
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p.3 #9 · Nikon: No FF!


Film_Ruled wrote:
Why dude? Why, ALWAYS such utter BS!!!!

The statement of going to a soccer game about says it all. Pure amateur nonsense filling the heads of all the other amateurs with more nonsense, incredible.

Growing, huh? How you know this? And the weight and reach thing? Good GOD dude, let it be, it is BS too!!! I have posted the same weight stats more than 5 times on the net and the Nikon gear is no size or weight advantage. A 35mm 1.4 weighs more than a 50mm 1.4.

The only argument you can come up with is the lame 70-200
...Show more

Wow... what is it that makes the Canon shooters so incredibly paranoid and insecure about their brand that they feel compelled to troll other forums and post wild rants?

Canon's marketing seems to play to this obsessive fear of not being part of the "in" crowd. Take those ads showing all the white lenses along the sidelines of sporting events... you have to conform, and be part of the flock of sheep, or you aren't a real "pro". It sort of reminds me of the old axiom about an infinite number of monkeys and an infinite number of typewriters being able to eventually duplicate the complete works of Shakespeare... the modern analogy would be an infinite number of monkeys with an infinite number of Canon cameras - eventually they would produce one in-focus photo...



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:53 AM
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #10 · Nikon: No FF!


Osai wrote:
Bottom line here is MEASUREBATION. It seems that Canon users have trying to justify their expenditures on equipment forever!! How many of these Canon pposters acutually have a MK II ? The 5D isn't a true FF (check your dimensions).
I find it truly amazing how hung up we are about sensor size!! Give me a break!! I've seen some great images on this site taken with 4 and 5 mp equipment. How many of you guys really have the talent, skills and clients that require a MK II? How many of you have a 350D and are crowing about how
...Show more

That would go for most of the Nikon members too.



Feb 01, 2006 at 11:54 AM
Film_Ruled
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p.3 #11 · Nikon: No FF!


molson wrote:
Wow... what is it that makes the Canon shooters so incredibly paranoid and insecure about their brand that they feel compelled to troll other forums and post wild rants?

Canon's marketing seems to play to this obsessive fear of not being part of the "in" crowd. Take those ads showing all the white lenses along the sidelines of sporting events... you have to conform, and be part of the flock of sheep, or you aren't a real "pro". It sort of reminds me of the old axiom about an infinite number of monkeys and an infinite number of typewriters being
...Show more

I use Nikon gear too and will come here whenever I want. Once and awhile, I see the same nonsense getting spewed out and will chime in. If you don't like it, skip it. I use Canon, Nikon and Hasselblad panoramic in my work, and I don't troll dude. I am not insecure, it's just that other people who are looking for answers may take Pavel's BS as gospel and that would be shame. So I am here to help out. I don't come here often or any site for that matter as I do have better things to do, but really, glad to be of assistance in putting some reality back on this thread..sure you appreciate it....unless you are insecure.

"Canon and Nikon gear... and never enough time to use it" and nearly 3,000 posts.....Hmmmm.....

I can see the math and insecurity brimming in your head already...


Edited by Film_Ruled on Feb 01, 2006 at 05:06 PM GMT



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:03 PM
tomasis
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p.3 #12 · Nikon: No FF!


Mark Jamison wrote:
I honestly cannot believe someone actually wrote the above. In what reality do you live? While better shooters tend to be drawn to professional grade cameras it is by no means an exclusive club. No body has to pass some test to get a Canon 1 series or a Nikon 2 series camera, they merely have to pony up the requisite cash.

If you really believe that a camera, regardless of the type, means you take better shots, well then I suggest you find another hobby or profession.


I believe you misunderstood me. Did you have a opportunity to try out both 1d markI and Canon 20D with 300mm/2.8, 70-200, teleconverter under moto, gocart races? I did it. It was huge difference to control one of those bodies, while waiting for capturing. Thanks to larger viewfinder and other stuffs (appreciated by pros), I did have fun with 1D. 20D was the nightmare but I was able also to take nice shoots too. But at much lower percentage of suceed shots, also I did have to use manual mode. It was not such case with 1D.

The same photographer is able to take better photos with better equipment. Isnt simple?



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:04 PM
EllitoGuy
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p.3 #13 · Nikon: No FF!


molson wrote:
Wow... what is it that makes the Canon shooters so incredibly paranoid and insecure about their brand that they feel compelled to troll other forums and post wild rants?

Canon's marketing seems to play to this obsessive fear of not being part of the "in" crowd. Take those ads showing all the white lenses along the sidelines of sporting events... you have to conform, and be part of the flock of sheep, or you aren't a real "pro". It sort of reminds me of the old axiom about an infinite number of monkeys and an infinite number of typewriters being
...Show more


dude youre an ass



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:11 PM
fotografur
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p.3 #14 · Nikon: No FF!


There goes the neighborhood



:0)



d~



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:25 PM
joesmith
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p.3 #15 · Nikon: No FF!


fotografur wrote:
There goes the neighborhood

:0)

d~



Second that



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:27 PM
joesmith
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p.3 #16 · Nikon: No FF!


I'll offer another reason why Nikon does not make FF camera yet.

Canon makes their own sensors for all their camera while Nikon source most of their sensors from Sony. It takes multi millions of dollar to research and develope a sensor. Nikon decided to off load the sensor developement cost to Sony and spend the money on developing the bodys. Canon has been producing cmos sensor for few years and was able to reduce the cost and up the yield at production. Sony is still catching up to Canon on sensor development. I would not doubt that Sony will have a FF cmos sensor in the next couple year. Then Nikon will have a FF camera.



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:36 PM
jmcfadden
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p.3 #17 · Nikon: No FF!


joesmith wrote:
I'll offer another reason why Nikon does not make FF camera yet.

Canon makes their own sensors for all their camera while Nikon source most of their sensors from Sony. It takes multi millions of dollar to research and develope a sensor. Nikon decided to off load the sensor developement cost to Sony and spend the money on developing the bodys. Canon has been producing cmos sensor for few years and was able to reduce the cost up the yield at production. Sony is still catching up to Canon on sensor development. I would not doubt that Sony will have
...Show more


Sony already Has a FF sensor at 20+MP............



Feb 01, 2006 at 12:39 PM
Mark Jamison
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p.3 #18 · Nikon: No FF!


jmcfadden wrote:
Mark

My favorite Canon's are in this order

D30, 1D , and 1Ds and it ends there I am afraid

J




Hi John, that's my list as well. And it stops there too. I wish I could recommend the later versions, but I honestly cannot. Doesn't mean someone cannot do fantastic things with the newer cameras of course, just means I cannot in good conscious reccommend them.




Feb 01, 2006 at 12:58 PM
Mark Jamison
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p.3 #19 · Nikon: No FF!


jmcfadden wrote:
Sony already Has a FF sensor at 20+MP............


And I believe LBCAST sensors are made in-house.



Feb 01, 2006 at 01:00 PM
tomasis
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p.3 #20 · Nikon: No FF!


Mark Jamison wrote:
Hi John, that's my list as well. And it stops there too. I wish I could recommend the later versions, but I honestly cannot. Doesn't mean someone cannot do fantastic things with the newer cameras of course, just means I cannot in good conscious reccommend them.



You cannot recommend them because you dont have the latest? I just joke. If anyone is able to afford his earned money from photography to newer equipment, so why not?

Funny that I dont have Canon cameras, but I defend the Canon marketing, hehe


Edited by tomasis on Feb 01, 2006 at 07:13 PM GMT



Feb 01, 2006 at 01:11 PM
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