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Archive 2017 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?

  
 
billsamuels
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


I've been trying to figure out why photo paper mostly comes in 8.5 X 11 while frames mostly come in 8 X 10. The only, 8.5 X 11 frames are diploma frames, to which there are very few to chose from. Am I missing something?




Dec 13, 2017 at 07:28 PM
Nick Birkett
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


I think the sizing choice for frames probably goes back to the days of film where large-format negatives were 8x10 (aspect ratio 1.25). The more common 35 mm film was 36mmx24mm for an aspect ratio of 1.5 which matches the 4x6 frame size. No film came in 8.5x11 (aspect ratio 1.29) or sizes similar to paper like A4 or legal.

B&H sells photo paper in about 50 different sizes from 2"x4" to 48"x48". So, you can certainly buy photo paper to fit specific frames sizes. The 8.5x11 paper may be more popular because a lot of people use the same paper to print reports, letters, etc and just include some photos, rather than using it as a primary medium to print pictures for display..



Dec 13, 2017 at 07:54 PM
chez
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


Most photos that get put into frames are also matted...so for an 8x10 frame I would typically put a 5x7 photo matted to 8x10. an 8.5x11 print fits nicely into an 11x14 frame after matting.


Dec 13, 2017 at 07:57 PM
Nick Birkett
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


chez wrote:
Most photos that get put into frames are also matted...so for an 8x10 frame I would typically put a 5x7 photo matted to 8x10. an 8.5x11 print fits nicely into an 11x14 frame after matting.

Very true - I completely forgot about matting Being into numbers, I just jumped to aspect ratios.



Dec 13, 2017 at 08:26 PM
billsamuels
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


chez wrote:
Most photos that get put into frames are also matted...so for an 8x10 frame I would typically put a 5x7 photo matted to 8x10. an 8.5x11 print fits nicely into an 11x14 frame after matting.


Chez,
I think that's the secret! I never thought about it either, but that seems to be it. I usually get larger frames with 8x10 matting, so the photos have to be either cut, or I have to decide what I want to leave out. But my own 8.5x11 matting in the 11x14 frame sounds like a better option.
Thanks!



Dec 14, 2017 at 12:32 AM
Alan321
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


Also note that adding equal margins around any standard aspect ratio will give you a different aspect ratio. It does not scale up to a bigger size with the same aspect ratio.

And you also may not want the margins to all be equal.



Dec 14, 2017 at 05:31 AM
jforkner
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


Think of hotdogs and buns. Hot dogs come in packages of 10; buns in packages of 8. Same principal.


Feb 28, 2020 at 08:49 AM
mrca
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


I don't crop my images to a cookie cutter size. I crop them to maximize the image. Then I cut a mat window to fit the resulting image at an overall standard frame size. You do not necessarily want equal size amount of mat on top and bottom. Some shots benefit from the lower mat area larger than the top. It givews a visually "heavier" base.


Feb 28, 2020 at 09:40 AM
chez
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


mrca wrote:
I don't crop my images to a cookie cutter size. I crop them to maximize the image. Then I cut a mat window to fit the resulting image at an overall standard frame size. You do not necessarily want equal size amount of mat on top and bottom. Some shots benefit from the lower mat area larger than the top. It givews a visually "heavier" base.


Exactly. If all prints are displayed in cookie cutter matts / frames...well you just get cookies. I also cut aluminum frames to custom sizes which better match the matting and photo.



Feb 28, 2020 at 10:02 AM
guidostow
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


chez wrote:
...snip...
I also cut aluminum frames to custom sizes which better match the matting and photo.


chez, where do you get your aluminum molding stock?

TIA,

guido



Feb 28, 2020 at 01:59 PM
chez
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


guidostow wrote:
chez, where do you get your aluminum molding stock?

TIA,

guido


I get my molding through a local framer who orders for multiple people allowing for bulk discounts. Don't know exactly where he order from.



Feb 28, 2020 at 03:51 PM
guidostow
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


Quite a closed market isn't it...

Thanks anyway!



Feb 28, 2020 at 08:14 PM
Camperjim
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


After many years of shooting, I typically compose in camera and do not want to crop my photos when post processing. I certainly do not want to crop differently when I print the same image at different sizes.

I have pretty much arrived at a systematic way of printing, matting and framing. At least 90% of my images fall into the same standardized sizes/aspect ratios. Some images really do benefit from special cropping.

For proofs and small prints, I typically use 8 1/2 x 11 paper. I have large amounts that I bought on sale. I do not crop to fit the paper. Instead my print size is about 7.3 x 10.9. That leaves a small border for matting and to prevent overspray when printing. I typically do not display at this size but when I do I use 11x14 frames which can be found anywhere. I also have some aluminum channel, Nielson frames for a more professional look. For medium sized prints, I print at 12x18 on 13x19 paper and use 16x22 frames. For larger prints, my Epson 3880 limits me to 17" paper so I print 16x24 on 17x25 paper. I use 20x28 frames. BTW, going any larger is way more expensive. For example mats would double in cost for just a slight increase in size. At 20x28 I can use half sized 20x32 matboard.

I love Red River papers because of the quality, variety and all of the RR papers are available in 17x25 sheets. Many other manufacturers and vendors seem to be lost in the past and sell 17x22 sheet papers. That means I would need to crop my images just to match their paper. If I wanted to continue with the standard 1.5 aspect ratio, I would need to print at 14x21.




Feb 29, 2020 at 08:12 AM
elkhornsun
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


11x14 and 16x24 are better aligned with 3:2 size image files. For 8x10's I loved it when Nikon introduced a 5:4 crop in the camera with the D3 in 2007. When I knew that I was going to be producing 8x10 image files for clients I could do this in the camera and avoid post process cropping entirely.

It is worth looking at availabe frame and precut mat sizes before producing prints. There are places that sell frames and mats for 12x18 prints and these allow for prints with no cropping needed.




Mar 07, 2020 at 03:35 PM
chez
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


elkhornsun wrote:
11x14 and 16x24 are better aligned with 3:2 size image files. For 8x10's I loved it when Nikon introduced a 5:4 crop in the camera with the D3 in 2007. When I knew that I was going to be producing 8x10 image files for clients I could do this in the camera and avoid post process cropping entirely.

It is worth looking at availabe frame and precut mat sizes before producing prints. There are places that sell frames and mats for 12x18 prints and these allow for prints with no cropping needed.



I will never let the Matt and frame dictate my dimensions of the prints. Totally backwards IMHO. The print is king and the Matt / frame are there to enhance the appearance of the print, not the other way around.




Mar 07, 2020 at 07:50 PM
JohnSil
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


jforkner wrote:
Think of hotdogs and buns. Hot dogs come in packages of 10; buns in packages of 8. Same principal.


That's why anytime I buy hot-dogs, I buy 8 packs of hot dogs and 10 packs of buns!!!
I could actually get 4 of hot dogs and 5 of buns but I'd run out before dinner!!! LoL
John



Mar 27, 2020 at 12:37 AM
mrca
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Paper sizes vs. Frame sizes - what am I missing?


First, I don't eat hotdogs, but white hots/coneys instead. Second I don't use buns, don't need the carbs but use the mustard and pickle relish. I do buy hot dogs, but for my resident blue heron, great and snow egets and wood storks. Most are off breeding the next couple of months but will return in June famished. They are hot dog afficianados and really like the costco ones. However, the small snow egret either mistakes my toes for hot dog slices or is trying to tell me to get off my butt and get some for him because he has bitten my toes twice while I was sitting out back reading.


Mar 27, 2020 at 04:25 PM





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