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Which path forward? for Me?
Limp on - Switch when 5dsr v2 arrives
Move to Adobe bridge / Photoshop / Manual file System
Swith to Light Room - you will like it after a few months
Other - Solution

Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?
  
 
Scott Stoness
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


I have about 10tb of aperture files. I could wean this down to 3TB maybe but that's work and drives keep getting bigger and my time shorter. But I keep worrying about when aperture will eiher i) not work on the upgraded Mac OS, ii) not work on my upgraded camera, or iii) when I will change computers and make it obsolete.

I like it - I am familiar with it and for me its intuitive - likely because I grew with it. But its daunting that I would have to convert to light room or bridge or something. I tried LR last week and it felt like an akward version of aperture - it was not pleasant. And now adobe is going for this cloud crap. Try putting 10tb on the cloud. So I am worried about putting another years effort into a proprietary file system..And my noodling with LR - it does not let you move the files outside of LR.

Anyway, I read today that Aperture has stopped updating raw conversion of new cameras. The 5div, the d850 are not supported?
https://www.apple.com/aperture/specs/raw.html

So it appears when the next version of 5dsr comes out (next year?) I will have to make a switch. I know I can convert to dng and import but my past experience is that is painful.

I have some chrismas vacation that I might start the conversion..

Choices are
1) wait for next year?
2) Go with Adobe bridge and a manual file system and Photoshop 6 (can use DPP, or whatever)
3) LR after a month or two is worth it and unlikely to be made obsolete with cloud
4) Other?

What's your advice?

Photography is my fun (wife would say obsession). I focus on Landscape (use aperture for file system and weaning down to chosen few and then always use photoshop/layers /Photomatix hdr blends with original tiffs). In addition I shoot lots of large animals (bears, moose, wolves and do lots of layer work in photoshop).Its rare that I don't do some kind of destructive editing on the tiff's

Scott



Dec 11, 2017 at 07:42 PM
gdsf2
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Capture One Pro


Dec 11, 2017 at 08:06 PM
Chris Court
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


I don't have a good answer to your question except to suggest Lightroom, which I am loath to do, not because the software is bad (it's not), but due to Adobe's push to a subscription-only business model.

I wish that instead of just pulling the plug on Aperture, Apple would set it free in some way, either by open-sourcing it or selling to another company. If Nikon, for example, were to acquire Aperture, I for one would be an enthusiastic buyer.

C



Dec 11, 2017 at 08:26 PM
butchM
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Scott Stoness wrote:
.Its rare that I don't do some kind of destructive editing on the tiff's

Scott


Here's another possible option to consider. You could migrate your Aperture library to the Photos app for macOS (included free with the OS) to handle your organization chores and initial RAW conversions, though it currently is not as fully capable in some aspects as Aperture in organization (color labels comes to mind) .... but it uses the same RAW conversion engine as Aperture ... only more current and is updated regularly as new cameras are introduced. The current version of Photos for macOS is quite improved over the first release from a few years ago and will only get better.

Before you migrate, be sure to keep a working copy of your Aperture library file if you ever wish to import it into another option like Lightroom or C1.

Then, pick up Affinity Photo for a one-time $50 fee to edit your tiffs. Very Photoshop like, much leaner footprint and is actually more efficient in many respects.

If, after some time testing the waters with this combination ... the other options will still be there and you won't have invested too much time, effort and financial resources to test the waters.



Dec 11, 2017 at 08:30 PM
lighthound
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Well, being that you're already using PS, why not just upgrade it to CC then you get LR for free so to speak.
For the normal basic editing tasks, I can't imagine anything being as simple and straightforward as LR. I don't use the cataloging feature and if I do move things around outside of LR I just make sure I follow up by going into LR to "Sync" the affected folders.

I personally don't fear them ever forcing everyone to upload their images to the cloud somewhere down the road. The minute they did that they would be signing their death warrant as surely a mass exodus would ensue. Myself included.

The longer I've been sucked into the CC rental thing the more comfortable I am about it.
I figure if I keep shooting until I'm 80 years old (approx 30 yrs) and the price stays about the same (which it won't) I will have spent $3600 on all the needed software I would ever need for this money pit hobby.

How much did you spend on your last body and will you be using it for the next 30 years?

Plus $10/mo is really easy to sneak past the wife.

Dave



Dec 11, 2017 at 08:30 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Your description of Lightroom as feeling like an "awkward version of Aperture" is more apt than you might know. LR was rushed out the door (as a beta product!) when Aperture was released, as Aperture was the first (and arguably last) credible threat to the market dominance of Adobe and Photoshop. Not only that, but there were reports that the two products (Aperture and Lightroom) evolved from sources including members of the same development team.

I was in the loop with Aperture from the very beginning due to a relationship I had with Apple at the time. I really, really wanted to see the program succeed, but the writing was soon on the wall ó for several reasons: Apple's move away from the professional creative apps strategy and Adobe's success with Lightroom.

It is always hard moving from an environment you know intuitively and to a new one that will require you to relearn things that are easy for you to do in the familiar environment.

In your case, I'd probably go to Lightroom. I say this as a person who is not primarily a Lightroom user himself. (I prefer to work in the world of Adobe Bridge/ACR and Photoshop.) Once you get past the differences in the interface, I think you'll find that it is extremely powerful and ultimately quite friendly. Plus, you will also get Photoshop as part of the package, and if you end up liking it you can move in that direction, too.

On that subject, and speaking as a person who was originally extremely opposed to the Adobe monthly fee and subscription model, I recommend simply getting the CC photography package. It is about $10/month and in includes LR, ACR, and Photoshop. Adobe hasn't raised the price at all and they do continue to update and improve the programs.

Good luck!

Dan



Dec 11, 2017 at 08:36 PM
joel dowling
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


I have been weighing a switch to Capture One for a few years, though Aperture has held a grasp on me that I can't shake.

I loathe Lightroom.



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:02 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


gdsf2 wrote:
Capture One Pro


IMO the two best converters right now are Capture One Pro 11 and DxO Photolab. DxO purchased Nik from Google and incorporated Nikís U-point tech as well as brush and gradient tools to do localised adjustments. Itís lens profiles are better than Adobes, it extracts more detail and offers more features. It can appear daunting at first but you donít have to use all of the panels and can turn off the little used ones. Iím just as proficient in DxO as LR now. Capture One is also amazing and has had localised adjustments via layers for a long time and further improved this in v11. It also has the best colour handling and is extracting superb detail from my files. The only thing I hate is how it handles catalogs. An interesting alternative is Luminair, but at this stage it seems too basic for my liking, unless Iím missing something, but it can turn out very nice results. Iím waiting for the big update before giving it another go.

Almost forgot about RAW Therapee, has a good following, is free, is feature packed and is regularly updated. Havenít tried it yet, but will give it a whirl over the X-mas break

Try DxO Photolab and C1 Pro 11 and I think youíll be impressed .


Edited on Dec 11, 2017 at 11:00 PM · View previous versions



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:02 PM
Scott Stoness
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Thanks for the above:

I will read it in more detail when I get home.

$/month or $ is not a consideration to me - its my time. I don't want to convert systems twice or more. This might take me a week and buying a 10tb hard drive- which is far more valuable than a several years of software.



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:05 PM
ggreene
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Pixel Perfect wrote:
An interesting alternative is Luminaire, but at this stage it seems too basic for my liking, unless Iím issuing something, but it can turn out very nice results. Iím waiting for the big update before giving it another go.


Me too. Don't necessarily need to switch but am interested in what they come up with when they add cataloging to it.



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:21 PM
 

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charlyw
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Scott Stoness wrote:
Thanks for the above:

I will read it in more detail when I get home.

$/month or $ is not a consideration to me - its my time. I don't want to convert systems twice or more. This might take me a week and buying a 10tb hard drive- which is far more valuable than a several years of software.


Lightroom doesnít use any propriarity file formats or databases for organizing your images. The transistion seems to be quite straight forward: http://lightroomsolutions.com/articles/migrating-from-aperture-to-lightroom-where-do-i-begin/

And as far as the cloud argument is concerned, which some will bring up here, do you feel that if your preferred car manufacturer presents a new product line like a small SUV that the people carrier or sports car line you prefer is under threat of being discontinued? No? Then why feel that the new cloud based additional version is a threat to the local resource version? They simply complement each other rather nicely in a changing environment.



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:25 PM
Scott Stoness
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


charlyw wrote:
Lightroom doesnít use any propriarity file formats or databases for organizing your images. The transistion seems to be quite straight forward: http://lightroomsolutions.com/articles/migrating-from-aperture-to-lightroom-where-do-i-begin/

And as far as the cloud argument is concerned, which some will bring up here, do you feel that if your preferred car manufacturer presents a new product line like a small SUV that the people carrier or sports car line you prefer is under threat of being discontinued? No? Then why feel that the new cloud based additional version is a threat to the local resource version? They simply complement each other rather nicely in a changing environment.


There are several risks with Adobe - eg.

they could triple their price the week after I got it converted. After spending a week or so and a month to be familiar it would be hard to switch. Eg. they have me hooked and they can milk me. [the only thing that keeps them in check is supply/demand and competition but I fear the high switching cost would keep me and you there.

They could split professional (non cloud)l from amateur (cloud) and triple professional (including me).

they could be bought by Microsoft/other and blended into some mess that is Microsoft/other, causing me regret [unlikey they are big]

They could change their product to be even more proprietary


Adobe is the business of maximizing profit by hook or by crook just like everyone else.



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:37 PM
charlyw
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Scott Stoness wrote:
There are several risks with Adobe - eg.

they could triple their price the week after I got it converted.


Just to answer one of your very absurd ideas: No they can't triple their price because the price is always based on a year's worth subscription - so the price you get your subscription for will stay the same for a year no matter what (independent of you paying monthly or yearly) - and that fear mongering has been around ever since they went subscription - and they haven't increased price for most. Only those that have seen their currencies drop in exchange rates have seen compensatory increases in the subscription price. So a triple price is quite ludicrous!



Dec 11, 2017 at 09:52 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


joel dowling wrote:
I have been weighing a switch to Capture One for a few years, though Aperture has held a grasp on me that I can't shake.

I loathe Lightroom.


I'm personally not a Lightroom fan (I'm a Photoshop user, instead) but so many of my friends and colleagues, including some who also use C1, rely on it as their core application. Betting against it may not be the best choice for most folks these days.

One of the things that the Adobe products do that hasn't been equaled by competition to date is provide an end-to-end integration of raw conversion, "development," printing, export, and asset management.

Scott Stoness wrote:
There are several risks with Adobe - eg.

they could triple their price the week after I got it converted. After spending a week or so and a month to be familiar it would be hard to switch. Eg. they have me hooked and they can milk me. [the only thing that keeps them in check is supply/demand and competition but I fear the high switching cost would keep me and you there.


That was precisely one of my major objections to the subscription model, and I wrote publicly about it at the time. However, since that time there has been no increase in price ó and, in fact, they introduced the current less-expensive package for photographers in response to their customer base.

They could split professional (non cloud)l from amateur (cloud) and triple professional (including me).

Hmmm. Hadn't thought of that one. I doubt it will happen. In any case, the current license is for the professional level applications. Their "enthusiast" product is already less expensive.

they could be bought by Microsoft/other and blended into some mess that is Microsoft/other, causing me regret [unlikey they are big]

Unlikely, indeed. And, probably more likely that one of the smaller competitors that you might consider would be the target of a buyout.

They could change their product to be even more proprietary

Adobe is the business of maximizing profit by hook or by crook just like everyone else.

Key words: "... just like everyone else." ;-)

Dan



Dec 11, 2017 at 10:03 PM
bluejbill
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Scott Stoness wrote:
There are several risks with Adobe - eg.

they could triple their price the week after I got it converted. After spending a week or so and a month to be familiar it would be hard to switch. Eg. they have me hooked and they can milk me. [the only thing that keeps them in check is supply/demand and competition but I fear the high switching cost would keep me and you there.

They could split professional (non cloud)l from amateur (cloud) and triple professional (including me).

they could be bought by Microsoft/other and blended into some mess that is Microsoft/other, causing
...Show more

Well, now you let us know that you are in fact an Adobe hater! Not surprising, there's a lot of that going around. Not my favorite company either, but most of your concerns here are greater IMHO if you choose a less popular software package- they are more likely than LR to go under or as Dan said be bought out.

If it is the subscription that bothers you, then by all means go in another direction. For myself, when a pro photographer told me a few years ago that he used it and said "Just get it", I did. there's some things that I don't like about it but overall it is a powerful package that has kept on getting better. And I am very used to the interface, despite being an Apple user myself.

Probably the best ten bucks I spend each month!

CAVEAT I'm just a hobbyist, don't look for pro advice here!



Dec 12, 2017 at 12:01 AM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Word of warning about LR Classic CC. There is a very large thread at the Adobe forums complaining about the woeful performance of LR on very high end systems. Many of us have tried all fixes and with not much luck. LR can appear to work well for about 10-20 minutes but it then dramatically slows down and only closing and restarting fixes this. This could mean there's a huge memory leak. Adobe have replicated the issue on certain Mac's but I've heard nothing about PC's. For this reason alone I'd avoid it for now and try DxO Photolab or C1 Pro 11 which fly on my machine. BTW it's only LR running like a dog, PS CC 2018 runs fine.


Dec 12, 2017 at 12:15 AM
EGrav
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


Capture One Pro!


Dec 12, 2017 at 12:34 AM
Gochugogi
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


I'm still using Aperture but my cameras are oldó80d and 6Dóso no rush to switch. I tried LR back in the day but preferred Aperture. I'll probably port everything over to Photos, apparently adjustments transfer, and start anew with LR or Capture One Pro when I buy a new camera.


Dec 12, 2017 at 01:05 AM
dallvr
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


When it became apparent that Apple wasn't updating Aperture (2013 or so), I moved kicking and screaming to LR. After I got used to the interface, memorized some key commands to navigate, I grew to like it. In addition, while Aperture stagnated, LR added improved noise reduction, lens corrections, the ability to merge raw files into panoramas or HDR and a host of other improvements. Now I love it, and have become proficient and speedy at processing my raw files with it. I wasn't a fan of the subscription model, but the price for LR and PS is pretty reasonable IMO.

BTW, when I converted my Aperture libraries to LR catalogues, Adobe had a plugin that was a big help. It at least kept my ratings and the list of keywords that I had used in Aperture and brought them into the new LR catalogues. There was still processing that had to be repeated, but it wasn't like starting from scratch.




Dec 12, 2017 at 02:45 AM
DonM2
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Aperture on its Last Leg - Replacement?


To Whom It May Concern:

When Adobe finally gets a bit beyond their idea of critical mass for their 'cloud' products, you can rest assured the subscription fees are going to start rising!! Possibly sooner than later, actually.

Elsewhere: I've played with some replacement programs for PS and LR but my first 'turn off' with several of these is NO INTERNAL LIBRARY included. And in some, the printing function may or may not be present, and if it is, poorly designed in an otherwise reasonable product for editing alone.

One alternate app that I'm using and does hold potential: ACDsee Ultimate 9. It has the internal library mode, non-destructive editing (no independent history catalog, however) and a bit limited but still useful printing function.

I still use LR 5.7 a lot; PS 6 much less. And I'm in the middle of trials with DxO Photo Lab.

Finally, I've never shot for pay. But I'm a serious camera nut for about 75 years. Obviously, you pros are going to have a different 'take', likely starting with volume of output. It is what it is.

Thanks for reading.........

...... DonM2



Dec 12, 2017 at 03:34 AM
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