Home · Register · Software · Software · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username  

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Nikon Forum | Join Upload & Sell

1       2      
3
       end
  

Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.
  
 
designdog
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Very good review, Steve! Like your others, and your books, which I have found very helpful.

However, there are some assumptions in your review, either implied or indicated by you (but perhaps not as thoroughly as I would like) that directly impact the performance of the D850 — and the reasons I moved away from the D810 and am not getting the D850.

You, sir, are a very thorough person; very well disciplined and your photography is well thought out. You may poke fun at yourself in referring to mistakes that you have made with this or that piece of equipment, but these mistakes, I suspect, are nothing compared to what the typical photographer might experience.

Steve, your equipment is top tier. You have the finest and latest lenses, the best tripods and heads, the best accessories. The typical photographer in your audience, while managing to afford the D850, could in no way match your supporting equipment purchases.

Finally, you are a professional, with years of experience. You know how to use a camera, how to brace it, how to get the best balance of iso, aperture, and shutter speed. In short, how to get the most out of a high resolution camera - and, perhaps more importantly, you can look at one of your images and know whether you have achieved that, or what went wrong.

I shot with a D810 for about two years. When I first got it, like many, I was enthusiastic about the resolution. I viewed countless shots at 100% on my computer; I bought the best lenses out there (I owned the entire Zeiss ZF.2 lineup among others, the ART series, the Nikon Trinity); I got the best tripod I could find, etc. etc. And, after a time, I grew tired of it.

If I did everything right, the stars and moon were properly aligned, I got a photo that was in focus at very high resolution. Wait. Thats it? That’s what all of the money and effort were for? The color was no better than my other cameras, the controls were not as good, a lot of the time, especially in low light, the camera was tough to focus, and, if I tried to hand hold the camera I was faced with compromising shutter speed and/or iso - just to get that one shot. And, truth be told, many of my photos were still out of focus.

My photography was no better. I was working too hard at it and not enjoying myself. I was living in the 100% view. I sold the D810 and got a D5, a camera that does everything I want it to and feels good doing it.

Now along comes the D850. Certainly more features, and better AF. But also more pixels, so the challenges are even greater, and, for many, the costs, financial and otherwise, are even greater. My view is that, unless you are prepared to spend the money, effort, and a lot of time on a tripod, the rewards of the D850 are just not worth it. If you a re pro landscape, studio, or wildlife guy perhaps. Otherwise, what?

Nikon needs to put out a 20-26MP camera with these features and build, to appeal to a more rational photographer base. The D5 sensor (perhaps better low iso performance) with the other D5 benefits, in a smaller and less expensive package.

Anyway, Steve, thanks for the excellent D850 overview, and please take my comments as an attempt to be helpful, from my perspective only.



Nov 10, 2017 at 07:55 PM
Steve Perry
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


designdog wrote:
Very good review, Steve! Like your others, and your books, which I have found very helpful.

However, there are some assumptions in your review, either implied or indicated by you (but perhaps not as thoroughly as I would like) that directly impact the performance of the D850 — and the reasons I moved away from the D810 and am not getting the D850.

You, sir, are a very thorough person; very well disciplined and your photography is well thought out. You may poke fun at yourself in referring to mistakes that you have made with this or that piece of equipment, but
...Show more

In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with that approach at all - most people don't need a super high res camera like this. And I also agree that Nikon should consider putting a lower res sensor into this body - an updated 24MP from the D750 would be nice.

All that said, one of the main reasons I really like this camera is that it can do most of what my D500 and D5 can do in one package. When I'm out shooting, I'm often switching between the D5 and D500 as I need more "reach" to get to my subjects and all that juggling gets tiring after awhile - not to mention the missed shots it causes too! Sure, I could use a zoom, but I prefer fast primes for wildlife. With the D850, I don't need to constantly switch bodies - I can fill the frame one minute and crop the next, it doesn't matter, pixels to spare.

Of course, that's not the only reason I like the camera, but it's a big one



Nov 10, 2017 at 08:12 PM
designdog
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Steve, when you say “reach” you mean either the D500 crop factor or having to crop a D5 shot, correct? You have a critter in the center of your view, for example, and the D500 gives you 1.5 more reach per lens - or you would have to crop the FF D5, right? I certainly agree that a crop, particularly a big one, of a D850 is going to be better than the D5 - if, as I mention above, you have the tools and technique to take the shot.

My photography is more family, travel, lifestyle related. My only reason to crop is when I did a lousy job of framing the subject. Certainly see your point of view...



Nov 10, 2017 at 08:46 PM
Steve Perry
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


designdog wrote:
Steve, when you say “reach” you mean either the D500 crop factor or having to crop a D5 shot, correct? You have a critter in the center of your view, for example, and the D500 gives you 1.5 more reach per lens - or you would have to crop the FF D5, right? I certainly agree that a crop, particularly a big one, of a D850 is going to be better than the D5 - if, as I mention above, you have the tools and technique to take the shot.
.


Yes - exactly. Cropping a D850 to DX (19.4MP) is much more enjoyable than a D5 (9ish MP). Fill the frame and either camera works just fine for my purposes



Nov 10, 2017 at 08:51 PM
PIOK
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


designdog wrote:
Very good review, Steve! Like your others, and your books, which I have found very helpful.

However.


Steve just shows as what you can get when you really master a camera

When you watch photos of the best photographers doesn't mean you will take photos as they do just because you bought camera they use. Like this everyone could be a wedding, portrait or landscape master >>> at the moment after they turn on a camera

Just because you buy new Citroen doesn't mean you will drive like Sébastien Loeb. Keep learning



Nov 10, 2017 at 10:18 PM
chambeshi
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Update on the D850 review in this guest post on NR.

With interesting and informative commentaries on sample photos. Thanks yet again Steve :-) :-)

https://nikonrumors.com/2017/11/10/a-nikon-d850-review-for-wildlife-and-nature-photographers-by-steve-perry.aspx/#more-117371



Nov 11, 2017 at 07:48 AM
chambeshi
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Interesting, insightful critique this. Having used the D500 for nearly a year and now 1+ month with the D850 I concur with Steve that
1) the D850 is unforgiving of user error, but

2) the 'Croppability' of the 46mb sensor FX images underpins yet another key advantage to the D850.

Yesterday, for example, I shot croppable images of a few small and elusive birds hopping about in shadows and at high ISO (3200 - 6400) with a 600 f5.6 combo [Nikkor 300 f2.8G + TC2E III ]. At dusk I then took in a spectacular sunset with the 15 f2.8 Zeiss Distagon at ISO 64 on the stolid Gitzo H5543 tripod.... yet again the D850 delivers

My D500 is mainly my backup now but it's more than worthy for action with its native 10fps

kind regards

PS I also have invested in the best of the Zeiss primes for landscape but as they are AF i'm looking at a 16-35 for focus stacking AND my beloved 70-180 Micro-Nikkor also cannot do auto focus stacking....now need a AFS macrolens. Because the 105 f2.8G isn't weather sealed (my copy sucked in dust) I will likely get the Sigma 180 f2.8

designdog wrote:
Very good review, Steve! Like your others, and your books, which I have found very helpful.

However, there are some assumptions in your review, either implied or indicated by you (but perhaps not as thoroughly as I would like) that directly impact the performance of the D850 — and the reasons I moved away from the D810 and am not getting the D850.

You, sir, are a very thorough person; very well disciplined and your photography is well thought out. You may poke fun at yourself in referring to mistakes that you have made with this or that piece of equipment, but
...Show more



Edited on Nov 12, 2017 at 08:12 AM · View previous versions



Nov 11, 2017 at 08:03 AM
david debalko
Online
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Thank you Steve, I've watched your review twice so far, I have a question for those of you with the 850, I'm hoping to use the 850 in silent live view to photo classical concerts - How long will the camera stay in live view, As long as you want? Will it transfer photos wirelessly in live view? I shoot concerts at 3200 ISO with my D4s, will the image quality from the 850 be at least as good?


Nov 11, 2017 at 08:58 PM
bs kite
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Hello David

1. Regarding "time in Live View":

Custom Setting Menu, C. Timers/AE lock, C4. Monitor off delay:

5 min
10 min
15 min
20 min
30 min
No limit

2. Transfer wirelessly? I don't know.
3. Image quality compared to D4s ..... I don't know. I am guessing it will be better than the D4s.

I have used my 850 in Silent Shutter in Live View a lot. You should thoroughly enjoy this concert application of the 850. There is a slight time lag between pressing the shutter and when you actually see the image. IMO, it is noticeably longer than shooting through the viewfinder. But it is so brief, that it will be no issue at all shooting a concert.

Use Peak Focusing or AF. In Focus Peaking you will have white, yellow, red or blue.

It seems to me. if I am shooting a classical concert (I am seated), LV shooting would be ideal. I would rather be shooting through the LV screen than VF...and tiltable too.

Have fun

Robert







Nov 12, 2017 at 02:06 AM
Vinnie_VdB
Online
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


@David Debalko

The D850 is a different beast all together compared to a D4. The main lesson you have to remember is that you half the shutter speed on a D850 compared to the D4(s). That will also ask a thing or 2 from your ISO in case the concert halls are badly lit.



Nov 12, 2017 at 02:21 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



chambeshi
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


david debalko wrote:
Thank you Steve, I've watched your review twice so far, I have a question for those of you with the 850, I'm hoping to use the 850 in silent live view to photo classical concerts - How long will the camera stay in live view, As long as you want? Will it transfer photos wirelessly in live view? I shoot concerts at 3200 ISO with my D4s, will the image quality from the 850 be at least as good?

You can shoot Continuous in LiveView with Silent Shutter - capturing fleeting moments / subtleties of the scene




Nov 12, 2017 at 05:55 AM
Wilbus
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


The D850 doesn't really interest me but this is the way camera reviews should be done. Superb work!


Nov 12, 2017 at 06:41 AM
david debalko
Online
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


I noticed in Steve Perry's review of the 850 he mentioned he uses Topaz Denoise software, It looks nice, Does anyone else use this software? what are your impressions of it?


Nov 13, 2017 at 02:24 PM
technic
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Great review, thanks!

I'm currently using Canon 80D and considering adding/switch to Nikon, mainly because some Nikon lenses are more suitable for my subjects. I was very interested in what Steve shows about Liveview options on D850, especially pinpoint AF and focus peaking.
It is often suggested that Canon Liveview implementation is currently superior, and maybe it still is in some ways. I use Liveview a lot for low to the ground macro shots etc. and while it is a big improvement in combination with a tilt/swivel LCD (compared to having to twist your body in the dirt ...), IMHO it still is immature on the 80D (and probably 6D2, almost identical system). Even the smallest focus point for 80D Liveview is way too big for many macro/wildlife subjects, and the LCD doesn't allow one to check what the camera is really focusing on. Of course you can check after the shot using 10x magnify, or focus manually in 10x magnify mode, but that only works for static subjects.

I'm wondering how well the D850 implementation works for moving subjects. I like taking images of dragonflies on the water with the camera just above the water level, using the LCD/Liveview for framing and focusing. It seems like pinpoint AF and/or focus peaking could do the job unlike my 80D which has "AI Servo" to track the subject in Liveview mode, but if you don't know what exactly the camera is tracking that is of little help. Would the D850 Liveview aids work for moving subjects as well (i.e. when one has to continually adjust framing and focus)?

I would prefer an APS-C body like D500 or D7500, but these features alone (and e.g. the focus stacking) might sway me towards D850 (any chance D500 is going to offer these Liveview features?).



Nov 13, 2017 at 04:46 PM
bs kite
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


In NA at least, these D850s came at the end of nature's "growing season", and so there has been limited opps for such things as shooting dragonflies across the top of the water. You described one of the shoots that I also love in nature. I can only tell you what I have experienced so far.

I have been playing with Fous Peaking and Silent Shutter mode a lot.

I am guessing that in most situations, Focus Peaking is going to be too slow for moving dragonflies.

But, don't we always have to wait for them to stop and hover, before we can acquire? I think so. I forgot about that. So maybe FP will work. I have to wait till next June to find out. And IMHO, Nikon LiveView AF is still not fast either. Maybe I am missing something.

But I love the blue FP for video clips and for stationary subjects, where my 200-500 is tripod-mounted. I do think that FP is going to be great for video clips.

I love loon work. Last week or so, I started a thread, that I can't find now, In it, I raised hope of using the D850/200-500 rig in Silent Shutter, out of say....a kayak or canoe, where you are shooting across the top of the water, at say...a loon. If it worked, it would be super, because they really do not like the mirror slap; they tolerate it.

But the problem will be holding the weight of the rig away from my body with the LCD flipped out. It is going to be too heavy. So, this may necessitate finding some type of video display that would be mounted over the lens barrel. I don't know. I will wait until mid-late next spring to begin experimenting. In the meantime, I have winter duck/loon work...I hope

In the end (IMHO), Nikon's "same-old", poor LiveView AF speed may put a kibosh to the whole idea anyway. It may not be fast enough. And then again, it may be. But is it as fast as one would expect it to be?

Is Nikon's LiveView AF speed as quick as Canon's LiveView AF? Is it as good as Canon's? I doubt it. But I do not know.

There is a slowness to the whole thing, including the Silent Shutter mode. Don't get me wrong, it is a nice feature...but not when it comes to AF speed.

I wish someone would prove me wrong on this. I really do.







technic wrote:
Great review, thanks!

I'm currently using Canon 80D and considering adding/switch to Nikon, mainly because some Nikon lenses are more suitable for my subjects. I was very interested in what Steve shows about Liveview options on D850, especially pinpoint AF and focus peaking.
It is often suggested that Canon Liveview implementation is currently superior, and maybe it still is in some ways. I use Liveview a lot for low to the ground macro shots etc. and while it is a big improvement in combination with a tilt/swivel LCD (compared to having to twist your body in the dirt ...), IMHO it still
...Show more

Edited on Nov 13, 2017 at 10:52 PM · View previous versions



Nov 13, 2017 at 05:33 PM
technic
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


bs kite wrote:
In NA at least, these D850s came at the end of nature's "growing season", and so there has been limited opps for such things as shooting dragonflies across the top of the water. You described one of the shoots that I also love in nature. I can only tell you what I have experienced so far.

I have been playing with Fous Peaking and Silent Shutter mode a lot.

I am guessing that in most situations, Focus Peaking is going to be too slow for moving dragonflies. And IMHO, Nikon LiveView AF is still not fast either. Maybe I
...Show more

Thanks for the reply, sounds like both Liveview systems have their compromises - slower AF on the Nikon against having to hope the AF focuses on the right point with Canon. For more static subjects Nikon would be an easy choice, but the more interesting subjects are moving which complicates things ... I will keep an eye on what others are reporting but yes, it will probably have to be tried in practice which means next year. I have no affordable option of renting a D850 with the right lenses for a good evaluation; my only option is buying and hoping that it works and of course I would like to start the next dragonfly season with better gear ;-)

For holding camera and lens just above the water I used a 4/300mm and the 100-400II IS (the zoom is 1.6kg but you can hold it comfortably for some time with the reversed tripod clamp). Usually I try to balance the camera on the tip of my shoe or something similar for stabilization and to prevent dipping the camera in the water. I don't think this would work with heavier gear like a 200-500 or the big tele prime lenses, but for my purpose 200-400mm is usually sufficient. I made some great shots last year with this, but due to the 80D Liveview AF limitations many shots have slightly wrong focus ;-(



Nov 13, 2017 at 06:56 PM
BCfromBC
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Wow. Fabulous, in-depth review. A pleasure to watch.

However, I should NOT have watched it! $4400 up here in the Great White North and the budget will not allow it!

Maybe one day!




Nov 14, 2017 at 01:31 AM
multibit
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


Another excellent video , thanks for sharing Steve , makes a change seeing an actual useful D850 video . Just brought your secrets to the Nikon autofocus system and look forward to reading through it


Nov 18, 2017 at 09:38 PM
richardHaw
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


I thought it was the ex-vocalist and frontman of Journey...


Nov 19, 2017 at 03:39 PM
Ai_Print
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Steve Perry's Nikon D850 Review.


This one was about 50~60 hours of production time between specific b-roll shots, all those illustrations, and editing. That doesn't even count the research time, testing, post processing, and shooting

Man, I don't know how all you gear-reviews do it, I would have to give up my career as a photographer to do that. Guess that is what gets the enthusiast forum's hearts pounding though so someone has to feed them, lol.



Nov 20, 2017 at 12:57 AM
1       2      
3
       end






FM Forums | Nikon Forum | Join Upload & Sell

1       2      
3
       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username     Reset password