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Going mirrorless for video work
  
 
FrancisK7
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Going mirrorless for video work


I am at an impasse. The Balrog is up my ass and Gandalf is looking straight at me.

I require assistance.

Has anyone here invested specifically in the mirrorless biosphere for video work?

We've been doing all our wedding video work with D750 and now D850 on monopods and the occasional slider shots for two years. Our glidecam was stolen two years ago and we never replaced it. We pull focus manually on all shots and use our current pool of Nikon-F lenses (which is extensive).

We're getting more and more video work, enough that we can reliably further invest into that field.

I've trained my videographer who is full time with us as I still am the principal photographers on weddings but I've been doing more video work parallel to weddings and I've also started to accept wedding video gigs when I can't book a photo gig for that date.

TLDR: we want to invest in a glidecam, zhiyun crane or ronin and a mirrorless camera, possibly the GH5, or A7Sii or maybe the A9 but I'm completely lost among all the options. It's difficult to rent all of this in Canada to try, so I have to rely on research.

I'll make it easy and number my questions for ya'll!

1) Adapters. Can I reliably use our Nikon glass with quality adapters (metabones?) on a GH5 or A7Sii without losing too much performance? Ideally we would like to use autofocus when using a crane/ronin/glidecam as I am not interested in hiring a dedicated assistant for focus pulling during weddings.

2) Any input on GH5 vs A7sii?

3) Any A9 users here?

4) Sony glass is outrageously priced. We have three D750 and a D850. I currently have a deposit on a second D850 (sold out everywhere here) and was about to end up with two D750 and two D850. But now I'm thinking three dSLR and a mirrorless would serve us much better.Thoughts?

5) Any input on using a ronin vs glidecam HD4000 vs a Zhiyun Crane v2?

Basically any feedback will help me make a more informed decision.



Nov 08, 2017 at 03:43 PM
BSPhotog
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Going mirrorless for video work


@LeeSimms Went the Panasonic route, IIRC.



Nov 08, 2017 at 04:01 PM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Going mirrorless for video work


Yeah he has the GH4 I think.

The GH5 looks like an amazing camera except for its shitty low light capabilities. It's also half the price of the A9.




Nov 08, 2017 at 04:07 PM
BSPhotog
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Going mirrorless for video work


FrancisK7 wrote:
Yeah he has the GH4 I think.

The GH5 looks like an amazing camera except for its shitty low light capabilities. It's also half the price of the A9.



And you can use smaller stuff to stabilize it. I have worked with people using small bodies like GHx & a6x00 on tiny one-hand gimbals.



Nov 08, 2017 at 04:18 PM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Going mirrorless for video work


Been chatting with a couple of guys on Facebook and been told to wait for the A7Siii if I plan to do video work with it only because the A9 has been purposefully handicapped for video.

As for one hand gimbals, the Zhiyun Crane v2 can stabilize a GH4/GH5/A7Sii (but definitely not a dSLR) and comes highly recommended by local videographers, so this is my current op choice.

Just have to settle on which camera, adapter and lens to go for.

The A6500 is also on my list with something like the Sony 24 1.8.



Nov 08, 2017 at 04:22 PM
LeeSimms
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Going mirrorless for video work


Yup, we migrated from Canon to Panasonic for video. Two GH4's and two GH5's. Olympus 12 & 75mm lenses with a few Panasonics ... 25mm, 30 macro, 7-14, 12-35 and 35-100. We also have an Osmo Pro, but are looking at the Crane v2 and dedicating a GH5 just for gimble shooting. The Crane is only 4-axis (the OsmoPro is 5) but the bit rate is much better (as expected) on the Panasonic versus the DJI head.

The cameras are very capable and easy to use and the codec scheme is great (easy to edit, nice size). Shooting with these versus a made-for-stills dSLR is a dream.

The Panasonic's aren't the top dog that the Sony a7s, but it's a nice compromise. Lighter weight, dramatically better battery life, but limited for High ISO work. The GH5 is a high ISO stop over the GH4. You're normally shooting video at 1/50th of second and with the Youngnuo YN360's (thanks again Francis) there's enough light to get the job done — especially with primes.

Our associate videographer (my son is our lead) has a bigger Panasonic rig than ours, (he does a lot of hired gun shooting for music videos and corporate stuff) and has the m43 head on his inspire 2 drone so he gets more milage out of the lenses. He also uses the metabones with all sorts of lenses.

If the billing justifies it, I'm not opposed to going to Sony someday for video. It would be nice to have the same lenses (again) for photo and video and an all Sony fleet for us is within the realm of possibility. Really wish the a7rIII had an mRAW mode — drat!

As a company, we're at a crossroads with video. We did 30 jobs in 2017 but I'm not feeling the love. It's so labor intensive on the post-production size and the customer expectations are all over the map. We're taking a hard look at the numbers this month and working up a new path forward. Put us in the 'successful, but not happy' camp.



Nov 08, 2017 at 06:11 PM
LeeSimms
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Going mirrorless for video work


That new audio box for the top of the GH5 is so slick. We got one and mounted a Sennheiser 416 shotgun and Sennheiser radio receiver on it. You can quickly add pro audio to any GH5 by slipping it on the flash hot shoe and locking down. Boom. Instant +4 audio, limiting, gain control. Very slick - only $400. My son used it for a legal job last week — plugged a huge mixer into the GH5 in seconds.

I don't think Sony has anything like it. I saw it at WPPI and was sold on the spot.



Nov 08, 2017 at 06:21 PM
LeeSimms
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Going mirrorless for video work


To Panasonic's credit, it's VERY clear they listened to a lot of videographer feedback on the GH4. The GH5 isn't a performance revolution as much as it an ergonomics one.

Them, and Sony, seem to eager to please.



Nov 08, 2017 at 06:27 PM
LeeSimms
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Going mirrorless for video work


Francis - the Crane v2 is on my buy list. Right now the focus, OLED, etc only work for Canon but rumors are Sony and Panasonic are getting support in 2018.

Our Crane v1 didn't get much use and I eBay'd it — we moved to an OsmoPro but it has limitations and the smartphone control is frustrating in high pressure situations. Hoping the Crane v2 and GH5 12mm/25mm combo will be our go-to capture next year.




Nov 08, 2017 at 06:34 PM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Going mirrorless for video work


Thanks for all your input friend. Definitely helps getting opinions from competent and working colleagues.

I think I'm going to stick with Sony because their sensors are just the shit, as much as a like the reviews of the GH5 I have seen.

a6500+Sony 24mm 1.8+Crave v2 is not too big of an investment compared to say a A9+28mm 1.8
Ronin M. The first kit is $3000 to get 4K on a one hand gimbal. Not that you really need it -- Ive lost count on the amount of YT videos I have seen where people are mimicking slider or jib shot handheld thanks to internal stabilization. The crane appers to provide a lot of versatility though.

I am concerned about color discrepancy between D850 and a6500/a7siii footage but I suppose Im gonna have to eat the color grading time in post.

Also wonder how the metabones adapter are quality wise. Did you try them?



Nov 08, 2017 at 07:32 PM
 

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ashton lamont
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Going mirrorless for video work


I have high hopes for the Zhiyun Crane 2 but its not yet available direct from Amazon UK:

http://www.zhiyun-tech.com/crane_2_en/

I tried the previous version a few weeks ago. That has a max payload of 1800g / 3.2lb having had a firmware update to increase that from its initial 1200g max. But I found it to be disappointing near its max, plus some other issues such as the body flopping like a stone unless you handle it very carefully.

The crane 2 takes a max payload of double - 3200g / 7lb - so it should easily cope with most "normal weight" gear rather than you having to compromise and perhaps buy some lighter smaller bodies and lenses that you would not otherwise wish to purchase. There are some other very significant improvements to the Crane 2 as described in the website.

I will use it with Canon 5D-IV's. The video autofocus is of course a revelation. I'll use it at 1080p rather than 4k as I have no interest in the latter - not at present anyway.

For those casual visitors to FM you may find it interesting to see what the current crane (not crane 2) can do. There are tons of examples e.g.



Some eye-candy in more ways than one as well. Should I say that

Pete



Nov 08, 2017 at 09:17 PM
joosay
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Going mirrorless for video work


I use an A7SII and A7RII for video work and I use them for personal work with stills. I will use my Canon 5D4 as a 3rd camera to supplement. I have my Sony cameras setup with a custom color profile to match Canon color.

I use the A7RII with a gimbal since it has a better AF performance than the A7SII and I recently acquired the Pilotfly H2-45 which is designed to NOT obstruct the LCD screen.

Also, I am eagerly waiting for the announcement of the A7SIII.



Nov 08, 2017 at 10:14 PM
3catsinky
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Going mirrorless for video work


I am using the A9 for video, along with two A7r2s. The A9 is exceptional at video, so don't be fooled by the lack of "profiles". I will use it on a Feiyu A2000 gimbal for commercial stuff, and it's always my main cam at weddings. High ISO performance, and AF is incredible. I love the colors and skin tones I get with it, much more than the A7r2. EVF and touchscreen are a joy to use. I've thought about upgrading to the RIII, but since I have 2 of the RIIs, I'll wait for the 7sIII.


Nov 09, 2017 at 01:01 AM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Going mirrorless for video work


3catsinky wrote:
I am using the A9 for video, along with two A7r2s. The A9 is exceptional at video, so don't be fooled by the lack of "profiles". I will use it on a Feiyu A2000 gimbal for commercial stuff, and it's always my main cam at weddings. High ISO performance, and AF is incredible. I love the colors and skin tones I get with it, much more than the A7r2. EVF and touchscreen are a joy to use. I've thought about upgrading to the RIII, but since I have 2 of the RIIs, I'll wait for the 7sIII.


What is your lens line-up with the A9?

Thanks for your input!



Nov 09, 2017 at 01:08 AM
ronrandle
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Going mirrorless for video work


FrancisK7 wrote:
As for one hand gimbals, the Zhiyun Crane v2 can stabilize a GH4/GH5/A7Sii (but definitely not a dSLR) and comes highly recommended by local videographers, so this is my current op choice.

The A6500 is also on my list with something like the Sony 24 1.8.


Francis, we love the 6500 on the Zhiyun Crane, with either the 16 or 24 on it. Super easy to balance and focus on a moving stabilizer. We've even used our Canon 6D on the Crane but have to be much more careful with movement as the weight of the camera and 24mm prime is at the Crane's limit.

The Crane and 6500 is our go-to rig once the dancing starts. Overhead shots, moving through the crowd and the ease of use make it a no-brainer.




Nov 09, 2017 at 05:25 PM
SGallant
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Going mirrorless for video work


I added the GH5 for my video work. The Nikon's as much as I love them don't cut it for video. The GH5 has been an awesome addition and I can share, you won't be unhappy. They also are pushing the limits and doing things most video cameras around the same $$ mark can't. Slo Mo is legit. 10 bit is legit. Battery life is good. Dual memory cards, hot swappable and writeable to both is pretty awesome. No limit to the length it can record. And a laundry list of other features that you won't find in other cameras around that price point or even more. Be sure you watch a youtube video or two comparing the GH5 to the Sony's if you are thinking about going that route.


Nov 09, 2017 at 06:57 PM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Going mirrorless for video work


ronrandle wrote:
Francis, we love the 6500 on the Zhiyun Crane, with either the 16 or 24 on it. Super easy to balance and focus on a moving stabilizer. We've even used our Canon 6D on the Crane but have to be much more careful with movement as the weight of the camera and 24mm prime is at the Crane's limit.

The Crane and 6500 is our go-to rig once the dancing starts. Overhead shots, moving through the crowd and the ease of use make it a no-brainer.



So good to hear man! I'd love to see some dancefloor footage you took with the crane if you have any around!

SGallant wrote:
I added the GH5 for my video work. The Nikon's as much as I love them don't cut it for video. The GH5 has been an awesome addition and I can share, you won't be unhappy. They also are pushing the limits and doing things most video cameras around the same $$ mark can't. Slo Mo is legit. 10 bit is legit. Battery life is good. Dual memory cards, hot swappable and writeable to both is pretty awesome. No limit to the length it can record. And a laundry list of other features that you won't find in other cameras
...Show more

I watched this entire review of the GH5 and it's very impressive:



For the price the features are killer. However I am concerned about the low-light capabilities -- I'd like my mirrorless to be a b-cam for the dancefloor as well.

Ideally my D850 will be on a Crane 2 and the a6500/GH5 on a Crane v2 (the Crane v2 supports 3.9 lbs and the Crane 2 supports up to 7 lbs, plenty for a dSLR and compact lens). I would like the B-CAM camera to come as close to possible to the image quality of what the D850 will output. Since Nikon and Sony share sensor tech, at this point I am more inclined to get a a6500 and then wait and see what happens with the a7s3 for a future acquisition. They say Sony is the king of video work, I'm sure I will become addicted.



Nov 09, 2017 at 08:26 PM
3catsinky
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Going mirrorless for video work


FrancisK7 wrote:
What is your lens line-up with the A9?

Thanks for your input!


Given I have run the Sony gamut of FF through APSC, it's been juggled a bit. Currently, 16-35GM, 28FE/21mm, 35F1.4, 55F1.8, Batis 85, 70-200F4, and a Canon 70-200F2.8. I had a 90 Macro, but never used it. The Canon will likely get sold for a 70-200 G master, although i only use it for ceremonies. The Batis is probably my most shot lens at this point.





Nov 10, 2017 at 12:59 PM
FrancisK7
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Going mirrorless for video work


After seeing this I think i will go with the a6500+10-18+crane (this video was shot with this exact combo):



Been told to wait out the Sigma 16mm that is coming, apparently its amazing.




Nov 14, 2017 at 01:48 PM
elkhornsun
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Going mirrorless for video work


When looking at what is required to put together a video rig for a DSLR camera to what is provided "out of the box" with a camcorder, my money is on the camcorder. Ergonomics are better in actual use and better cine lens options and ways to mount a mic or pickup.

Even under $4,000 there are great camcorders with optical zoom lenses from Canon, Panasonic, JVC, and Sony. The Canon XF405 provides for dual XLR inputs and 4 channels of audio so you can have lav mics on the "talent" during the ceremony and take the sound recording to a pro level.



Nov 14, 2017 at 10:28 PM
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