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All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...
  
 
philber
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Nobody was actually spot on...:-(


Nov 10, 2017 at 04:16 PM
carlitos
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


philber wrote:
Nobody was actually spot on...:-(



Actually spot on? Well a Loxia 25/2.8 would be nice, too.



Nov 10, 2017 at 05:52 PM
JocoFoto
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Here's me hoping "Loxia 35/1.4 ZM" isn't spot on because 'ZM' won't be in the name.

It's a lens I've been hoping to come for a year or more. 25mm is for me too close to the 21mm.

And yes, the last 2 years it became a X-mas tradition - getting a Loxia. First 21, last year 85 - I love both to bits. Btw the 35/2 is also very nice, I use it for pano's @ f8. Very useful for this purpose as it is small and light so very easy to handle on a pano-rig. Image quality is excellent.



Nov 10, 2017 at 06:18 PM
Steve Spencer
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


GMPhotography wrote:
Iím pretty dang happy with my Batis 135 and in these longer focal lengths I lean more towards AF anyway. A Loxia 28 is whatís needed and a Batis 35 F2


Totally agree, Guy. I hope we get a Loxia 28 f/2.4 (now that they introduced that max aperture for the Loxia 85, seems to be a fine max aperture for the 28 as well). I also hope we get at Batis 35 f/1.8, just a little faster than an f/2 would be nice. I haven't picked up a Batis 135 APO yet, but I do plan to get one. If the Loxia 28 and Batis 35 were to come out, personally, there is not another prime I would need for Sony E-mount.



Nov 10, 2017 at 06:32 PM
GMPhotography
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Honestly even i was early on a moaner of the Batis 135 but after owning itís one of the best lenses you can buy for this system. Itís just so bloody good.

Steve you would love it



Nov 10, 2017 at 06:41 PM
DavidBM
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


GMPhotography wrote:
Honestly even i was early on a moaner of the Batis 135 but after owning itís one of the best lenses you can buy for this system. Itís just so bloody good.

Steve you would love it


Seems like every lens I review causes you to be an early moaner and then purchaser, Guy!



Nov 10, 2017 at 10:48 PM
GMPhotography
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


I moaned more about the 40mm though. The Batis my comments where more about the price, I thought it was about 300 too much. Just these 2 lenses though as normally Im not very negative. Exception reviewers .


Nov 10, 2017 at 11:02 PM
lightskyland
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


I took out my Rokinon 135/2 today to photograph fall colors in earnest. And from zooming in on test shots, itís essentially flawless wide-open. I havenít downloaded the pictures yet but I am looking forward to it. The lens was big, yes, but not significantly larger than my 100 STF and not that much larger than the CV 65 .

For $400, I think I did well! Now Iím looking forward to downloading the pictures and pixel peeping this puppy.



Nov 10, 2017 at 11:12 PM
GMPhotography
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Its a great lens, most of us had it at one time or another and it is a performer.


Nov 10, 2017 at 11:30 PM
philip_pj
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Just as DSLR sales were winding down, Zeiss were distracted with the modernization of the DSLR line, from 'Classic' to Milvus. Believing DSLRs would remain the pro formats, they were then very slow to react to emerging trends, taking many moons to actually release Batis 25/85 for 'partner' Sony, announced 2.5 years ago (April 2015). And those same two and a half years have got us just two new design Loxias. In the Batis range, Zeiss is treating the mainstream middle focal lengths like they were kryptonite, to be avoided at all costs.

Sony behaved like this for some time as well. They waffled around on the fringes making many DSLR/DSLT bodies no one wanted. Before the a7x series revolution, many expected them to fold. It's all down to sound management to provide support, direction and impetus and inspiration. I do hope Zeiss improve on this front and take a leaf from Sony's a7x playbook - focus on the future, not the past!




Nov 11, 2017 at 12:36 AM
 

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rico
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


We are living in a small golden age of 135mm. I consider this FL to be perfect for portrait and product, but the offerings were pretty thin this last decade. Now we have a fresh choice of lenses with impressively broad range of characteristics: CZ Batis 135/2.8, Samyang 135/2, Sigma 135/1.8 Art, Canon TS-E 135/4L, MS Optics 135/2.4 Fluorit. All of these are usable on Sony FE, of course. I only wish a 135/4 in the spirit of the Tele-Elmar was updated to APO level: lenses like the Rok cannot compete for a casual carry.


Nov 11, 2017 at 01:07 AM
lightskyland
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


The Rokinon is sick. Just sick, sick sick. And it's manual focus, which for me is paramount with my landscape glass.

I now have two essentially-perfect MF lenses for my Sony. This, and the CV 65. The only flaws are size (especially the Rok), lack of exif on the Rok, and the near-infinity MF gearing on the CV.

And two truly outstanding MF lenses that are almost as good - the Loxia 85 and 21. The Lox 50 is pretty close as well. As is the 35, stopped down to f/5.6 at least.

We are starting to get somewhere with the lens lineup for these Sonys...




Nov 11, 2017 at 01:15 AM
rico
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


The Rok135 was supposed to exceed Samyang's ability. It ranks as high optically as any 135 made, although stray-light suppression gets a D grade. I have to be very careful in the studio with light sources and, even then, get bit repeatedly. If the 135/2 Apo Sonnar (the other new 135 I forgot to list) has a superior feature, it's flare control: CZ is the longtime master in this regard.


Nov 11, 2017 at 01:44 AM
davewolfs
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


I hope for our sake they can change direction. It doesnít seem like it would be difficult for them to put out some hot sellers for the E mount.

philip_pj wrote:
Just as DSLR sales were winding down, Zeiss were distracted with the modernization of the DSLR line, from 'Classic' to Milvus. Believing DSLRs would remain the pro formats, they were then very slow to react to emerging trends, taking many moons to actually release Batis 25/85 for 'partner' Sony, announced 2.5 years ago (April 2015). And those same two and a half years have got us just two new design Loxias. In the Batis range, Zeiss is treating the mainstream middle focal lengths like they were kryptonite, to be avoided at all costs.

Sony behaved like this for some time
...Show more




Nov 11, 2017 at 02:15 AM
philip_pj
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


People speculate that Sony did a deal with them to largely keep them out of the normal focal lengths, with just a nominal presence. Sony had the RX1 series to sell, four 50-55mm lenses (50/1.4-55/1.8-50/1.8-50/2.8) and and two 35mm lenses (35/1.4-35/2.8). That is a lot of 35-55mm lenses right there, all from the 'mount owner' - seven in total. [I include the RX1 Sonnar as it is the only Sony f2 35mm lens in full frame.] Zeiss have but two - older ex-ZM lenses, both manual focus [the ZM 50/2 and ZM 35/2 both date from 2004, according to Ken Rockwell].

So nine 35-55 lenses! It just confirms how important these 'normal plus or minus' focal lengths are, to the marketing of these small cameras and to their user base.

WRT the Loxia 50/2, it is an overall good $900 lens, of course, but nothing like what Zeiss could turn out blindfolded today, for 'Loxia money' of $1330-$1425 (85mm-21mm). It is an old Planar design of 6 elements in 4 groups, no special glass. Were they serious, we could expect a hybrid design similar in complexity to the FE 55/1.8, a 7/5 design (but with a over-reliance on asph surfaces); or the one they should be guided by, the Leica 50/2 AA, a very sophisticated 8/5 design with 3 APD elements, one asph surface, meticulously crafted. That is what I mean by a 'modern normal lens', not something from 2004, lightly warmed over. We have moved on from the era of 6/4 'nifty fifties', and we now give 50mm lenses their due respect.

Because of the optical properties of near-normal lenses, Zeiss could also do what they unhesitatingly do for DSLRs - make f1.4 lenses that would furthermore still be light/small enough for a7x. Milvus range now has f1.4 lenses at 25-35-50-85mm focal lengths. We have none, in either Batis nor Loxia. If fast is your need or desire at 35-50mm, Sony is the only (serious brand) native lens game in town for a7x cameras. At f2 for DSLRs, there are also the fine 50/2 MP and 35/2 ZE/ZF, both arguably better/more appropriate lenses than the Loxias 35/50.

Is all this coincidence or just how it turned out? The great psychologist C.G. Jung did not believe in coincidences.



Nov 11, 2017 at 04:06 AM
DannyBurkPhoto
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


The Loxia line is held back, though, by that annoying adherence to a 52mm filter thread. If that is to continue, it seems that a new line is going to be needed to give us many of the E-mount lenses that we want in terms of quality and aperture.

I like the compact Loxiae a lot, but that's in part because I keep two lens sets, a small and light E-mount set (Loxia and Voigtlander) for hiking/landscape, and a generally large and heavy DSLR set (Canon-mount, using adapters for Sony) that I use for wide-aperture flowers and, in some cases, higher quality landscape if I'm shooting near the car. I can get the choices that I want by this strategy, if not ideal in weight/bulk for the DSLR set, although I'm having to play the lens/bag switcheroo every time I go out with a different shooting goal. Tomorrow I'm doing an orchid show and want fast lenses, necessitating remixing lenses from different sets to fit into a bag that isn't huge and cumbersome.



Nov 11, 2017 at 04:23 AM
Chris_88
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


philip_pj wrote:
People speculate that Sony did a deal with them to largely keep them out of the normal focal lengths, with just a nominal presence. Sony had the RX1 series to sell, four 50-55mm lenses (50/1.4-55/1.8-50/1.8-50/2.8) and and two 35mm lenses (35/1.4-35/2.8). That is a lot of 35-55mm lenses right there, all from the 'mount owner' - seven in total. [I include the RX1 Sonnar as it is the only Sony f2 35mm lens in full frame.] Zeiss have but two - older ex-ZM lenses, both manual focus [the ZM 50/2 and ZM 35/2 both date from 2004, according to Ken
...Show more

It does make you wonder for sure. With the RX1 series and a potential Batis 35 1.8/2, I can still somehow get the worry about the latter influencing the former's sales. However, Sony has shown that it is clearly sensitive to user criticism concerning a lack of "fast, high performance, size be damned glass"; hence, the GM series and the 50 1.4.

I don't think the Loxia lenses necessarily compete with those big, fast Sony AF lenses, but rather complement them quite nicely. If you need f1.4 or f1.6, you will reach for the 85 GM; if, however, you are more of a landscape shooter and prefer a smaller footprint, you might pick up the Loxia 85 2.4. Also, most of Sony's slower offerings are in a different price bracket than Zeiss glass.

I think Zeiss' insistence on the 52mm filter thread for the Loxia line (which I take it, is more important for video and still photographers) probably limits FL - f speed combination quite a bit. Then again, there still are plenty of holes in the e-mount line-up that could be filled with high-performing moderately faced MF lenses such as a 28 2.4.

Another thought: At least over here, the Loxia 35 for all its flaws is still quite popular. Once a used copy pops up, it's usually quickly snatched up, and there aren't that many available on the used market in the first place, suggesting that owners are in no hurry to sell theirs.

Last but not least, the quite literally "big" question for Zeiss will be whether through company policy or some agreement with Sony, they will continue to limit themselves to moderately fast e-mount primes or decide to go for faster Batis lenses after all. Of course, it could very well be that they prefer people to adopt Milvus and Otus lenses to e-mount.



Nov 11, 2017 at 05:42 AM
BastianK
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


MaTiHH wrote:
I still want a Loxia 180. Don't care much about the aperture to be honest. Just a modern release of the old contax design.


---------------------------------------------

scrappydog wrote:
I would love a Loxia 35/1.4 ZM. My 35ZM is my favorite lens, but getting one with a native mount and no mid-field dip would be even better.


Let's be honest here: I would be buying both.



Nov 11, 2017 at 10:03 AM
DavidBM
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


philip_pj wrote:
(Loxia) It is an old Planar design of 6 elements in 4 groups, no special glass. Were they serious, we could expect a hybrid design similar in complexity to the FE 55/1.8, a 7/5 design (but with a over-reliance on asph surfaces); or the one they should be guided by, the Leica 50/2 AA, a very sophisticated 8/5 design with 3 APD elements, one asph surface, meticulously crafted. That is what I mean by a 'modern normal lens', not something from 2004, lightly warmed over. We have moved on from the era of 6/4 'nifty fifties', and we now give
...Show more

Yep something like an E mount version of the 2/50 Summicron AA would be very welcome.
If I had to guess I think it could be done for Loxia money, even if it's loxia 85 money, and if it ended up being as good as the Apo Lanthar 65 in a form factor like the current 2/50 Loxia I would sell both for it....




Nov 11, 2017 at 10:10 AM
philber
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · All I want for Christmas is a Loxia 135...


Though I won't disclose our discussions, I can tell you that Zeiss are well aware of what is happening, where the future lies, that they are eager to play, and have the ideas and resources to delight us!


Nov 11, 2017 at 02:34 PM
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