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where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?
  
 
YesIdo
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


I am sure 'm not the first one who would dare to ask this question.
But it is interesting that none of the major mirrorless camera makers has released a fixed 50mm/equaivalent yet (135 format).
Not Fuji (X100 series), not Sony (RX1 series), not even Leca (Q).

What could be the cause?
The only reason I could think of right now is that with the ever growing pixel numbers, one could easily crop out an 50mm view? Or is it that 35mm is considered more a versatile FL by their market research



Oct 29, 2017 at 07:59 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


I don't think anyone wants it. My first SLR was sold with a 50/2, but that was over 40 years ago.

EBH



Oct 29, 2017 at 08:08 PM
YesIdo
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


Hmm. That's strange. What leads you to think that no one wants such a camera? Limited scenes where you can use the camera?


Oct 29, 2017 at 08:28 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


~35mm FOV has always been popular in fixed-lens cameras. 50 is just too long, too often. Is a MILC really so much larger that it is untenable?

EBH



Oct 30, 2017 at 01:37 AM
Michael White
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


I have a 50L but to get the typical POV you expect with a 50 on a 35mm or fall body you need a 35ish and I have one but I’ve not used it much my next fixed lens will be a 85mm L I have the 35, 50, 100 fixed lenses I still need the 85 and 135 four the normal to short teles I also have a 200 and a 400 fixed need a 300 at some time but a 500 or other big white will be first since my zooms cover the 300 actually I cover everything from 8mm to 400mm without converters and I have both so I can go out to 800mm with the 2x and further if I combine them I’m wanting the 200-600 iirc when I can afford it not that I could ever justify the expendituresince im a hobbyist now my pro/semi pro days are over


Oct 30, 2017 at 08:25 AM
Banongading
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


I’m with you, I’d love a 50mm fixed compact. It seems ‘everyone’s favourite lens choice’ but not one maker considers it as an option for a fixed lens camera!


Oct 31, 2017 at 06:29 AM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


And an 85 to round it out. That way we can have a 35 f2 and 85 f2 off each shoulder and rule the world.



Oct 31, 2017 at 07:34 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


Every once in a while, I find myself yearning for a three-pack of Sigma Merrill cameras, giving three fixed-lens cameras at 28mm, 45mm, and 75mm (equivalent FF AOV). I say "equivalent..." because the Merrill's are APS-C format, not FF as desired by the OP.



Oct 31, 2017 at 12:02 PM
YesIdo
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


EB-1 does raise an interesting point, that as far as I know, the 60s-80s does see a lot of compacts with 35mm or 28mm, but I don't know of any fixed lens with 50mm.
Everyone has his/her most used FL. And in terms of design, I think both 35mm and 50mm are mature enough that their sizes would come very close. That's why I pose the question with the "market" keyword. Maybe there just doesn't seem to be a big enough market for 50mm? This is just a big strange for me, personally, considering how that particular FL is marketed as the "standard".



Oct 31, 2017 at 04:08 PM
SLane
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


Like jcolwell, I think a three pack of Sigma Merrill cameras would be a fun set. Take all three on a trip, swap cameras (not lenses) as needed. Going for a hike, pick the FL most suited for the likely subject matter to be encountered. KEH has a dp1 and dp2 for sale, about $500 each.


Oct 31, 2017 at 05:15 PM
 

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YesIdo
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


Thanks for the recommendations.
But honestly, I am not seriously looking into buying equipments.
I am just interested in knowing what others might think of possible reasons for the absence of such cameras.



Oct 31, 2017 at 07:51 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


YesIdo wrote:
EB-1 does raise an interesting point, that as far as I know, the 60s-80s does see a lot of compacts with 35mm or 28mm, but I don't know of any fixed lens with 50mm...


My Olympus 35 SP has a 42mm f/1.7 lens, and my Rollei 35 SE has 40mm f/2.8. Both are fixed-lens, FF film, rangefinders.





Oct 31, 2017 at 09:23 PM
YesIdo
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?




jcolwell wrote:
My Olympus 35 SP has a 42mm f/1.7 lens, and my Rollei 35 SE has 40mm f/2.8. Both are fixed-lens, FF film, rangefinders.



That is good to know. Thanks!
Now those are even closer to the true diagonal length of the 135 format, things are getting interesting!



Nov 01, 2017 at 12:19 AM
shmn
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


I would buy a 50mm fixed lens compact. I've got the Merrill DP2M (and DP3M) but it's a quirky camera that requires effort which is fine some of the time. Visit some Ricoh forums and will always hear clamoring for a 50mm Ricoh GR. I would love one as I think the GR is camera that has come closest to perfection for my needs. Imagine having a Ricoh GR (28mm) and a similar camera with 50mm FOV...that would be a useful combo.


Nov 04, 2017 at 01:44 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


jcolwell wrote:
Every once in a while, I find myself yearning for a three-pack of Sigma Merrill cameras, giving three fixed-lens cameras at 28mm, 45mm, and 75mm (equivalent FF AOV). I say "equivalent..." because the Merrill's are APS-C format, not FF as desired by the OP.


Don't wait too long, they are becoming increasingly difficult to find in good or better condition, especially the dp3m.

Buy some extra batteries, too.



Nov 04, 2017 at 11:12 PM
artificialyello
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


@OP: You won't find many compacts digital or for film since 50mm originally was an exchangeable lens 35mm film compromise for getting the FL as short as possible without the need for retro focus design. You have to make room for mounts and such... The "normal" is traditionally the same as the diagonal of the light sensitive area and thus you have many film compact sporting around 40mm lenses since the diagonal of a full film frame is 43mm, IIRC. My Minolta AL-F had a 38mm one and that was considered a tad wide. In short: There is no tradition in making "nifty fifty" compacts for film and you're thus not likely to find many for digital captures either.


Nov 05, 2017 at 11:21 AM
YesIdo
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


shmn wrote:
I would buy a 50mm fixed lens compact. I've got the Merrill DP2M (and DP3M) but it's a quirky camera that requires effort which is fine some of the time. Visit some Ricoh forums and will always hear clamoring for a 50mm Ricoh GR. I would love one as I think the GR is camera that has come closest to perfection for my needs. Imagine having a Ricoh GR (28mm) and a similar camera with 50mm FOV...that would be a useful combo.


I have a sigma dp2 quattro, but find it handles very strangely TO ME...




Nov 06, 2017 at 06:30 PM
YesIdo
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


shmn wrote:
I would buy a 50mm fixed lens compact. I've got the Merrill DP2M (and DP3M) but it's a quirky camera that requires effort which is fine some of the time. Visit some Ricoh forums and will always hear clamoring for a 50mm Ricoh GR. I would love one as I think the GR is camera that has come closest to perfection for my needs. Imagine having a Ricoh GR (28mm) and a similar camera with 50mm FOV...that would be a useful combo.


I have a sigma dp2 quattro, but find it handles very strangely TO ME...




Nov 06, 2017 at 06:30 PM
YesIdo
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


artificialyello wrote:
@OP: You won't find many compacts digital or for film since 50mm originally was an exchangeable lens 35mm film compromise for getting the FL as short as possible without the need for retro focus design. You have to make room for mounts and such... The "normal" is traditionally the same as the diagonal of the light sensitive area and thus you have many film compact sporting around 40mm lenses since the diagonal of a full film frame is 43mm, IIRC. My Minolta AL-F had a 38mm one and that was considered a tad wide. In short: There is no tradition
...Show more

Nice to know this interesting history. Thanks for the lecture!
In the end I guess the ~=40 but !=35 compacts historically most turn out to be niche market, so the manufactures gradually settled down on 35, if I get your message.
I have a feeling this lack of 50 somehow has to do with history. And this story kind of echoes @EB-1's point.



Nov 06, 2017 at 06:34 PM
artificialyello
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · where is 50mm fixed lens digital camera market?


YesIdo wrote:
Nice to know this interesting history. Thanks for the lecture!
In the end I guess the ~=40 but !=35 compacts historically most turn out to be niche market, so the manufactures gradually settled down on 35, if I get your message.
I have a feeling this lack of 50 somehow has to do with history. And this story kind of echoes @EB-1@'s point


No echo in here. EB-1 said that 50mm can be to long for a compact, given a choice. I explains why 50mm is considered the standard FL even though it should be 43mm by definition. The EOS M, and M6 i guess with the 22/2.0 fits a coat pocket without to much trouble, BTW.

HTH! :-))



Nov 06, 2017 at 08:20 PM
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