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So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???
  
 
joosay
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p.9 #1 · p.9 #1 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


I'm waiting to see what the A7SIII will have in store for us.


Oct 31, 2017 at 09:03 PM
pasblues
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p.9 #2 · p.9 #2 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


lambers wrote:
The price of the A9 will not drop as a result of the A7RIII, just like the price of the Nikon D5 did not drop after the introduction of the D850.


Oh, yeah, it's down to below $3700. I see it as a win-win for everybody - new A7rIII users who jump from the A9; A9 users who want a second used body; Sony who wants to sell the new camera body; A7RII buyers.



Oct 31, 2017 at 09:18 PM
GMPhotography
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p.9 #3 · p.9 #3 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


They are also Grey market.

Also itís not a win win either people are losing lots of money here.

Edited on Oct 31, 2017 at 09:51 PM · View previous versions



Oct 31, 2017 at 09:39 PM
lambers
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p.9 #4 · p.9 #4 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


pasblues wrote:
Oh, yeah, it's down to below $3700. I see it as a win-win for everybody - new A7rIII users who jump from the A9; A9 users who want a second used body; Sony who wants to sell the new camera body; A7RII buyers.


It's down, like every other camera when sold used, but not (necessarily) because of the A7RIII. An A9 sold on ebay for $3500, 6 weeks ago, well before the A7RIII was announced.



Edited on Oct 31, 2017 at 10:04 PM · View previous versions



Oct 31, 2017 at 09:51 PM
GMPhotography
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p.9 #5 · p.9 #5 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Ebay lenses yes. Cameras I would be very careful. Sony grey market you will not have any warranty in the US.buy cams from people you know. Your dealing with electronics. Lenses much less to go wrong. Iím not saying that because mine is up for sale either . I have said this for years. Ebay people unload there junk there. Just be careful . Please

Edited on Oct 31, 2017 at 10:13 PM · View previous versions



Oct 31, 2017 at 09:54 PM
lambers
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p.9 #6 · p.9 #6 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Wanny wrote:
Is no one reading/watching these hands on reviews? No one has stated the AF is the same the a7rii, everyone has stated its faster.

Sure Sony invited people to the event, but a lot of the YouTubers/bloggers are pretty credible. Most of the people saying the AF is a lot better, are the same people saying the IQ is the same.


I have yet to see anything from the Sony groupies that demonstrated AF performance (i.e. speed & accuracy) at 10 fps with subjects moving rapidly towards/away from the camera or across the frame. It would have been helpful if the A7RIII press event was held at a skating rink or track and field stadium, like Sony did with the A9, so that AF performance could have been properly assessed and compared, rather than with some dancers that were moving in much the same plane relative to the camera.



Oct 31, 2017 at 09:58 PM
DavidBM
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p.9 #7 · p.9 #7 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Mystik wrote:
No. The a9 has a higher density PDAF system. The upgrades to the a7rII's AF system come in the form of improvements to the CDAF system...more CDAF points and greater CDAF sensitivity, but the PDAF system is largely the same because PDAF is a function of the sensor itself and the a7rIII did not get a new sensor.

The a7rII may acquire focus more quickly because the CDAF system, which is software dependent, is faster...but it will not track as well as the a9. You can see how much better the a9 locks onto your subject by how stable the AF
...Show more

PDAF performance is also a function of read frequency and processing of the PD pixels, and the lsi and faster main processor should help with that, no?



Oct 31, 2017 at 10:11 PM
lambers
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p.9 #8 · p.9 #8 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


DavidBM wrote:
PDAF performance is also a function of read frequency and processing of the PD pixels, and the lsi and faster main processor should help with that, no?


I would expect that AF performance is ultimately governed by sensor read speed. The A7RII was around 1/13s. The A9 is 1/150s. I'm not sure about the A7RIII since Sony do not provide this information on their site.



Oct 31, 2017 at 10:30 PM
Primus
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p.9 #9 · p.9 #9 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Mystik wrote:
No. The a9 has a higher density PDAF system. The upgrades to the a7rII's AF system come in the form of improvements to the CDAF system...more CDAF points and greater CDAF sensitivity, but the PDAF system is largely the same because PDAF is a function of the sensor itself and the a7rIII did not get a new sensor.

The a7rII may acquire focus more quickly because the CDAF system, which is software dependent, is faster...but it will not track as well as the a9. You can see how much better the a9 locks onto your subject by how stable the AF
...Show more
Ah, that makes sense, thank you. Did not realize that the sensor itself has the focus points embedded in it (PDAF), because most of the time it is in the lens.

However, there is more to it than just this. For example, I've used my Canon 100-400 MkII with the A9 via the Metabones V adapter and it is definitely much slower than the Sony GM lens. So the lens on the body is also very important. Will be curious to see how much better the A7Riii is. All I can say again is that we live in interesting times.




Oct 31, 2017 at 10:56 PM
sflxn
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p.9 #10 · p.9 #10 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


lambers wrote:
I would expect that AF performance is ultimately governed by sensor read speed. The A7RII was around 1/13s. The A9 is 1/150s. I'm not sure about the A7RIII since Sony do not provide this information on their site.


I suspect the bigger, more powerful(?) battery may let them drive the sensor faster, increasing the sensor read speed.



Nov 01, 2017 at 02:13 AM
 

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chrisgibbs
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p.9 #11 · p.9 #11 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Yep, the A7Rlll is the camera SONY should have released before the 24mp A9. Said it all along, going from the A7Rll to the A9 really made no rational sense for many.

GMPhotography wrote:
I think folks need to read and understand a little better if the specs. Itís not a clone by any stretch. This was said from the A7r to A7rII as well and it was far from the same thing in many ways.

Letís get back to reality I had the A7rII and sometimes it was a fight to get things done. It actually forced me to buy a A9 and drop from 42 to 24 and needless to say 4500 dollars. Folks upgrading to the A7rIII is not irrational itís actually smart as they know it will help them achieve
...Show more



Nov 01, 2017 at 03:06 AM
Steve Spencer
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p.9 #12 · p.9 #12 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Primus wrote:
Thank you, that's a well-reasoned approach.

For me the ideal camera would be an A7Rxxx with the high fps, fast and accurate AF like the A9. IBIS is great too. Everything else (even low battery life) I could live with. I tend to crop into my images and having more pixels to play with helps a lot. Thus I would prefer it to the A9xxx

I carried two A9 bodies and my A7Rii into the field earlier this year. We did a lot of fast action wildlife photography -
shooting gulls and pelicans diving for fish - while jostling for position among
...Show more

No I don't think AF is independent of the pixels on the sensor. Certainly contrast detect AF is very likely to be dependent on the pixel on the sensor and that is part of the process of AF that Sony uses. What also matters is how fast the particular phase detect AF points on the sensor are. I suspect they are faster on the A9 because of the back side BSI sensor which also make the sensor readout a lot faster. So, there are lots of factors going into the AF speed. Yes, the A7r III can push data almost as fast as the A9, but it can't read the sensor as fast and it likely is slower with contrast detect AF. I suspect they added the extra contrast detect AF areas (really they broke up the areas into smaller units) partly to help speed the AF of the A7r III. I would still guess that the A9 will have about twice as fast of AF as the A7r III, but that is just a guess and we will have to see as people get the new camera in their hands and compare it to the A9.



Nov 01, 2017 at 03:44 AM
Primus
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p.9 #13 · p.9 #13 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Steve Spencer wrote:
No I don't think AF is independent of the pixels on the sensor. Certainly contrast detect AF is very likely to be dependent on the pixel on the sensor and that is part of the process of AF that Sony uses. What also matters is how fast the particular phase detect AF points on the sensor are. I suspect they are faster on the A9 because of the back side BSI sensor which also make the sensor readout a lot faster. So, there are lots of factors going into the AF speed. Yes, the A7r III can push data
...Show more

I guess the only way to know is to test it.

I did compare the A9 with my a6500 to see if the APS-C sensor would offer an advantage for the final resolution after cropping the image. Shot BIF at the beach - fast flying least terns. I found the A9 to be superior for AF, significantly so. I suspect the A7Riii will be closer to the a6500 or perhaps a bit slower.

However, since my main use for the new camera will be with wider lenses (24-70), the need for critical AF as with a long zoom (where two inches can make a difference in whether you get the bird's eye or its leg) is somewhat less. So for me the fps is going to be the most important feature in this upgrade, and when you couple that with a bigger battery, the camera becomes a wildlife friendly item as opposed to just being a great landscape camera.



Nov 01, 2017 at 11:04 AM
dbehrens
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p.9 #14 · p.9 #14 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


So far I do not see any compelling reason to offload my A7r's. Just got back from a Utah/AZ landscape trip and they are still sharp-shooters.

I tried the A7rII and wasn't happy with the extra weight. Since I shoot tripod I don't need IBIS. The one thing I did like was shooting bracket on timer - but then again I have no problem attaching a cord.

Sony dragged their heels in getting anything out to tempt my wildlife needs so I went Fuji with their brilliant 100-400 w/1.4x and that scratched that itch. Otherwise I could have been tempted with the A7rIII + 100-400.

Edited on Nov 02, 2017 at 04:09 AM · View previous versions



Nov 01, 2017 at 05:31 PM
pasblues
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p.9 #15 · p.9 #15 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


GMPhotography wrote:
Ebay lenses yes. Cameras I would be very careful. Sony grey market you will not have any warranty in the US.buy cams from people you know. Your dealing with electronics. Lenses much less to go wrong. Iím not saying that because mine is up for sale either . I have said this for years. Ebay people unload there junk there. Just be careful . Please




Here's an article discussing grey market:


Edited on Nov 01, 2017 at 09:14 PM · View previous versions



Nov 01, 2017 at 05:33 PM
Mystik
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p.9 #16 · p.9 #16 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Steve Spencer wrote:
No I don't think AF is independent of the pixels on the sensor. Certainly contrast detect AF is very likely to be dependent on the pixel on the sensor and that is part of the process of AF that Sony uses. What also matters is how fast the particular phase detect AF points on the sensor are. I suspect they are faster on the A9 because of the back side BSI sensor which also make the sensor readout a lot faster. So, there are lots of factors going into the AF speed. Yes, the A7r III can push data
...Show more

The number of PDAF pixels does matter though. That's a component of sensor design, and one area where the a9 has a significant advantage over the a7rII/a7rIII sensor. It has basically twice the PDAF density, so PDAF performance overall will be better on the a9. CDAF with mirrorless systems is basically a crutch to deal with the short comings of on-sensor PDAF. The improvements to the a7rIII's AF system come in the form of improving the crutch, but the PDAF part of the equation looks largely unchanged.



Nov 01, 2017 at 07:00 PM
scrappydog
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p.9 #17 · p.9 #17 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


GMPhotography wrote:
Ebay lenses yes. Cameras I would be very careful. Sony grey market you will not have any warranty in the US.


Sony fixed my grey market A7RII as a warrantied item, no cost to me. That said, I wouldn't rely on Sony doing so.

Also, I tried to contact the grey market seller of my camera and they did not respond. As such, you shouldn't rely on warranty support from a grey market seller that alleges that you have a one year warranty through their business. Third party warranty vendors may be more trustworthy.



Nov 01, 2017 at 08:59 PM
Jacknut16
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p.9 #18 · p.9 #18 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


Just the better battery, dual cards, faster focusing, FPS speed, easy change to crop mode, faster on time, made it worth the switch to the A9 for me, and Im only a high end amateur.


Nov 01, 2017 at 09:06 PM
pasblues
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p.9 #19 · p.9 #19 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


scrappydog wrote:
Sony fixed my grey market A7RII as a warrantied item, no cost to me. That said, I wouldn't rely on Sony doing so.

Also, I tried to contact the grey market seller of my camera and they did not respond. As such, you shouldn't rely on warranty support from a grey market seller that alleges that you have a one year warranty through their business. Third party warranty vendors may be more trustworthy.


Yes, I get my warranties from Square Trade. Of course, Murphy's Law, I've never had to use any of them.



Nov 01, 2017 at 09:13 PM
Charlie N
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p.9 #20 · p.9 #20 · So everyone is ditching the A7RII for A7RIII ???


dbehrens wrote:
So far I do not see any compelling reason to offload my A7r's. Just got back from a Utah/AZ landscape trip and they are still sharp-shooters.

I tried the A7rII and wasn't happy with the extra weight. Since I shoot tripod I don't need IBIS. The one thing I did like was shooting bracket on timer - but then again I have no problem attaching a cord.

Sony dragged their heels in getting anything out to temp my wildlife needs so I went Fuji with their brilliant 100-400 w/1.4x and that scratched that itch. Otherwise I could have been tempted
...Show more

Having a Sony A7riii + 100-400 + 1.4x sure seams lighter/more cost effective than a two system approach.



Nov 01, 2017 at 09:56 PM
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