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Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?
  
 
freaklikeme
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p.5 #1 · p.5 #1 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Curious about something, and since this is a speculation thread, I may as well ask it here...

Is everyone convinced the a7rIII/a9r isn't going to end-up with the same sensor as the D850? To me, this just feels like the typical year of exclusivity they offer Nikon before putting the chip in their own camera, just like they did with the 24MP and 36MP. My guess is the rII's successor is going to be focused more on making improvements in usability than resolution.



Oct 06, 2017 at 08:44 PM
scrappydog
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p.5 #2 · p.5 #2 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


With the speculation that Canon and Nikon are going to get into the full-frame mirrorless game, I'm assuming Sony will bring both resolution and usability enhancements with the goal of creating a wider gap.


Oct 06, 2017 at 08:59 PM
Mathieu18
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p.5 #3 · p.5 #3 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Recent article on DPR I think included info from interviews with Sony’s sensor division. Interestingly, they are a separate company from Sony’s cameras. They will tell Sony camera what tech they have in the sensor pipe line but not necessarily what sensor they’re developing for Nikon etc. it’s fair to wonder just how solid this “wall” is, but more likely Sony Camera is saying, “I need a sensor with these specs” than just taking what’s available.

freaklikeme wrote:
Curious about something, and since this is a speculation thread, I may as well ask it here...

Is everyone convinced the a7rIII/a9r isn't going to end-up with the same sensor as the D850? To me, this just feels like the typical year of exclusivity they offer Nikon before putting the chip in their own camera, just like they did with the 24MP and 36MP. My guess is the rII's successor is going to be focused more on making improvements in usability than resolution.




Oct 06, 2017 at 11:41 PM
Mystik
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p.5 #4 · p.5 #4 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


freaklikeme wrote:
Curious about something, and since this is a speculation thread, I may as well ask it here...

Is everyone convinced the a7rIII/a9r isn't going to end-up with the same sensor as the D850? To me, this just feels like the typical year of exclusivity they offer Nikon before putting the chip in their own camera, just like they did with the 24MP and 36MP. My guess is the rII's successor is going to be focused more on making improvements in usability than resolution.


It's my understanding that Nikon designed the sensor and that Sony is doing the fabrication for them. Sony already has their version of the D850 sensor...it's basically the a7rII sensor.



Oct 07, 2017 at 12:08 AM
jimmy462
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p.5 #5 · p.5 #5 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Crop Pregius global-shutter sensor in a9 body, goodbye ergonomic-nightmare a6300.




Oct 09, 2017 at 01:43 AM
k-h.a.w
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p.5 #6 · p.5 #6 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Mathieu18 wrote:
Recent article on DPR I think included info from interviews with Sony’s sensor division. Interestingly, they are a separate company from Sony’s cameras. They will tell Sony camera what tech they have in the sensor pipe line but not necessarily what sensor they’re developing for Nikon etc. it’s fair to wonder just how solid this “wall” is, but more likely Sony Camera is saying, “I need a sensor with these specs” than just taking what’s available.



I would think that “wall” is 100% bullet proof! Otherwise Nikon wouldn't agree to that IMHO.

K-H.



Oct 09, 2017 at 02:01 AM
Mathieu18
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p.5 #7 · p.5 #7 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


There’s actually a lot of chatter that the D850 chip is made by Tower Semiconductor, an Israeli based Panasonic spin-off / JV. So maybe Nikon wasn’t okay with the relationship!


Oct 09, 2017 at 02:09 AM
PhilthePhrame
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p.5 #8 · p.5 #8 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


My money would also be on some long primes - 200, 300, 400 - to support the A9 as a sports/ wildlife camera.

(And also because I've just picked up 200mm and 400mm Canon primes!)



Oct 09, 2017 at 04:35 AM
MedicineMan404
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p.5 #9 · p.5 #9 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Well couldn't is also be the RX10iv which ships in the U.S. in roughly a week?
or even the RX100vi ??



Oct 09, 2017 at 04:46 AM
chez
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p.5 #10 · p.5 #10 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


k-h.a.w wrote:
I would think that “wall” is 100% bullet proof! Otherwise Nikon wouldn't agree to that IMHO.

K-H.


Not a chance it's 100% bullet proof. The separation between the two divisions was for management and accounting purposes...they still belong to the same Sony Corp. Nikon's choices here are very limited...it's not like they can take their ball and go to another park to play.



Oct 09, 2017 at 01:31 PM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



k-h.a.w
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p.5 #11 · p.5 #11 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


chez wrote:
Not a chance it's 100% bullet proof. The separation between the two divisions was for management and accounting purposes...they still belong to the same Sony Corp. Nikon's choices here are very limited...it's not like they can take their ball and go to another park to play.


Thanks chez. Well, IIRC some Sony managers said in an interview that Nikon's proprietary information was compartmentalized and not shared with Sony's camera division. Having myself worked with several competing companies simultaneously and having access to their proprietary information under NDA it's imperative to follow the agreements in spirit and verbatim. I would assume a company like Sony applies the same high standard.

K-H.



Oct 09, 2017 at 02:07 PM
bjornthun
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p.5 #12 · p.5 #12 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


k-h.a.w wrote:
Thanks chez. Well, IIRC some Sony managers said in an interview that Nikon's proprietary information was compartmentalized and not shared with Sony's camera division. Having myself worked with several competing companies simultaneously and having access to their proprietary information under NDA it's imperative to follow the agreements in spirit and verbatim. I would assume a company like Sony applies the same high standard.

K-H.


Sony also make sensors for cell phone makers and the automotive industry, so I think they adhere to the same high standard, otherwise they could end up losing business at some point in the future. It's key to their survival in the long run. I don't see why Nikon should not be treated properly in this case.



Oct 09, 2017 at 05:11 PM
chez
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p.5 #13 · p.5 #13 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


bjornthun wrote:
Sony also make sensors for cell phone makers and the automotive industry, so I think they adhere to the same high standard, otherwise they could end up losing business at some point in the future. It's key to their survival in the long run. I don't see why Nikon should not be treated properly in this case.


I believe back a few months ago a senior Sony executive said that their sensor technology is key to their success and that Sony is going to keep it's best sensor technology exclusive to their own needs for a year or more before lettings others get it.

This to me indicates there is sone cross talk between the sensors division and the imaging divisions.



Oct 09, 2017 at 05:35 PM
bjornthun
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p.5 #14 · p.5 #14 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


chez wrote:
I believe back a few months ago a senior Sony executive said that their sensor technology is key to their success and that Sony is going to keep it's best sensor technology exclusive to their own needs for a year or more before lettings others get it.

This to me indicates there is sone cross talk between the sensors division and the imaging divisions.


Wasn't that part of the interview at Imaging Ressources that was later corrected? Nikon is supposed to be Sony's largest customer for system camera sensors, so I don't think they would hurt that relationship. As far as I have understood, the sensor in the Nikon D850 is excellent but not groundbreaking, e.g. no PDAF.



Oct 09, 2017 at 05:41 PM
chez
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p.5 #15 · p.5 #15 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


bjornthun wrote:
Wasn't that part of the interview at Imaging Ressources that was later corrected? Nikon is supposed to be Sony's largest customer for system camera sensors, so I don't think they would hurt that relationship. As far as I have understood, the sensor in the Nikon D850 is excellent but not groundbreaking, e.g. no PDAF.


I don't believe they were corrected...just pulled.

I also would think Sony cameras are the imaging divisions largest camera sensor customer.



Oct 09, 2017 at 06:19 PM
freaklikeme
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p.5 #16 · p.5 #16 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


scrappydog wrote:
With the speculation that Canon and Nikon are going to get into the full-frame mirrorless game, I'm assuming Sony will bring both resolution and usability enhancements with the goal of creating a wider gap.


Have to say, I'll believe Nikon and Canon have FF mirrorless entries when they're in the hands of users, but you may be right about Sony trying to make sure there is a canyon to jump before another manufacturer decides to get in the game.



Oct 11, 2017 at 12:51 AM
freaklikeme
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p.5 #17 · p.5 #17 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Mathieu18 wrote:
Recent article on DPR I think included info from interviews with Sony’s sensor division. Interestingly, they are a separate company from Sony’s cameras. They will tell Sony camera what tech they have in the sensor pipe line but not necessarily what sensor they’re developing for Nikon etc. it’s fair to wonder just how solid this “wall” is, but more likely Sony Camera is saying, “I need a sensor with these specs” than just taking what’s available.



I'm not surprised by the walls between divisions, and I don't think the 24MP chip is exactly the same in the D3s and a850/900, or the 36MP chip in the D800e and a7r. There's obviously some customization between the two sets, but the resolution remains the same. That's what makes me wonder if the next jump isn't quite the big jump people are expecting.



Oct 11, 2017 at 12:55 AM
freaklikeme
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p.5 #18 · p.5 #18 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


Mathieu18 wrote:
There’s actually a lot of chatter that the D850 chip is made by Tower Semiconductor, an Israeli based Panasonic spin-off / JV. So maybe Nikon wasn’t okay with the relationship!


To me, that would make sense. I haven't researched it much, but some of the things that have been said about Sony from people connected to Nikon makes me wonder if the relationship has soured. If the sensor is from another manufacturer, then the rumors about Sony's 50+MP sensor in the next 7r would also make more sense to me.



Oct 11, 2017 at 01:00 AM
freaklikeme
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p.5 #19 · p.5 #19 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


MedicineMan404 wrote:
Well couldn't is also be the RX10iv which ships in the U.S. in roughly a week?
or even the RX100vi ??


But the 10iv was announced previously. Are they up to vi on the 100? Sheesh.



Oct 11, 2017 at 01:02 AM
artur5
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p.5 #20 · p.5 #20 · Sony's October Surprise- any guesses?


According to SAR, in all likelihood the next A7x series will be the A7sIII ( to be announced in a week).
Let's wait and see.




Oct 11, 2017 at 08:46 AM
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