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censorship
  
 
R.H. Johnson
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · censorship


https://www.google.com/search?q=vietnam+girl+napalm&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiiuKuU3p3WAhWEjFQKHaz7D0kQ_AUICigB&biw=1522&bih=750&dpr=1.25#imgrc=wlibpJD6snF6dM:

what does one do in a case like this an iconic historical photograph? can't be posted or referenced? really? all money ain't good money. but it is good to know where one's priority is. should have never started biased censorship on this site to begin with. now look at it where it's evolved, lol..... sad very sad.




Sep 11, 2017 at 06:26 PM
BigIronCruiser
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · censorship


FM has every right to set and/or modify acceptable standards. Why is that sad?


Sep 11, 2017 at 07:56 PM
WiseTioga
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · censorship


Not out to start a flame war or to provoke the site owner/manager, however three simple points.

1. Nothing that i have seen on the entire FM site has been offensive to me. Yes, there have been photos that I did not like/care for. But you know what? I clicked and moved of and I was not hurt in any way from the experience.

2. What I do find to be offensive is censorship of any kind. You can look or not look as you wish. Let me decide what I want to look at or not as I wish.

3. Finally, WHAT ADS? I have never seen an ad on this site in all the time I have spent here so really don't understand that part of the issue at all.



Sep 11, 2017 at 09:31 PM
rw11
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · censorship


BigIronCruiser wrote:
FM has every right to set and/or modify acceptable standards. Why is that sad?


censorship



Sep 11, 2017 at 10:11 PM
Bob Kane
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · censorship


BigIronCruiser wrote:
FM has every right to set and/or modify acceptable standards. Why is that sad?


It's sad because it was basically dictated by sponsors, as I understand Fred's explanation. It wasn't a freely-made decision. While there are few if any outright ads on this site, B&H and Adorama have buttons and we might assume that one or both applied some pressure. That may not be a fair assessment but the whole situation doesn't give me warm and fuzzy feelings.



Sep 11, 2017 at 11:32 PM
4meNex7
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · censorship


Any business, organization, club, forum, etc, has the right to run it the way they see fit. For whatever reasons they deem to be important. It can be called censorship, but it doesn't matter one bit, it is what it is, a business decision made to allow the forum to continue to be a viable operation. If it is important to a person to view or create nudity as an art form, seek a forum that allows it. Or start your own forum, and discover the difficulties of building it into one as successful as this forum. This forum will continue to be successful without nudity, because as a whole it's made up of members from all over the world that are interested in the art and advancement of photography. As I stated before, I have no morality issues with nudity, the decision of the forum owner was strictly a business one. This forum is made up of other besides the "People". The forum as a whole should not have to suffer because some of the members in the "People" forum want nudity. Like it or not the forum neeeds sponsors to be successful.








Sep 11, 2017 at 11:40 PM
jecottrell
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · censorship


4meNex7 wrote:
Like it or not the forum neeeds sponsors to be successful.


Do you know that for a fact?



Sep 12, 2017 at 12:35 AM
4meNex7
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · censorship


jecottrell wrote:
Do you know that for a fact?


Are you serious? In his post stating nudity would not be allowed, Fred Miranda said "Our advertisers are demanding the removal of these threads from the site, and we are not in a financial position to go to war with them over this issue. I've exhausted all means of disputing this issue with them". And that's a "fact".



Sep 12, 2017 at 01:03 AM
anthonysemone
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · censorship


This is simple, guys. Fred needs $ to run this site. HIs ad buyers say: "We don't like X; take it off, or we're pulling the $ plug on you." Fred can't make it without the ad buyers' $. He wants to run the site. So, he made a choice. He gets his $, site continues. No rocket science there or Trump conspiracies. His site. His rules. Don't like it, go to Flckr or 500px.


Sep 12, 2017 at 02:01 AM
friscoron
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · censorship


To me, this is much ado about nothing. We don't get a lot of artistic nudes posted here. Maybe one or two a month? Sponsors get to have a lot of say in things, not just in this forum but in any medium in which they are investing. Have you ever noticed that there is no porn on the Disney Channel? If you're going to be upset about this and call this censorship, shouldn't you also complain about the Disney Channel and demand they show some porn, or at least artistic porn stuff?

You see, if you think about it, every program gets to determine what kind of content is going to be on it. They also have the right to change what they're showing. Even Model Mayhem a couple years ago made changes, if I understand correctly. There's still plenty of places where you can post and view nude photos, just like there are plenty of TV channels where you can watch porn. Just not on Disney, and not on FM.

Hey, maybe we can hit up NIckolodeum and see if they'll go with some soft, artistic porn. Or... on the other hand, probably not.



Sep 12, 2017 at 02:18 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



Kohala
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · censorship


Hey folks! This subject has already been beaten to death. It's time to move on.


Sep 12, 2017 at 03:03 AM
mbellot
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · censorship


Kohala wrote:
Hey folks! This subject has already been beaten to death. It's time to move on.


But beating dead horses is one of the original reasons the internet was invented.

Porn was number one, Nigerian prince scams number two and senseless brutality to topics that have been thoroughly covered was third.




Sep 12, 2017 at 03:31 AM
Kohala
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · censorship


mbellot wrote:
But beating dead horses is one of the original reasons the internet was invented.

Porn was number one, Nigerian prince scams number two and senseless brutality to topics that have been thoroughly covered was third.



Well, you got me there. Carry on posters, carry on. . .



Sep 12, 2017 at 03:38 AM
Berkyboy
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · censorship


.....speaking of irony, this is the "clickable" ad I'm now seeing attached to this thread

Steve







Sep 12, 2017 at 05:01 AM
ATHP
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · censorship


Fred just wants to make a nice community for us and unfortunately that requires some form of upkeep. So unless there is another option he's stuck with membership fees or bending to the requirements of advertisers.

If you have a problem with the latter - I recommend you reach out to them directly rather than complain to Fred. We are their intended customers after all, and this is likely the result of blanket, overly cautious policies.

My two cents - yes there is no porn on the Disney Channel but there never was intended to be from the beginning. This site was intended to be for free expression including nude work. Some of that has changed over the years and I've stopped visiting as frequently as a result. Much of life is shocking and sensitive by nature and to me that is the beauty of photographing it - to capture the human experience. Personally I don't agree with bending our artistic sensibilities to corporate and PC culture requirements. While we're at it let's cover up the Statue of David.



Sep 12, 2017 at 05:41 AM
R.H. Johnson
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · censorship


don't get it twisted. this is not about the dividends required to run this website. after all it is not that expensive monetarily to host a website. logically the paid memberships could cover the hosting fees. the issue is about bottom line profit.. every time someone uses those links in a partnership program to buy anything miranda gets a percentage of the sale, profit. capitalism plain and simple. profit not for the site but for fred miranda. fred is protecting his profit which is exactly what a business is supposed to do.

i have no problem with making money or capitalism. that's the american way. it is his site and there is nothing wrong with running the site as a business for profit. that is what businesses do.

however, game does recognize game. it is quite disingenuous for fred to censor this site and not make a clear distinction between one's profit and subsistence as far as FM is concerned. damn i'm learning about sponsored partnership links to institue on my own website.

i don't like censorship it's contrary to freedom of speech. corporate censorship is insidious in its very nature. it saddens me to see such a fine upstanding young man with a truly good website and online community become a victim of corporate manipulation for profit's sake.

censorship, now that it has begun where does it end? hmmm, just my 2 cents. end of line.....
.



Edited on Sep 12, 2017 at 03:29 PM · View previous versions



Sep 12, 2017 at 08:00 AM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · censorship


Berkyboy wrote:
.....speaking of irony, this is the "clickable" ad I'm now seeing attached to this thread

Steve


I hear you.



Sep 12, 2017 at 02:12 PM
Helen Oster
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · censorship


Bob Kane wrote:
.......Adorama have buttons and we might assume that one or both applied some pressure.


We have?? We did?



(Nothing I'm aware of.....)



Sep 12, 2017 at 03:14 PM
PhilPDX
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · censorship


4meNex7 wrote:
The forum as a whole should not have to suffer because some of the members in the "People" forum want nudity.


You are missing the point completely. Today we are banning artistic nudity, tomorrow a sponsor comes along who doesn't like images of mating animals, next week someone demands that photos of swimmers at a sporting event need to be removed because they show too much skin. Would you be okay with such a development? I wouldn't.

-Phil




Sep 12, 2017 at 03:15 PM
jwilson66
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · censorship


"You are missing the point completely. Today we are banning artistic nudity,...."

Don't forget a bunch of statues of dead guys and people with unpopular opinions on college campuses....



Sep 12, 2017 at 04:14 PM
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