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New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!
  
 
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Hi Everyone,
In the past some members posted links to NSFW content, artistic nudes or fine art figure work on the People Photography's board.

However, effective immediately, these types of images will not be allowed here on fredmiranda.com - even if they are labeled and posted as links.

Our advertisers are demanding the removal of these threads from the site, and we are not in a financial position to go to war with them over this issue. I've exhausted all means of disputing this issue with them.

In adherence to our new policy, any previously posted threads of this nature are subject to immediate removal.

Your entire thread or post will be deleted and your account will be locked without further warning if you post anything that is: not suitable for work (NSFW), contains nudity of any kind, sexually oriented or explicit content or anything that can be deemed inappropriate -- which may also include offensive content such as bullying or intimidation of an individual or group, racial discrimination, hate group paraphernalia, graphic crime scene or accident images, cruelty to animals, murder and self-harm.

Thank you for your understanding in this matter.

All the best,
Fred Miranda



Sep 07, 2017 at 05:03 PM
4meNex7
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Thank you Fred. For my family this will be a good move.
Regards
Ed



Sep 07, 2017 at 06:17 PM
Brev00
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


That is totally understandable but, also, very unfortunate. I think many of these sorts of images have been as good as anything else posted to this website. Not for the prurient interest but because of the sheer artistry. Michelangelo is spinning in his grave. Such is life in our litigious world.


Sep 07, 2017 at 07:34 PM
Kohala
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


I understand the economic reasons for banning nudity from your website. But I am deeply troubled by this. Only in America do we equate nudity with sex. This type of censorship would never happen in Europe or Scandinavia. Americans dirty little secret--they spend billions purchasing pornography every year.

It shows how out of whack our values are when we decry nudity but permit posts in this forum that show a teenager brandishing an assault rifle. Now that's really offensive!

A comment on Eds post who indicates "For my family this {banning nudity} will be a good move." Really, do his family members have access to nude images on the FM forum. If they do and Ed doesn't approve he might consider instituting safeguards to limit access to his computer.

Finally, there is an old adage, Australia got the convicts and America got the evangelicals--Australia got the better of the deal.



Sep 07, 2017 at 09:43 PM
nsarcastic
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Thanks for trying to dispute the issue with them, Fred. Money is power, I guess.

Now you'll have to figure out where to draw the line on pics involving partial nudity (i.e. swimsuits, fashion shoots, etc.). How much skin is too much skin? Ah well.



Sep 07, 2017 at 10:07 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Kohala wrote:
I understand the economic reasons for banning nudity from your website. But I am deeply troubled by this. Only in America do we equate nudity with sex. This type of censorship would never happen in Europe or Scandinavia. Americans dirty little secret--they spend billions purchasing pornography every year.

It shows how out of whack our values are when we decry nudity but permit posts in this forum that show a teenager brandishing an assault rifle. Now that's really offensive!

A comment on Eds post who indicates "For my family this {banning nudity} will be a good move." Really, do his family members
...Show more

I think the issue is the lack of distinction between nudity captured artistically and pornographic content. I'm also saddened by this decision since we've allowed artistic nudes and fine art figure work here for more than fifteen years.
Today I had to choose between blocking all NSFW content or lose most of the site's revenue. It was not an easy decision and I appreciate your understanding.



Sep 07, 2017 at 11:12 PM
anthonysemone
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


OMG!!! Which advertisers, Fred, so that I may systematically avoid their product(s). What an utter crock.

So, let me get this straight: if I go to Paris and photograph a nude statue, and decide because of its artistic value that fellow photogs here would be interested in seeing it, I am nonetheless forbidden from publishing it? Sad to say, Fred, they've gotten you down the slippery slope. Hmmmm, What will the next content area be? Military aircraft? I feel very sad for you.

As I said: OMG!!!

OMG!!!



Sep 07, 2017 at 11:16 PM
Andre Labonte
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Fred Miranda wrote:
I think the issue is the lack of distinction between nudity captured artistically and pornographic content. I'm also saddened by this decision since we've allowed artistic nudes and fine art figure work here for more than fifteen years.
Today I had to choose between blocking all NSFW content or lose most of the site's revenue. It was not an easy decision and I appreciate your understanding.


**********************

You hit the nail on the head Fred. Sad day, but it will make the site more family friendly.



Sep 08, 2017 at 12:07 AM
Kohala
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Fred, you indicate above that "the issue is the lack of distinction between nudity captured artistically and pornographic content." If I understand your new rule you make no distinction whatsoever--all nudity whether it has artistic merit or not is banned.

Like other posters here, I have photos of nude statues taken in Europe. Are these banned? How about low-cut blouses, bikinis. Your new rule includes no due process. If you see a photo you believe violates your "no nudity" policy, the poster is banned, period.

Economic issues aside, you need to rethink your new journey into censorship.



Sep 08, 2017 at 12:18 AM
4meNex7
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Kohala wrote:
I understand the economic reasons for banning nudity from your website. But I am deeply troubled by this. Only in America do we equate nudity with sex. This type of censorship would never happen in Europe or Scandinavia. Americans dirty little secret--they spend billions purchasing pornography every year.

It shows how out of whack our values are when we decry nudity but permit posts in this forum that show a teenager brandishing an assault rifle. Now that's really offensive!

A comment on Eds post who indicates "For my family this {banning nudity} will be a good move." Really, do his family members
...Show more

My comment was purely in support of Fred Miranda's forum change decision, and not in any way a judgement of anyone's moral position. I too see nudity as an art form, but in my case it's where and when I choose to view it. The advertisers that support this forum have every right to control what their name is linked with. If this was a subscription forum supported by it's members, the members would have every right to control it's content. If the members of this forum voicing so loudly against the nudity restriction were asked to support the forum with hard cash you'd really see the bleachers clear out fast. As Fred Miranda has stated, it was not a morality issue. He has always allowed nudity as long as it had a NSFW attached. Some will see it for what it is, an economic issue, and some will see it as an opportunity to get on their soapboxes yelling the "the moral cops! the moral cops! " Oh yeah and some will even take a jab at those nasty "American" moral cops. Seeing how upset some get over whether the forum allows nudity or not makes me wonder if nudity is the only reason they're members here. If you want a forum with no restrictions or rules, put your money near your mouth, and start your own forum.
If the ban on nudity allows this forum to continue as the quality forum that it's been, I will support that 100%.
Regards
Ed





Sep 08, 2017 at 12:33 AM
 

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shaunmcfd
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Would the ones that are not in favor of Fred's decision be willing to replace lost revenue when an advertiser pulls out?


Sep 08, 2017 at 01:00 AM
formula4speed
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Serious question, how do we know exactly what might be "deemed inappropriate"? That's a huge grey area that will earn someone an immediate ban. Swimsuits? Short shorts? Shirtless male fitness models?

Does this apply to the whole forum? I.E., will you be going into the image threads in the gear forums and purging posts of "offensive" images?



Sep 08, 2017 at 01:13 AM
Kohala
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


shaunmcfd wrote:
Would the ones that are not in favor of Fred's decision be willing to replace lost revenue when an advertiser pulls out?


I would support this wholeheartedly . The Fred Miranda forum is without a doubt the best one. I would gladly pay a subscription fee to be a member.



Sep 08, 2017 at 01:29 AM
anthonysemone
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


And what the idiot advertisers don't get are the number of FM members who employ ad blockers - and don't see their bullshite to begin with.


Sep 08, 2017 at 01:39 AM
friscoron
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!



I think my concern is the same as forumla4speed. I don't shoot nudes, or anything even close to that, or pornographic. However, what if one of my dancers were wearing something so skimpy that someone considered it sexual in nature? That's it. I'm permanently banned because I edged over the gray area? I can understand it if someone blatantly posts an obviously nude shot, whether pornographic or not. That would be a clear break of a rule. It's just the gray-area calls that concern me.

Personally, I really don't care if nudes are on here or not. If I really want to look at nudes, I can head over to 500px. I'm just here for the quality of images posted here, and mostly because of the community we've created here. This is like my photographic family.



Sep 08, 2017 at 02:43 AM
pitbullo
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Fred Miranda wrote:

Your entire thread or post will be deleted and your account will be locked without further warning if you post anything that is: not suitable for work (NSFW), contains nudity of any kind, sexually oriented or explicit content or anything that can be deemed inappropriate -- which may also include offensive content such as bullying or intimidation of an individual or group, racial discrimination, hate group paraphernalia, graphic crime scene or accident images, cruelty to animals, murder and self-harm.

Thank you for your understanding in this matter.

All the best,
Fred Miranda


The nudity aspect has been discussed above, but I am also wondering about all the other topics that arenīt allowed anymore. Done right, all of these can be used as really really powerful photography topics. Important as well. What is left then? Family candids and studio portraits?



Sep 08, 2017 at 04:01 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


formula4speed wrote:
Serious question, how do we know exactly what might be "deemed inappropriate"? That's a huge grey area that will earn someone an immediate ban. Swimsuits? Short shorts? Shirtless male fitness models?

Does this apply to the whole forum? I.E., will you be going into the image threads in the gear forums and purging posts of "offensive" images?


A good rule of thumb is that if an image is NSFW, it should not be posted. When in doubt, you can already reach me via PM before posting it.

I'm the moderator and would never ban any FM member without notice. It's going to be an adjustment for all of us.



Sep 08, 2017 at 04:11 AM
leighton w
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Kohala wrote:
I would support this wholeheartedly . The Fred Miranda forum is without a doubt the best one. I would gladly pay a subscription fee to be a member.


If everybody who spends time on this site would do so, Fred may be able to let the advertiser(s) that's causing the problem go.

I'll be looking forward to seeing all the "Upload & Sell" badges turn to on!



Sep 08, 2017 at 10:07 AM
markperez
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


guess that means zero swimsuit photoshoots unless they are 1920s style.


Sep 08, 2017 at 11:19 AM
shekarn64
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · New policy regarding NSFW and Nudity. Please read!


Is there any way to post the image/start the thread and get the moderators to approve before it is made public?

And BTW, the NY Bakery advertisement is annoying! It starts to play by itself and cannot stop it or mute it



Sep 08, 2017 at 11:54 AM
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