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Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ...
  
 
zhangyue
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


snapsy wrote:
Tony didn't really measure the electronic shutter noise properly. The penalty would be in DR, which is represented in the deep shadows near clipping. Tony only showed the midtones and highlights for the base ISO image. To measure that the image needs to be underexposed and then pushed in post by at least 5-6EV - this is what demonstrates the penalty on other cameras like the A7rII. Tony does show an ISO 25,600 comparison as well, which would achieve a similar result as a deep shadow push at base ISO. Unfortunately the heavy LED light banding from the electronic shutter
...Show more

I agree with your comments. It is a little premature to call it off. I only judge from the fact he couldn't detect any extra noise or difference between the two, but that is not enough for mid tone only.

From 25600 shots, I didn't see noise difference other than flickering pattern but the video is not clear enough.

I really wish he can go back to push those shadow files to see the difference. I will keep my finger crossed until someone capable to do the proper test.



Sep 08, 2017 at 05:44 PM
zhangyue
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Stoffer wrote:
Bill Claff is ready with his DR measurements:

http://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Nikon%20D810,Nikon%20D850

Pretty much as D810 but with dual gain adding a bit of DR at ISO 400 and above.


If we can resize D850 file to D810, I think its reasonable to say D850 has about one stop at high ISO advantage to D810. and has slightly advantage at ISO64 as well.

From Tony's Video, I feel it is even better than D810 at ISO64 after push the file at pixel level. There is no magenta hue after push, maybe this is something can't be reflected by DR measurement but the difference is very important for real world usage. (I hate those magenta and green hue after shadow push)

Irental, a rental company in China had a set of measurement of D850, it is now 2nd in DR only behind Phase IQ3100. Their past measurement about other camera match DXO results actually. So I will give them some credits.

See post I made here.
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1503664/13#14173496




Sep 08, 2017 at 05:53 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


quick recap of SILENT SHOOTING in LIVE VIEW

https://youtu.be/B_CF1_OT5GQ



Sep 08, 2017 at 05:56 PM
Stoffer
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


zhangyue wrote:
If we can resize D850 file to D810, I think its reasonable to say D850 has about one stop at high ISO advantage to D810. and has slightly advantage at ISO64 as well.


I find that you really have to play with raw files yourself to judge this fully. It is a matter of noise (grain) characteristics and how easy it is to reduce luminosity noise without sacrificing detail. Color noise isn't an issue much these days.



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:00 PM
Stoffer
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


zhangyue wrote:
From Tony's Video, I feel it is even better than D810 at ISO64 after push the file at pixel level. There is no magenta hue after push, maybe this is something can't be reflected by DR measurement but the difference is very important for real world usage. (I hate those magenta and green hue after shadow push)

Irental, a rental company in China had a set of measurement of D850, it is now 2nd in DR only behind Phase IQ3100. Their past measurement about other camera match DXO results actually. So I will give them some credits.

See post I made
...Show more

Good point regarding shadow color cast. Interesting find from China!



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:01 PM
Ai_Print
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Dj R wrote:
The D750 feels like a toy after handling the D850


, ok, if you say so. But if you ski double black diamond runs and climb mountains with camera in tow for a living, that small and light form factor is *golden*!

I'm torn between selling the D750 or the D810 this time around. Since I shoot Leica and Hasselblad as well, I really don't need three Nikon digital bodies.

If the 850 were more the size and weight of the 750, I would have ordered two on the spot.



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:04 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Ai_Print wrote:
, ok, if you say so. But if you ski double black diamond runs and climb mountains with camera in tow for a living, that small and light form factor is *golden*!

I'm torn between selling the D750 or the D810 this time around. Since I shoot Leica and Hasselblad as well, I really don't need three Nikon digital bodies.

If the 850 were more the size and weight of the 750, I would have ordered two on the spot.


oh no worries man
I will not sell my d750 until d760!
I want to have a d760 and d850
you're right for sure!
I want two size bodies!
cheers



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:21 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


iso 1600
iso 900

JPG!
no other NR or masking or applied to eliminate noise, I promise
all noise control and auto other stuff - in camera is turned off.




  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/2.8    1/200s    1600 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/2.8    1/200s    900 ISO    0.0 EV  




Sep 08, 2017 at 06:23 PM
Stoffer
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Dj R wrote:
quick recap of SILENT SHOOTING in LIVE VIEW

https://youtu.be/B_CF1_OT5GQ


Thanks, Ryan! How fast would you say it is to focus in live focus? Those areas in the vid where pretty close to each other, so I wonder whether it will struggle a bit more if you focus from, say, 2 to 10 meter?



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:31 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Stoffer wrote:
Thanks, Ryan! How fast would you say it is to focus in live focus? Those areas in the vid where pretty close to each other, so I wonder whether it will struggle a bit more if you focus from, say, 2 to 10 meter?


I will shoot again for you.
But I'm not 100% clear on what you want me to gauge.
do you want me to shoot from much closer to the table top? and then switch to a much more unique AF point?



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:36 PM
 

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Stoffer
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Dj R wrote:
I will shoot again for you.
But I'm not 100% clear on what you want me to gauge.
do you want me to shoot from much closer to the table top? and then switch to a much more unique AF point?


Yeah, I thinking about first focusing on something like 2 meters away, then on something 3 or 4 meters away. Hope it makes sense. I understand it might not be possible to do with your table setup, then just forget about it.



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:40 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


@Stoffer
how about this?
https://youtu.be/sYgTXM5EEIk
video of #2 test - silent shooting in live view
broader range of meters, whatever those are ;P



Sep 08, 2017 at 06:52 PM
Stoffer
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


Dj R wrote:
@Stoffer@
how about this?
https://youtu.be/sYgTXM5EEIk
video of #2 test - silent shooting in live view
broader range of meters, whatever those are ;P


That is a very respectable focus speed for CDAF on a full frame sensor. Very nice. Thanks a lot for doing this!



Sep 08, 2017 at 07:35 PM
Dj R
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


checking out medium iso
JPG fine*




NO NR applied

  NIKON D850    70.0-200.0 mm f/2.8 lens    86mm    f/2.8    1/100s    500 ISO    0.0 EV  






NO NR applied

  NIKON D850    70.0-200.0 mm f/2.8 lens    86mm    f/2.8    1/200s    2000 ISO    0.0 EV  






NR applied

  NIKON D850    70.0-200.0 mm f/2.8 lens    86mm    f/2.8    1/200s    2000 ISO    0.0 EV  




Sep 08, 2017 at 09:22 PM
bclaff_too
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


zhangyue wrote:
If we can resize D850 file to D810, I think its reasonable to say D850 has about one stop at high ISO advantage to D810. and has slightly advantage at ISO64 as well.

Not sure what you mean here since Photographic Dynamic Range (PDR) is already normalized.
zhangyue wrote:
From Tony's Video, I feel it is even better than D810 at ISO64 after push the file at pixel level. There is no magenta hue after push, maybe this is something can't be reflected by DR measurement but the difference is very important for real world usage. (I hate those magenta and green hue after shadow push)

As you say, pixel level, not normalized to print size.
zhangyue wrote:
Irental, a rental company in China had a set of measurement of D850, it is now 2nd in DR only behind Phase IQ3100. Their past measurement about other camera match DXO results actually. So I will give them some credits.

See post I made here.
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1503664/13#14173496


I get similar numbers as the DxOMark prediction.
It's very easy to predict DxOMark once you have read noise.
The problem is, DxOMark Landscape score isn't really a good measure.
Photographic Dynamic Range (PDR) really is better for sound technical reasons (that don't fit in such a short post).



Sep 08, 2017 at 09:52 PM
zhangyue
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


bclaff_too wrote:
Not sure what you mean here since Photographic Dynamic Range (PDR) is already normalized.



I meant to resize D850's 46M to D810's 36M, D850 will have advantage if they are perform about the same at pixel level.

I am still reading your PDR definition. I didn't realize that is normalized results. I thought it is a pixel level measurement. (just use different thread hold for noise level to measure DR).



Sep 08, 2017 at 10:30 PM
Ai_Print
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


I have not done a lot of comparisons yet because I am still setting up the camera but when shooting in low light at ISO 6,400 and 12,800 with both my 810 and 850's noise reduction set at low in JPEG, I am seeing a good solid stop improvement in noise reduction on the 850. I also see no color noise at all and a lot more details.

Now, when I take the NEF files images into Adobe CC RAW, I still see an easy one stop gain on the 850 compared to the 810. And again, color noise is pretty much gone on the RAW 850 shots at those ISO's. On the 810 at 12800, I see some magenta in the shadow areas and some lack of uniformity in otherwise even areas of color. In the 850 file, it is totally even and there is not a trace of magenta cast lifting the shadows.

I had to go into a closet with just a bit of light creeping in, about 1/125th at 1.4 at ISO 6400.

I'm happy with it thus far, hope to take some real photos this evening when out with my wife.....must resist just taking my M10 and 35mm 1.4, !



Sep 08, 2017 at 11:02 PM
bclaff_too
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


zhangyue wrote:
I meant to resize D850's 46M to D810's 36M, D850 will have advantage if they are perform about the same at pixel level.

I am still reading your PDR definition. I didn't realize that is normalized results. I thought it is a pixel level measurement. (just use different thread hold for noise level to measure DR).

Yeah, at PhotonsToPhotos pixel level results are Read Noise in DNs and Input-referred Read Noise.
Photographic Dynamic Range (PDR) and Shadow Improvement are normalized.



Sep 09, 2017 at 02:20 AM
Dj R
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


the first four images are from the nifty fifty.
b/c why not use a lens I got for $100, with a $3296 camera?!
All JPG




  NIKON D850    50.0 mm f/1.8 lens    50mm    f/1.8    1/200s    110 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    50.0 mm f/1.8 lens    50mm    f/1.8    1/200s    125 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    50.0 mm f/1.8 lens    50mm    f/1.8    1/200s    160 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    50.0 mm f/1.8 lens    50mm    f/1.8    1/200s    110 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/1.4    1/250s    560 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/1.4    1/250s    450 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/1.4    1/250s    140 ISO    0.0 EV  






  NIKON D850    28.0 mm f/1.4 lens    28mm    f/1.4    1/250s    500 ISO    0.0 EV  



Edited on Sep 09, 2017 at 03:04 AM · View previous versions



Sep 09, 2017 at 02:50 AM
CritterRacing
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Official Nikon D850 image & resource hub thread ( images picture )


boy they sure look good.


Dj R wrote:
the first four images are from the nifty fifty.
b/c why not use a lens I got for $100, with a $3296 camera?!
All JPG





Sep 09, 2017 at 02:58 AM
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