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L-Bracket for D850
  
 
daggah
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · L-Bracket for D850


I didn't start a bargain basement gear thread, bud. But OK. I'm sure you'll come up with a different irrelevant analogy to justify nearly $200 on a metal bracket.


Sep 06, 2017 at 02:04 PM
Andre Labonte
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · L-Bracket for D850


daggah wrote:
And what I am challenging others to explain is why or how an expensive specialized l-bracket is an improvement over the universal setup I described. What does a RRS bracket that costs $150+ do better?


*********************

You actually ask a good question. Speaking for myself, there are two advantages I find with the specialized bracket:

1. The first has to do with maintaining as much ergonomic benefit as possible without having to take the bracket off. I'm constantly switching from tripod to hand-held use. Taking the bracket on and off would lead to missed shots. The universal brackets have more negative impact to ergonomics than the closer fitting, smaller and generally lighter specialized brackets.

2. The specialized brackets from RRS are designed such that they do not impede access to any of the ports or plugs on the camera. This is huge in ensuring I can always use all the features of the camera even when on a tripod. ... and again, I never take the bracket off for reason #1

Other people's mileage may vary, but for me, the specialized brackets are a real boon.



Sep 06, 2017 at 02:06 PM
sjms
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · L-Bracket for D850


daggah wrote:
The strap attachment point isn't that big. It does admittedly interfere with my 24 PC-E's controls in some orientations but I can work around the limitation without taking the plate off, and that's one issue in a very specific scenario (and one I'll resolve when I switch to the PD system)

I'm deployed to the Middle East at the moment and can't post pictures of how my setup works.


that's a pretty much standard Nikon 70-200/2.8 that will have an issue too.

I have no need to adjust anything I just put it on . I have admittedly no problems adapting anything to work with each other.



Sep 06, 2017 at 02:11 PM
daggah
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · L-Bracket for D850


Nah, I have a 70-200 VR II and the lens foot on that comes nowhere near the M-Plate Pro.


Sep 06, 2017 at 02:18 PM
Venky
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · L-Bracket for D850


How about this. I use this extensively and works very well.


https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/723386-REG/Arca_Swiss_802306_Universal_L_Bracket.html?sts=pi



Sep 06, 2017 at 02:20 PM
sjms
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · L-Bracket for D850


bulky as all can be but if you are using multiple rented bodies an option. kinda heavy. do you keep it on all the time and travel with it?


Sep 06, 2017 at 02:29 PM
sjms
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · L-Bracket for D850


daggah wrote:
Nah, I have a 70-200 VR II and the lens foot on that comes nowhere near the M-Plate Pro.


original foot, yes as it is smaller the the optional replacements that support AS.

are you using a AS lens plate or foot?

replacement feet are longer in the rear.

I have my daughters 70-200/2.8 VRII and yes it fits but fills in that gap

fairly awkward but them you might just remove the plate.






Edited on Sep 06, 2017 at 04:21 PM · View previous versions



Sep 06, 2017 at 02:40 PM
ckcarr
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · L-Bracket for D850


Actually, it's worth mentioning that just like camera bodies, when I buy a Really Right Stuff bracket for my camera there is an eventual active resale market for that bracket.

So, if I paid $148.65 for an L-bracket back on April 3, 2012 five years ago for my D800E and have used it all this time, I'll still be able to re-sell it for $70 - $100 to others who might like one for their D800/800E/810 cameras. In other words, it's not a total sunk cost.

I've bought lower end ballheads and camera plates before (like Slik) and no one seemed to want them when I tried to sell them.



Sep 06, 2017 at 03:28 PM
JBPhotog
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · L-Bracket for D850


ckcarr wrote:
Actually, it's worth mentioning that just like camera bodies, when I buy a Really Right Stuff bracket for my camera there is an eventual active resale market for that bracket.

So, if I paid $148.65 for an L-bracket back on April 3, 2012 five years ago for my D800E and have used it all this time, I'll still be able to re-sell it for $70 - $100 to others who might like one for their D800/800E/810 cameras. In other words, it's not a total sunk cost.

I've bought lower end ballheads and camera plates before (like Slik) and no one seemed to
...Show more

+1

My experience is similar for the most part so cost of ownership is $10-$20 a year. That is totally acceptable to have a custom fitted, better ergo plate that mates with my RRS lever clamp that I can trust.



Sep 06, 2017 at 03:52 PM
sjms
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · L-Bracket for D850


daggah wrote:
Build quality arguments make a lot more sense when talking about tools frequently subjected to significant torquing forces. It doesn't make nearly as much sense when talking about an L-shaped piece of metal tasked with handling a few pounds of camera gear. (After all, once you start talking about heavier telephotos, you're not using the L-plate any more...)

But hey, anything to justify paying the Really Right Stuff tax, I guess...


don't forget about Kirk. a few dollars less.




Sep 06, 2017 at 04:24 PM
 

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mbphoto_2.8
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · L-Bracket for D850


@sjms how much do they pay you?
Yourconstant, never-ending stream of praise and advertisement for RRS products should come with a dusclaimer

I have a sunwayfoto l-bracket on my D810 that does every single thing you love so much about the RRS bracket at 1/3 of the price and 10% less weight.

It also sits perfectly tight in my chinese arca clamp, the chinese macro slider and on my chinese ballhead (100 bucks, holds a 1Ds III with 400/2.8 at 90 degrees steady!) On the chinese carbon fiber tripod that I've used for 6 years now.

The entire setup costs 450 usd, which won't even get you a midrange ballhead with RRS ..



Sep 06, 2017 at 09:22 PM
Andre Labonte
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · L-Bracket for D850


mbphoto_2.8 wrote:
@sjms@ how much do they pay you?
Yourconstant, never-ending stream of praise and advertisement for RRS products should come with a dusclaimer

I have a sunwayfoto l-bracket on my D810 that does every single thing you love so much about the RRS bracket at 1/3 of the price and 10% less weight.

It also sits perfectly tight in my chinese arca clamp, the chinese macro slider and on my chinese ballhead (100 bucks, holds a 1Ds III with 400/2.8 at 90 degrees steady!) On the chinese carbon fiber tripod that I've used for 6 years now.

The entire setup costs 450 usd, which
...Show more

******************

Thanks for the tip on sunwayfoto. Never heard of them before but they seem to have nice stuff. I might have to try them next time I need some support gear.

One thing of note though is that they have a significantly more limited selection of specialized L-brackets than RRS, so great if they have your model of camera covered, but sucks otherwise.

Do you know anything about their ball heads?




Sep 06, 2017 at 10:42 PM
ckcarr
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · L-Bracket for D850


In 2016 the average annual Chinese manufacturing wage was 59,470 CNY or $9,114 per year.

In 2016 the average US manufacturing wage was $19.43 per hour, or $40,414 per year.

Based on average wages alone the cost of manufacturing in China is roughly 22.6 % of what it costs in the US.

American manufacturers who actually follow the law are also saddled with FICA @ 6.7%, Medicare @ 1.45%, Federal Unemployment, State Unemployment, Workers compensation, vacation time, sick time, holidays (all downtime because the employee isn't working), overtime rates when needed, and of course medical and dental insurance... not to mention group life, possibly short and long term disability insurance premiums... And, the highest federal and state tax rates in the world (especially in California). Total of just the employee burden is typically another 40% on top of the wage.

So to be fair, a Chinese competitors L-Bracket identical to an L-Bracket made by Really Right Stuff and being sold for $160 by RRS ought to be sold by the Chinese imitator for $36... or 22.6% of the RRS price - following the logic here

If you're paying 1/3 of the price, which would be $53 you're getting ripped off!



Sep 06, 2017 at 11:08 PM
sjms
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · L-Bracket for D850


mbphoto_2.8 wrote:
@sjms@ how much do they pay you?
Yourconstant, never-ending stream of praise and advertisement for RRS products should come with a dusclaimer

I have a sunwayfoto l-bracket on my D810 that does every single thing you love so much about the RRS bracket at 1/3 of the price and 10% less weight.

It also sits perfectly tight in my chinese arca clamp, the chinese macro slider and on my chinese ballhead (100 bucks, holds a 1Ds III with 400/2.8 at 90 degrees steady!) On the chinese carbon fiber tripod that I've used for 6 years now.

The entire setup costs 450 usd, which
...Show more

you mean how much do i pay them right? i take no money from any source other than what i earn using my tools and capability. that keeps my conscience clear. i shoot for part of my living which allows me to write some of my gear down. its called business. i know quite a bit of the people in the industry too. i have borrowed equipment from manufacturers. and if i choose to make part of my lot. it gets purchased from a dealer.

i probably have less RRS gear then the average gear head out here. but when you were real young i had my first RRS plate for my F4s when it was owned by Mr Geyer back in 1991. sometimes you just stay with what you believe works best and has ideas that you like. these are the people that came up with the concepts and designs. i have a great appreciation for those who invent and that's what i support.
and yes i have the RRS L for the D850 on order.

there's my disclaimer. have i satisfied you?



Edited on Sep 07, 2017 at 03:23 AM · View previous versions



Sep 06, 2017 at 11:28 PM
wswartzwel
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · L-Bracket for D850


ckcarr wrote:
In 2016 the average annual Chinese manufacturing wage was 59,470 CNY or $9,114 per year.

In 2016 the average US manufacturing wage was $19.43 per hour, or $40,414 per year.

Based on average wages alone the cost of manufacturing in China is roughly 22.6 % of what it costs in the US.

American manufacturers who actually follow the law are also saddled with FICA @ 6.7%, Medicare @ 1.45%, Federal Unemployment, State Unemployment, Workers compensation, vacation time, sick time, holidays (all downtime because the employee isn't working), overtime rates when needed, and of course medical and dental insurance... not to mention group
...Show more

Wow.. You really are a numbers kind of guy!




Sep 07, 2017 at 02:00 AM
Lee Saxon
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · L-Bracket for D850


daggah wrote:
Build quality arguments make a lot more sense when talking about tools frequently subjected to significant torquing forces. It doesn't make nearly as much sense when talking about an L-shaped piece of metal tasked with handling a few pounds of camera gear. (After all, once you start talking about heavier telephotos, you're not using the L-plate any more...)


I've literally broken a cast aluminum leg joint off of a Gitzo Systematic tripod. Yes I'll pay more for machined parts. YMMV.




Sep 07, 2017 at 07:18 AM
reggieb
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · L-Bracket for D850


ckcarr wrote:
In 2016 the average annual Chinese manufacturing wage was 59,470 CNY or $9,114 per year.

In 2016 the average US manufacturing wage was $19.43 per hour, or $40,414 per year.

Based on average wages alone the cost of manufacturing in China is roughly 22.6 % of what it costs in the US.

American manufacturers who actually follow the law are also saddled with FICA @ 6.7%, Medicare @ 1.45%, Federal Unemployment, State Unemployment, Workers compensation, vacation time, sick time, holidays (all downtime because the employee isn't working), overtime rates when needed, and of course medical and dental insurance... not to mention group
...Show more

Of course, while the average American manufacturing working makes more than the average Chinese, they're more productive in terms of units, due to a higher level of automation in the US. China is now shifting that way, too. But we're further ahead. So, of course, your numbers aren't accurate for final cost of production. Which doesn't determine price anyway, by the way - at least not directly. In reality, shipped cost of the RRS gear is probably not much more than the chinese stuff, certainly not to the level that you're describing.

And by the way, why shouldn't you buy based on comparative advantage? If they make that widget for less in China, buy it from China. There are larger durable goods that should be produced in the USA, because their shipped cost will be lower than the same product produced anywhere overseas. Why not shift manufacturing to those areas where WE have a comparative advantage? Certainly our manufacturing sector today is not suffering. It's what, the second largest employer and producing more than we ever have?



Sep 07, 2017 at 01:32 PM
sjms
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · L-Bracket for D850


that "comparative advantage" is pretty highly selective. the "comparative" portion has a highly personal variable attached to it.


Sep 07, 2017 at 01:42 PM
ckcarr
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · L-Bracket for D850


No substance to back up these claims?
To refute what I stated - I suggest... Dig deep, find numbers to substantiate all you said. If you do, then I'll take a look. But right now what you've said is all bar talk.

reggieb wrote:
Of course, while the average American manufacturing working makes more than the average Chinese, they're more productive in terms of units, due to a higher level of automation in the US. China is now shifting that way, too. But we're further ahead. So, of course, your numbers aren't accurate for final cost of production. Which doesn't determine price anyway, by the way - at least not directly. In reality, shipped cost of the RRS gear is probably not much more than the chinese stuff, certainly not to the level that you're describing.

And by the way, why shouldn't you buy
...Show more




Sep 07, 2017 at 02:42 PM
Elijah
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · L-Bracket for D850


I'm a CNC machinist and knowing my RRS stuff is machined on a CNC, made in USA makes me happy; RRS FTW.

I was never a fan of cast/forged items from some third world country like China... there's nothing better than a product that's machined, anodized and made in the US of A.

Makes me feel like a million dollar photographer.



Sep 08, 2017 at 04:12 AM
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