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Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?
  
 
lightskyland
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Anyone using the Milvus 35mm on Sony?

Long-term, I want a small Sony native lens, but it looks like the new Milvus 35/1.4 might be the best 35mm for landscape use right now? I have a pretty big gap between my Loxia 21 and (soon-to-arrive) CV65/2 that's only covered by a zoom lens right now and a 50 and 55 that aren't perfect landscape lenses in my book.

Been looking at 35s for a while, contemplated the R1R / R1R2 but haven't pulled the trigger on that idea. Reading about the Milvus today and the lack of CA has intrigued me...

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Sep 05, 2017 at 04:39 PM
philber
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


I am exactly there as well, with a gap between, Otus 28 and Otus 55. I dislike the lens from the RX1R [I know this means that I am certifiable]. So I am hesitating between the ZM 35 f:1.4 and Milvus 35. The ZM is smaller and exceptional, though not flawless. The Milvus may not be quite as stratospheric,b ut probably remarkably free from faults. If it is better than ZE/ZF 25 f:2.0, it should be very, very good indeed.


Sep 05, 2017 at 05:08 PM
digital_AM
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


I'm getting the Loxia 35 as my landscape and architecture lens. I considered the Milvus 35mm but it looks too big.


Sep 05, 2017 at 05:21 PM
lightskyland
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


I'm getting the Loxia 35 as my landscape and architecture lens. I considered the Milvus 35mm but it looks too big.

I agree - it's too big. But I wouldn't mind using it for a while until a world-class Sony 35mm landscape lens comes around.

From what I have read the Loxia just doesn't seem really good until f/5.6 or narrower.



Sep 05, 2017 at 05:25 PM
DannyBurkPhoto
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


I'm intrigued, but I haven't seen much comparison between the new 35 and the older "classic" 35/1.4 ZE (or ZF). I have and love the ZE version; I'm assuming that the Milvus is sharper wide open, but more importantly, how does the rendering compare? I wouldn't be willing to part with my ZE if the Milvus' rendering were inferior.


Sep 05, 2017 at 06:03 PM
darbo
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


lightskyland wrote:
I agree - it's too big. But I wouldn't mind using it for a while until a world-class Sony 35mm landscape lens comes around.


Enjoy your new lens, it will no doubt be excellent for you.

As a former Otus 55mm owner, I fully appreciate the superb optics of the Milvus 35 with it's stunning sharpness and beautiful bokeh, but am forever done with heavy/bulky DSLR lenses. Loxia 35 making me plenty happy as a landscape lens and the form factor means I can easily carry three or four lenses around in my little Urban Approach 5 bag. If I need good performance wide open, I'll add the Sony Zeiss Distagon 35mm 1.4 ZA.



Sep 05, 2017 at 06:04 PM
thrice
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Seems mad to me to consider the milvus on Sony when the ZM exists.



Sep 05, 2017 at 09:01 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


thrice wrote:
Seems mad to me to consider the milvus on Sony when the ZM exists.


The Milvus has much lower field curvature (On the Sony body), smoother OOF rendering and is much better corrected for spherochromatism. The ZM wins on size, weight and perhaps micro-contrast, but I do get your point.



Sep 05, 2017 at 09:18 PM
Chris_88
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


As always, take the compromise you're most comfortable with. If you don't mind the Otus-like weight and size of the Milvus, then that's probably the way to go. If you can live with slightly less correction, the Canon 35 1.4 ii is apparently pretty well corrected too, and slightly smaller. AF seems to work well on the a7rii too.

Don't get me wrong, I see the benefit of the ZM 35 1.4. Zeiss probably created the best performing compact 35 1.4 with that lens, but on the a7rii the field curvature gets in the way (unless you opt for a front filter) and using that lens and the TAP, while nice and all (who would have guessed that we would be able to AF m-mount lenses on an a7 series cam a few years back), I decided to go with the Loxia for my landscaping needs. That lens is far from perfect, but having a native mount solution is just hassle free and stopped down the Loxia is a great (albeit overpriced) lens.



Sep 05, 2017 at 10:16 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Chris_88 wrote:
As always, take the compromise you're most comfortable with. If you don't mind the Otus-like weight and size of the Milvus, then that's probably the way to go. If you can live with slightly less correction, the Canon 35 1.4 ii is apparently pretty well corrected too, and slightly smaller. AF seems to work well on the a7rii too.

Don't get me wrong, I see the benefit of the ZM 35 1.4. Zeiss probably created the best performing compact 35 1.4 with that lens, but on the a7rii the field curvature gets in the way (unless you opt for a front
...Show more

I went full circle...for landscapes, I started with Loxia 35, then ZM 35/1.4 (with front lens and all), than ZA 35/2.8 and now back to Loxia.
For people/travel/general, I really like the 35/1.4 ZA...LoCA goes rampage but it's not hard to correct in post. (with this lens)



Sep 05, 2017 at 10:25 PM
 

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DavidBM
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Fred Miranda wrote:
I went full circle...for landscapes, I started with Loxia 35, then ZM 35/1.4 (with front lens and all), than ZA 35/2.8 and now back to Loxia.
For people/travel/general, I really like the 35/1.4 ZA...LoCA goes rampage but it's not hard to correct in post. (with this lens)


I'm glad you have given up on ZA 2.8/35 for landscape. I had one for a long time until it went out of kilter, and I liked it in many ways: amazingly good wide open, very sharp across the field stopped down. Perfect hiking lens coz so small. But it just doesn't have the brilliance and contrast of the Loxia for stopped down landscape use (though it's just as sharp) and against the light, while there are few flare artifacts, it gets muddy and the sunstar is terrible...

Still when if an inexpensive good copy ever comes my way I'll likely get another for hiking. (I did evaluate a few some months back, but all were annoyingly off)



Sep 05, 2017 at 10:49 PM
Jochenb
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Nice to see this thread, because I was also wondering if there were already people that bought it to use on a Sony body.
It seems to be fantastic, I've really been thinking about trying one. The color correction and very low field curvature seem to be superb. All while maintaining smoothness in the bokeh.
However, how good it may be... I don't think I could live with that kind of bulk.

I still wish that one day Zeiss will make a Loxia version of their 35/1.4 ZM.
Who knows, my previous wish was that they'd make a 21/2.8 Distagon Loxia... and they did

BTW: Interesting Fred. I also bought a 35 Loxia recently, just to give it a chance. Sometimes we can get a bit blinded by pure technical performance and neglect the global rendering qualities a lens can have. My very early thoughts are that the 35 Loxia might be one of those lenses. Very nice color and micro-contrast. On Sony I'm used to 35's like the FE 35/1.4 + F2.8 and 35/2 Sonnar (RX1RII), but for stopped down shooting this Loxia seems to have more clarity than those.





Sep 05, 2017 at 11:33 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


DavidBM wrote:
I'm glad you have given up on ZA 2.8/35 for landscape. I had one for a long time until it went out of kilter, and I liked it in many ways: amazingly good wide open, very sharp across the field stopped down. Perfect hiking lens coz so small. But it just doesn't have the brilliance and contrast of the Loxia for stopped down landscape use (though it's just as sharp) and against the light, while there are few flare artifacts, it gets muddy and the sunstar is terrible...

Still when if an inexpensive good copy ever comes my way I'll likely
...Show more

I don't know about that David. The 35/2.8 ZA is an amazing lens but there is copy variation. I just got my 'used' but mint Loxia 35/2 from a great seller at the buy and sell board and as he told me, it's perfectly centered. The best copy I've seen and I've tried many...I much prefer the build, aperture ring and mechanical MF from the Loxia. Love its sunstars as well.

Here are some crops for you at f/7.1 where I think the Loxia performs best (center, mid and corners). At f/8 and smaller I already see diffraction in the center where there is high frequency detail. So, to me the magic aperture for the Loxia is f/7.1. I tried many focusing areas and the best results was focusing at center. (which is great!)
Field curvature is pretty accentuated just like the Loxia 21/2.8 but by f/5.6 and even better f/7.1 it's completely masked.

Well here are the crops. FE 35/2.8 ZA vs Loxia 35/2 at f/7.1. It's neck to neck.






Center: They are similar at center







Mid-field: Also similar







Extreme edge: Similar but the 35/2.8 ZA still has moderate vignetting.




Sep 05, 2017 at 11:49 PM
DavidBM
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Fred Miranda wrote:
I don't know about that David. The 35/2.8 ZA is an amazing lens but there is copy variation. I just got my 'used' but mint Loxia 35/2 from a great seller at the buy and sell board and as he told me, it's perfectly centered. The best copy I've seen and I've tried many...I much prefer the build, aperture ring and mechanical MF from the Loxia. Love its sunstars as well.

Here are some crops for you at f/7.1 where I think the Loxia performs best (center, mid and corners). At f/8 and smaller I already see diffraction in the
...Show more

What don't you know about, Fred? I think we agree about this, as far as I can tell. Oh I see: you think that they are closer stopped down. Yes those crops maybe make the contrast closer than it ever was with my ZA. Perhaps it was always a touch out even before the tilt happened? But the contrast difference is greatest against the light. Agree the resolution is super close stopped down.


Edited on Sep 05, 2017 at 11:58 PM · View previous versions



Sep 05, 2017 at 11:54 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


BTW: I also tested the 35/1.4 ZA with them today and it just can't compete at Mid-field. There is also noticeable CA towards the corners even at smaller apertures. I don't think it's a good choice for landscapes as it was designed for different applications.


Sep 05, 2017 at 11:54 PM
DavidBM
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Fred Miranda wrote:
BTW: I also tested the 35/1.4 ZA with them today and it just can't compete at Mid-field. There is also noticeable CA towards the corners even at smaller apertures. I don't think it's a good choice for landscapes as it was designed for different applications.


Interesting. I've only sometimes used the ZA 1.4 for landscape ( basically when I've had it with me for other reasons) and it's been fine, but have had the vague impression that it's not it's strongest suit. Good to have that confirmed. I haven't noticed the CA (I take it that this is lateral CA). I have the lateral CA correction (on top of the compulsory lateral CA correction) on by import default - it's more or less lossless.



Sep 06, 2017 at 12:04 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


DavidBM wrote:
What don't you know about, Fred? I think we agree about this, as far as I can tell. Oh I see: you think that they are closer stopped down. Yes those crops maybe make the contrast closer than it ever was with my ZA. Perhaps it was always a touch out even before the tilt happened? But the contrast difference is greatest against the light. Agree the resolution is super close stopped down.


Sorry, I didn't finish my thought! I'm still checking my samples.
I don't know about the Loxia having much more contrast, at least in good light. I'd say they are very comparable and that's a great compliment for the Sonnar 35/2.8 ZA.
The ZA is much better at f/2.8 and f/4 especially towards the corners though. At f/5.6 they start to equalize but only at f/7.1 corners get closer.
The thing about the 35/2.8 ZA is that it's flat field. You can focus anywhere and resolution does not change in any area. That's a big plus for landscapes..

For my needs, I will go with Loxia 21 + Loxia 35 because I usually include the sun at these focal lengths and much prefer the 10-point sunstar. Like you wrote, the 35/2.8 ZA's sunstar is a let down.



Sep 06, 2017 at 12:05 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


DavidBM wrote:
Interesting. I've only sometimes used the ZA 1.4 for landscape ( basically when I've had it with me for other reasons) and it's been fine, but have had the vague impression that it's not it's strongest suit. Good to have that confirmed. I haven't noticed the CA (I take it that this is lateral CA). I have the lateral CA correction (on top of the compulsory lateral CA correction) on by import default - it's more or less lossless.


The CA I see is actually the "corrected CA".
When there are high contrast subjects towards the corners, you will see the ugly grayish lines around them.

Here is a sample at f/5.6: (I see it even at smaller apertures)

Do you see it? Look at the beige chimney and the edge of the white house... The Loxia and 35/2.8 ZA are pretty clean in comparison.





Extreme corners area showing CA (35/1.4 ZA)




Sep 06, 2017 at 12:10 AM
DavidBM
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Fred Miranda wrote:
Sorry, I didn't finish my thought! I'm still checking my samples.
I don't know about the Loxia having much more contrast, at least in good light. I'd say they are very comparable and that's a great compliment for the Sonnar 35/2.8 ZA.
The ZA is much better at f/2.8 and f/4 especially towards the corners though. At f/5.6 they start to equalize but only at f/7.1 corners get closer.
The thing about the 35/2.8 ZA is that it's flat field. You can focus anywhere and resolution does not change in any area. That's a big plus for landscapes..

To me, I will
...Show more

Ah yes, thought you might mean that! Certainly your crops support them being close in contrast than I recall with the light behind (I wonder about the corner crop though - the ZA is darker due to vignetting, but just possibly is less contrasty to)

But it's against the light contrast that is the biggie...

As for the rest, agree completely. The 2.8 ZA is AMAZING wide open. I took some great hand held night cityscapes in Hong Kong once which were possible because this lens was great across the (flat) field wide open, and at infinity there was no need for DOF...



Sep 06, 2017 at 12:12 AM
DavidBM
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Zeiss Milvus 35mm on Sony?


Fred Miranda wrote:
The CA I see is actually the "corrected CA".
When there are high contrast subjects towards the corners, you will see the ugly grayish lines around them.

Here is a sample at f/5.6: (I see it even at smaller apertures)

Do you see it? Look at the beige chimney and the edge of the white house... The Loxia and 35/2.8 ZA are pretty clean in comparison.


Oh yeah; and a red-magenta smear in top left shadows of every contrasty line...Is this with just the compulsory auto profile, or it as well as the tick box?

Interesting...



Sep 06, 2017 at 12:17 AM
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