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FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!
  
 
JohnDizzo15
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


As did I. I got a little bit hasty earlier and just pulled the trigger on the Pronto without much thought initially. But then I decided to read and quickly cancelled. lol.

For me, there would have to be some significant performance improvements or cost savings in order for me to go with the Pronto. I've been adapting lenses for a good while now and know far too well the value in firmware updates to sacrifice them based on a $15 savings.

I am curious though. What is the new product that Techart is about to release? Hoping it isn't an LM-EA7 III.



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:00 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


JohnDizzo15 wrote:
I am curious though. What is the new product that Techart is about to release? Hoping it isn't an LM-EA7 III.


It was this:
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1509483?b=2



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:03 PM
LBJ2
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Fred Miranda wrote:
I actually canceled my order. I wanted to test them side-by-side but cannot support Fotodiox on this one. There is too much evidence/suspicion this is indeed a TAP clone.


What happened to your current TAP, still have the wobble problem ?



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:08 PM
JohnDizzo15
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Ah. Thanks for the info.

As a side note, that other adapter will be more intriguing to me when the GFX II comes out with PDAF. . It was the main reason I couldn't enjoy shooting with it for my uses.



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:09 PM
GMPhotography
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Have to say it's just to close for comfort. Being artists we have to protect our copyrights and I think a duty to protect others. That's me though

Fred Miranda wrote:
I actually canceled my order. I wanted to test them side-by-side but cannot support Fotodiox on this one. There is too much evidence/suspicion this is indeed a TAP clone.




Sep 21, 2017 at 09:09 PM
chez
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Let's not forget many lens manufactures reverse engineer a lens mount and create lenses for that mount. I believe Sigma does this with Canon and Nikon.


Sep 21, 2017 at 09:21 PM
GMPhotography
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Yea that's a little different though and it's well accepted by Nikon, Canon and such otherwise they would shut them down through the courts. Plus that's only the mount not the lens itself. Here it's looking like the whole kettle of fish.
Chez you sell prints you should be very sensitive to copyright infringements. Now I'm very sensitive to this but again that's me but I will never buy stuff that's almost a exact duplicate. Someone steals my Art they better hide because I'm coming after them with my lawyers.

Now I say this to teach the new young guns too as protecting themselves.

chez wrote:
Let's not forget many lens manufactures reverse engineer a lens mount and create lenses for that mount. I believe Sigma does this with Canon and Nikon.




Sep 21, 2017 at 09:28 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


chez wrote:
Let's not forget many lens manufactures reverse engineer a lens mount and create lenses for that mount. I believe Sigma does this with Canon and Nikon.


We are talking suspicion of 100% cloning another AF adapter and all its intellectual property, research and ingenuity. It think it's different than reverse engineering AF when designing third party lenses.

TechArt Pro is based on Sony's reverse engineering as well and to me, that's a different story.

It would be fine is Fotodiox borrowed TAP's concept and created their OWN adapter.



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:31 PM
GMPhotography
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


I'm with Fred . Hell it even sounds like the same firmware.

If it was different in many ways I would be okay with that but it looks like a 100 percent copy

Fred Miranda wrote:
We are talking suspicion of 100% cloning another AF adapter and all its intellectual property, research and ingenuity. It think it's different than reverse engineering AF when designing third party lenses.

TechArt Pro is based on Sony's reverse engineering as well and to me, that's a different story.

It would be fine is Fotodiox borrowed TAP's concept and created their OWN adapter.




Sep 21, 2017 at 09:42 PM
k-h.a.w
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Fred Miranda wrote:
I actually canceled my order. I wanted to test them side-by-side but cannot support Fotodiox on this one. There is too much evidence/suspicion this is indeed a TAP clone.


Good decision Fred. The no FW updatable characteristic seems to point out the clone nature.

K-H.



Sep 21, 2017 at 09:53 PM
 

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genji
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Jack Thompson wrote:
If I was jumping in for the first time, it would mean something to me that I might be able to pick up the phone and reliably speak with someone in the US.


Definitely a huge advantage to have someone in the US confirm that the Pronto's firmware cannot be updated.



Sep 22, 2017 at 12:00 AM
Charlie N
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


chez wrote:
Let's not forget many lens manufactures reverse engineer a lens mount and create lenses for that mount. I believe Sigma does this with Canon and Nikon.


it's not about reverse engineering, it's so similar to the techart, that it shares the same FLAW, power drain issue



Sep 22, 2017 at 12:16 AM
JohnDizzo15
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!




Charlie N wrote:
it's not about reverse engineering, it's so similar to the techart, that it shares the same FLAW, power drain issue


Techart has actually updated their product description to reflect that their most recent firmware has rectified the battery drain issue.

Just another reason to not go with Fotodiox.



Sep 22, 2017 at 12:29 AM
chez
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Fred Miranda wrote:
We are talking suspicion of 100% cloning another AF adapter and all its intellectual property, research and ingenuity. It think it's different than reverse engineering AF when designing third party lenses.

TechArt Pro is based on Sony's reverse engineering as well and to me, that's a different story.

It would be fine is Fotodiox borrowed TAP's concept and created their OWN adapter.


I think we are splitting hairs here. We cannot see the details of the camera to lens protocol so it seems like not a big deal to reverse engineer this protocol and sell lenses that meet the protocol. With the adapter, it visible to us so there is something we can hold in our hands and see the copy...but none the less there has been many man years of developement for both the protocol and adapter and both are being ripped off. Just because you cannot see the protocol does not make it less of a ripoff.





Sep 22, 2017 at 12:49 AM
chez
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


GMPhotography wrote:
I'm with Fred . Hell it even sounds like the same firmware.

If it was different in many ways I would be okay with that but it looks like a 100 percent copy



But is not the lens to camera protocol that is reveresed engineered by Sigma the same as the original by Canon or Nikon? Is it different because you cannot see the protocol that was copied?



Sep 22, 2017 at 12:51 AM
chez
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


GMPhotography wrote:
Yea that's a little different though and it's well accepted by Nikon, Canon and such otherwise they would shut them down through the courts. Plus that's only the mount not the lens itself. Here it's looking like the whole kettle of fish.
Chez you sell prints you should be very sensitive to copyright infringements. Now I'm very sensitive to this but again that's me but I will never buy stuff that's almost a exact duplicate. Someone steals my Art they better hide because I'm coming after them with my lawyers.

Now I say this to teach the new young guns
...Show more

I've been involved with patents for many years and a patent on a protocol is just as valid as a patent on an adapter. I think Canon's approach is to constantly change the protocol ever so slightly making Sigma lens either functional not too optimally or require a new firmware update which totally pisses off their customers.

Going the legal approach many times is just too expensive in court costs.



Sep 22, 2017 at 12:56 AM
GMPhotography
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


Chez it just smells bad don't you agree.


Sep 22, 2017 at 01:15 AM
Steve Spencer
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


chez wrote:
But is not the lens to camera protocol that is reveresed engineered by Sigma the same as the original by Canon or Nikon? Is it different because you cannot see the protocol that was copied?


I don't think we really know whether the protocol that Sigma and others use is the same as the Canon original or not. I suspect it is different in a number of ways and that is why Canon can tweak it slightly and leave their old lens functioning and Sigma's lenses not functioning. In the world of software, stealing exact code is definitely a no-no, but developing new code that does the same thing in a different way is certainly ok. It isn't clear what Sigma is doing. Are they copying the protocol somehow or are they developing their own protocol that works. In that way it feels different from this Pronto adapter which was clearly copied whole cloth. It appears to be an exact copy and yes the fact we can physically see it makes that obvious.



Sep 22, 2017 at 01:20 AM
k-h.a.w
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


GMPhotography wrote:
Chez it just smells bad don't you agree.



The term "ripoff" comes to my mind.



Sep 22, 2017 at 01:28 AM
rscheffler
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · FotodioX PRONTO: Leica M-Mount to Sony E-Mount with AF!


I thought Sony opened their E/FE lens protocol to third parties? But that wouldn't excuse a direct cloning of Techart's hardware and software by FotodioX, if that's indeed the case.


Sep 22, 2017 at 01:54 AM
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