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Archive 2017 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions

  
 
saraestill
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


I shot this photo from a wedding while we were waiting for the ceremony to start. Lighting not ideal at all and luckily I got more later in the day when the sun was lower but I am looking for some suggestions for PS or LR tips on this one to play around with. May just throw it out though, lol.
35 mm 1/500 f5.6 ISO640

https://flic.kr/p/WuqECz



Jul 13, 2017 at 07:03 AM
beavens
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Hi Sara!

Welcome to the forums! You'll get more responses if you embed your images so people don't have to click through to see the pic. You're going to just want to paste a direct link in the body of your post similar to the following:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4291/35764940001_61a7af7d87_h.jpg


You're definitely right about the tough lighting and if you weren't shooting the actual wedding then no worries if you didn't have any kind of fill light on hand to assist then you managed fairly well all things considered.

Off the bat I'd say that you'll want to tighten the crop - the extra real estate doesn't add anything to the shot and the bright area in the upper-left is pretty distracting. I noticed a blue cast (look at groom's white shirt), so a shift in the warmer direction should help things out. You can salt & pepper in some brightness/contrast/saturation as you see fit.

I put up a quick rework below. If you would prefer me to remove it just let me know with a reply or PM!

One thing that I often struggle with for these shots are the little details. Something like the dude on the right with his lower socks and exposed legs. Does it kill the shot? Nah, but it sure doesn't help. After you make sure your technicals are squared away don't forget to look for the extraneous.

Cheers and welcome - this place is *awesome*.

Jeff







Jul 13, 2017 at 08:09 AM
dmacmillan
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


saraestill wrote:
May just throw it out though, lol.

Welcome to the forum!

I vote to cull it. This strikes me as a grab shot that doesn't work. The socks, the low angle (crotches), the busy background and the harsh light are not balanced by any factor that would make it worth keeping.

Instead of trying to salvage it in post processing, concentrate on studying why the image doesn't work and how to control the situation at capture. I also think good photography is defined as much by knowing when not to shoot as it is by knowing when to shoot.

Sorry to be so blunt, but from they way you presented it, I'm assuming you were the appointed wedding photographer and holding the image up to a higher standard than what I would if this was a snapshot from a guest. Correct me if I'm wrong.



Jul 13, 2017 at 08:54 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Welcome to FM !!!

FM ROCKS !!!

As a grab shot ... I can dig on the Tres Amigos, but there are some things that do detract a bit. Kinda depends on the level of expectation regarding the detractors ... but the message of Tres Amigos still comes through.




Jul 13, 2017 at 12:54 PM
Kevin T
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


That's a handsome group of dudes. I would hate to let a shot like this go into the trash, especially if it was my picture or I knew the guys. I did a quick hack attack of the posted image that Jeff made (I don't click through to other websites) and applied some gaussian blur to the background and added some skin warmth and played with contrast in the background. S&P to my taste but maybe it gives you some ideas.







Jul 13, 2017 at 01:36 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Went a little different route.

Skin tones could use a bit more work maybe, etc. but hopefully, you get the gist.

Doug's points are indeed valid (i.e. detractors, etc.) ... but the emotive from those boys is engaging and kinda tough to toss away without at least giving it a crack to turn some slightly sour lemons into a bit sweeter lemonade.

Sometimes you just don't get a second shot at a mulligan / do over or things just kinda "happen" that you weren't planning for ... so ya just gotta go with it the best you can. Sometimes, you still wind up in cull territory, other times you might make a nice save.

But, to not lose sight of Doug's point, it is also an opportunity to learn from it ... so you aren't dealing with trying to make as many "saves" down the road.



P.S. The guy on the right is gettin' close to doppleganger territory for Rutledge Wood.




Tres Amigos



Edited on Jul 13, 2017 at 10:18 PM · View previous versions



Jul 13, 2017 at 09:05 PM
eeneryma
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


RustyBug wrote:
Went a little different route.


You nailed it Kent!! Nice work.
Steve



Jul 13, 2017 at 09:08 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Thanks Steve,

Here's the counterpart. Probably needs some tweak / diff ... but, you get the gist.







Jul 13, 2017 at 09:20 PM
beavens
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Mono plus new crop improves!

.edit viewing on my computer it seems a bit more "rough around the edges". I think some smoothing out could improve it

Edited on Jul 14, 2017 at 10:58 AM · View previous versions



Jul 13, 2017 at 09:45 PM
AuntiPode
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


You can approximate proper depth of field aperture effect in post processing, but it;s almost always better to get it right in the camera at the time the image is made.







Jul 14, 2017 at 02:04 AM
Kevin T
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


You guys are tripping me out by cropping out the feet. The exposed legs make the shot IMO. This is a bunch of guys who have probably known each other forever or are very close and comfortable with each other. This is how a marriage ceremony becomes a success, the closest people are gathered to witness the thing. By my observation this is a casual group of close friends who are cast into the pageant for a day, maybe a few hours if they are lucky. They are young, they aren't hired actors!

White plastic watches are not usually worn by folks who are uptight about appearances, IMHO. How can you cut out the sock-less guys feet? For all we know he has taken the vow of never to wear dress socks for his entire life as written in the bylaws of the strict surfers' code! If the pic makes the album, every person who gazes upon this image will say, "Oh Gawd, look at Joey's socks! He never liked to wear shoes."

I may be wrong about the purpose of the collection of photo memories. Is it solely to honor only the couple and any personality reveals of other characters traits are not to be tolerated but that depends on the couple and their group of close friends, yes? If I was the photographer I would want some pieces that stand out like this in the set. If I was paying for it I would demand it!




Jul 14, 2017 at 01:54 PM
AuntiPode
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


Ignoring the issue of socks, one significant problem with photographing such a pose is the need to avoid perspective distortion. When captured as it was, it makes the sitters legs and feet dominate the image and seem disproportionately large. You can correct for this distortion by shooting from farther away with a longer lens from a higher point of view when capturing the image. After the fact, it's only correctable by cropping the worst of the distortion. If the subjects want a version with the legs and feet despite the serious distortion, that's of course their choice. However, when asking for a critique without qualifying the request with special pleading, obvious distortions need to go. Similarly, a cluttered background detracts from the subjects. One typical professional way to reduce background clutter is to put it out of focus. That's best done when taking the original image with a wider aperture. Clutter needs to go. Work with distortion and clutter is traditionally seen as not made to a professional standard. You can make special content statements in pro work, but you ought to still make them to a high standard.


Jul 14, 2017 at 04:02 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


So, the issue of knowing your message remains key to directing your processing (and shooting) decisions.

The decision to crop was largely rooted in the perspective that the boys engaging faces were the predominant message to be conveyed (tighter color diff @ flower, also). Had it been "known" that the "sockless Joe" was desired as an integral component to the message, then that changes decisions, and I would likely have explored the realm of correcting the distortion ... i.e. +1 @ Karen with regard to the foreshortening effect.

As to the DOF ... just depends on whether you find the environment part of the message you want to convey, or you find it more of a detractor. Here again, desired message to be conveyed dictates decisions.



Jul 14, 2017 at 06:11 PM
Kevin T
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


I see the collective's slant addressing a similar approach to the OP but I was just surprised that you were all in concert and went in a direction that hadn't occurred to me. No more input from the thread creator?



Jul 14, 2017 at 06:52 PM
AuntiPode
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


I suspect the slant is just common experience with images we've been asked to critique in the past. If someone has the mastery necessary to make such unconventional choices as artistic choices, why would they post here asking for critique? Folks who intend something unconventional usually have more confidence in their own judgement and are less likely to ask for critiques and PS and post processing tips. That's why I assume it's likely images posted here that have distortions and processing that seem off are more likely to have capture or processing errors than intentional artistic license. Of course there's always the chance that what looks like a rookie mistake is intentional and the original poster didn't mention it, but odds are against it. We could rubber stamp a sentence or two with each reply thread reply clarifying that we assume it wasn't an intentional artistic choice, but that would become very tedious very quickly.


Jul 15, 2017 at 02:42 AM
dmacmillan
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


The OP, who seems to be MIA, stated this was a random pull. I think seeing a couple of more images from the shoot would clarify if this was an artistic decision or a rookie mistake. I know where my money lies.


Jul 15, 2017 at 06:55 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


AuntiPode wrote:
That's why I assume it's likely images posted here that have distortions and processing that seem off are more likely to have capture or processing errors than intentional artistic license.

Of course there's always the chance that what looks like a rookie mistake is intentional and the original poster didn't mention it, but odds are against it.



Playing the other end of the artistic intent ... if the artistic intent conveys error moreover than obvious intent, then it has come up short on its ability to convey its desired message.

Not a major issue (small amout) here, but one of my "pet peeves" (if you will) is images that have a color cast to them, and people say "Oh, I wanted it that way.", yet they have no understanding of how to correct it. The fact that they want it that way is fine ... up to the point that they have not yet developed the ability to contend with it other than to clarify it with "That 's the way it came out of the camera" (so it must be how I wanted it, since I don't know how to control it or correct it). Note: I didn't understand color worth a darn either in years past, till others helped me learn.

This can apply to anything from WB to posing to DOF to Our command & control over the many attributes of an image varies as we grow and learn. Imo, those who truly desire to grow and learn are willing to acknowledge the difference between where we have command & control vs. where we don't. Personally, I don't have command & control over posing / evoking people's emotives, so if I were to endeavor to shoot people again ... well, I'd need plenty of help from folks showing me the error of my ways (for the goal of improvement) vs. saying "that's what I meant to do" and dismissing the opportunity to learn.


Back on the matter of artistic rendering intent. It's been my observation that the general population politely goes along with the "that's what I meant to do" "that's what the camera did" game very well ... when lack of command & control gets portrayed as artistic rendering. We have a long history of bringing images from one rendering to another. Sometimes that is mere "tweaks", others it is a "technical correction", other times it is an "artistic rendering", and yet other times it is lemon to lemonade territory.

The reality is that any of the four are viable and S&P to taste always applies ... but, at the end of the day, what the image conveys is the what the image conveys. And if an "artistic rendering" conveys a lacking in execution / technical issues moreover than conveys "I can see the intentional rendering" ... well, that 's what it conveys.

Doug's favorite "selective color" is probably one of the most obvious "artistic renderings" where the intent is very clear (debatable to its aesthetic) and is difficult to misinterpret as anything other than artistic intent.

Many of Steve's images ... they include elements that are "cut off" (thinking about the man walking to the corner, etc.). To the casual observer, it might seem to be a "rookie error" ... BUT, when you study the image you can see the INTENT behind it and realize it was not happenstance.

Lacking the ability to clearly discern the INTENT for the artistic rendering, the audience is left with the premise that NO INTENT was afforded to such artistic rendering (i.e. the foreshortening effect). As such, it then falls into the category of a technical issue (by default) ... particularly for critical review.

To the degree that such issue matters in the image, that's highly variable. Sometimes it is a small issue that is merely a nit that doesn't significantly detract from the what the image conveys. However, when such detractors DO interfere (or alter) what the image conveys, then it is a different matter of concern.

In the case of this image ... "sockless Joe", the foreshortening effect and the leading lines to crotchville combine as synergistic detractors from the "Tres Amigo" and the emotive they are conveying in their faces that are appropriate to the celebratory occasion. The amount of combined detraction items affords competition with the weighting of the emotive message.

As noted before, if "sockless Joe" is part of the desired message to be conveyed ... well, then that tips the scales in shifting an item from what is a detractor vs. what is desired to be conveyed. For those who "know Joe", it might be part of the message. For those who don't "know Joe" ... it might not seem to be.

Generally speaking ... the wedding party is "well dressed", and while the personality of Joe might be in play, it might be an unexpected oversight that doesn't show when standing, but in this particular seated position, it is revealing itself as a "not so well dressed" (i.e. potentially embarrassing).

Gone long ... but, the point is that when we are imparting artistic rendering ... it should be done with a clarity, such that it isn't misinterpreted as error. To the degree that our artistic rending is misinterpreted as error ... well, then that's the degree that we've missed the mark, and it is still on us.

As to this image ... I'm with Doug & Karen that I do not believe it was artistic intent, but rather a contemporaneous capture of the moment. That's not meant to be critical of the issues for a quick snap / grab ... because the look on the boys faces are very emotive and kudo's for capturing that. It just means that if we did pick up some detractors along the way ... let's see if we can reduce the amount of detractors competing for the viewers attention, and let the good stuff shine through with a shift in weighting.

The bottom line is that the degree to which we have command & control over our pre-production, capture and post-production endeavors work together to become our final image, which leads us again to:

As always, your message, your pic, your call.




Jul 15, 2017 at 08:38 AM
Kevin T
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


^^^ Good Stuff ^^^

Paging Ms. Sara to the white courtesy phone!

- I still want the socks!
- lots of mention of foreshortening by including the legs/feet. Do you guys use perspectives like this to make people seem taller? or larger than life?
- The crotches could be problematic but minor tweaks easy wash away distracting areas.

[shrug}new guy out....[/shrug]

PS I am glad that one random shot can make the place boil over with some knowledge and perspectives from you guys who have dedicated yourselves to the endeavor. Aloha




Jul 15, 2017 at 12:08 PM
eeneryma
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Random pull from wedding photos - looking for editing suggestions


A couple of thoughts in relation to this interesting discussion:

1.) I always try keep in mind when evaluating photos here that the skill and experience level of posters, especially new visitors, varies tremendously, from rote beginners to pros. To the best of my ability, I try to temper my critiques with that consideration.

2.) Whether world class or something needing to ultimately be tossed, the photo's value to the forum is the discussion and conversation that it generates, and the examples offered on how to improve it. That becomes the "teacher", what makes me a better photographer, and why I'm a frequent visitor.

Thanks to Dave, Kent, Karen and others for your insightful contributions.

Steve



Jul 15, 2017 at 01:31 PM





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