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Anyone buying a Leica TL2?
  
 
VINCET
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Reading the review of the TL2, it sounded like the camera is now more usable. Anyone thinking about getting one? It is a nice looking piece of equipment and seems to be much faster now. But is it worth the extra $$ as compare to say a Lumix GX85, G85 or the Oly E-M1 Mk II?


Jul 12, 2017 at 03:02 PM
flash
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


I picked up my black one yesterday. It's much much faster than the old one. The big issue is that you can't have EVF and flash at the same time. Other than that it's a solid little camera. I'm still testing low light AF compared to my Fuji and Olympus bodies. But again it's improved on the original.

The real choice is the lenses. The line up is limited but they're all pretty much brilliant lenses. Even the zooms. The primes are a bit big to get that performance.

For 90% a GX85, Pen F or XPro2 probably makes more sense. I think the Leica lenses are better but the others are so good it's a quibble. It works for me because I also have the SL and M so I can share the mount. SL lenses work on the TL so I've effectively got a 1.5x tele converter for the SL.

The body is genuinely tiny too. Smaller than a Pen F. Although the primes are larger the zooms are very compact. The body with the 3 zooms and the EVF are only 1600 grams. That's fantastic for a 16-200mm effective range where the optics are pretty much corner to corner fantastic.

I like it. But I might be the only one.....

Gordon



Jul 12, 2017 at 10:38 PM
adamdewilde
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Thinking of getting one for the wife to play with. I'd probably test it out a bit but no real intention of using one professionally or even for travel. I have a few T lenses so I'm curious to see if the wife takes a shine to it, or prefers the Q.

I doubt the AF will be faster than the X-T2, and I already bought and sold a full Fuji kit because I'm not a fan of crop sensor cameras.

I will add that I do like the 35/1.4 TL, but I will also add that I like the 35/1.4 XF.



Jul 13, 2017 at 12:49 PM
ken.vs.ryu
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Why? With a lens it's almost Q territory.


Jul 13, 2017 at 01:28 PM
CVickery
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


I'm contemplating it. I have the original T and generally like it, but it's always been a bit underpowered...like a Ferrari with an engine from a Yugo. Looks good, Nice IQ (once you get past the flat jpgs), but a bit laggy. The new TL2 seems to fix the main issues. Wish they had included a built in EVF though...


Jul 13, 2017 at 01:33 PM
Sam_W
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


I've got a first-gen T (got it for a steal, BNIB, when it was discontinued), and use it with a few ZMs. Sadly the Hologon G doesn't work on it, nor some of the other more interesting RF optics out there due to the additional plastic around the shutter mechanism.

The TL2 definitely looks interesting. I've no use for flash, and hated having it in there. The EVF is nice, and I use it all the time. Really looking forward to the improved response time, as that's been the core of my annoyances.

The customizability of both dials is also fantastic, so that I can have one for ISO and one for EVF, given that I'm always in Av mode, since I use just RF lenses on it. Though I may throw on some R glass, who knows.

I'm going to wait for more reviews to pop up. I'm especially curious if the "lag" between the rear screen and the EVF activating has been reduced, and ditto for the overall system lag. The delay from pressing the shutter to taking a picture is similar to the A7r, and that was thoroughly annoying with moving subjects.

If only Leica would make an APS-H system in the (roughly) same form factor. Maybe 10-15% bigger. But same idea. It would be amazing, and king of a "best of both worlds", in having a small and light travel camera, and not having to take a full M body with me. (I'm fond of my T setup as a "cheap" travel kit, in that the body isn't worth much and with just a couple of ZMs, the overall package value isn't that pricey, compared to the 15-20k of a digital M and two Leica M lenses...)



Jul 13, 2017 at 04:52 PM
flash
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Sam_W wrote:
.

The customizability of both dials is also fantastic, so that I can have one for ISO and one for EVF, given that I'm always in Av mode, since I use just RF lenses on it. Though I may throw on some R glass, who knows.

I'm going to wait for more reviews to pop up. I'm especially curious if the "lag" between the rear screen and the EVF activating has been reduced, and ditto for the overall system lag. The delay from pressing the shutter to taking a picture is similar to the A7r, and that was thoroughly annoying with moving
...Show more

You can customise the dials on the T as well......

TL2 is much snappier in all respects. Starts faster. Blackout time is like an XPro2 (maybe even better). AF is improved.

I miss the flash. The T is my out with the kids camera and I liked having a fill flash built in.

Gordon



Jul 13, 2017 at 05:23 PM
Sam_W
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


flash wrote:
You can customise the dials on the T as well......

TL2 is much snappier in all respects. Starts faster. Blackout time is like an XPro2 (maybe even better). AF is improved.

I miss the flash. The T is my out with the kids camera and I liked having a fill flash built in.

Gordon

Hey, good to know, thanks! I should have read the user manual!

EDIT: Looks like exact same body dimensions. That bodes well.

And second question, is the plastic baffle around the shutter the same as on the T/TL? (That is to say, you can't use an M lens that protrudes too much past the mount point because it'll collide.) The pictures I've found online so far are inconclusive.

Thanks again!



Jul 13, 2017 at 06:38 PM
millsart
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Prices of the lenses, and selection, kind of kills it for me. It looks like a nice modern 24meg APS-C sensor, on par with anything else on the market from Sony, Fuji etc, but look at how many different lenses options you can get for Fuji, Olympus etc and the price differences.




Jul 14, 2017 at 02:32 AM
flash
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Sam_W wrote:
Hey, good to know, thanks! I should have read the user manual!

EDIT: Looks like exact same body dimensions. That bodes well.

And second question, is the plastic baffle around the shutter the same as on the T/TL? (That is to say, you can't use an M lens that protrudes too much past the mount point because it'll collide.) The pictures I've found online so far are inconclusive.

Thanks again!


The baffle is exactly the same.

Gordon



Jul 14, 2017 at 04:11 AM
 

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flash
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


millsart wrote:
Prices of the lenses, and selection, kind of kills it for me. It looks like a nice modern 24meg APS-C sensor, on par with anything else on the market from Sony, Fuji etc, but look at how many different lenses options you can get for Fuji, Olympus etc and the price differences.



It is obscenely expensive. And I still don't know exactly why I hardly ever take out my XPro2. It should be the perfect camera for me but there's something that stops me using it over the T... I've gone through many APSC cameras and didn't really gel with any of them. I'm more drawn to m43, 35mm and mini MF.

It's almost certainly my usage (and the loading times of Xtrans into LR). I've had the best glass Fuji makes and I found I still went for something more substantial if I wanted to get serious and something less serious if I'm out for the day with the kids. As good as the Fuji system is it's a kind of no mans land for my usage. The TL doesn't present itself as a serious camera and for some reason people don't react the same way they do with an XPro2 when I point it at them. I suppose it's because it looks more like a phone with a lens than a camera.

Also it's worth mentioning that although it's stupidly expensive the lenses are stellar. Really stellar. And there's nothing that small in any format that I've used that match them. The Fuji 2.8 zooms are close but they're monsters and the smaller 18-55 and 55-200 aren't even close to the TL equivalents. Sony's APSC lenses are miles behind. Closest is the Olympus 12-40 in size and performance but it's not quite there either. Apart from aperture they match any zooms I've ever used. Even the new 24MP sensor won't come close to what they can do. Now we've got a decent sensor I reckon the TL2 and those lenses might just out resolve any APSC camera on the market with an APSC lens on the front of it (I can hear the Fuji faithful sharpening their axes now ).

Gordon



Jul 14, 2017 at 04:34 AM
CVickery
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


flash wrote:
It is obscenely expensive. And I still don't know exactly why I hardly ever take out my XPro2. It should be the perfect camera for me but there's something that stops me using it over the T... I've gone through many APSC cameras and didn't really gel with any of them. I'm more drawn to m43, 35mm and mini MF.

It's almost certainly my usage (and the loading times of Xtrans into LR). I've had the best glass Fuji makes and I found I still went for something more substantial if I wanted to get serious and something less serious if
...Show more

I fully agree with you about the lenses..at least the 18-56 and the 11-23 since that's what I have. I'm debating whether I should upgrade to the TL2 or ditch the T and use the Fuji XPro2, which I like particularly for the viewfinder. It's the TL lenses that are making me hesitate. I tried the TL2 today, and the improvement in handling is significant. Looking at TL2 files, I'm liking what I see....



Jul 14, 2017 at 05:17 AM
Sam_W
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


It's even sweeter with the Leica M-Adapter T and a tiny ZM on there. I really like the minimalist design. I don't want to have a half a dozen buttons to wrestle with and tweak and adjust every time. While I get that it will limit the camera's uses, it's also not designed for fill every use and need like a DSLR.


Jul 14, 2017 at 07:28 PM
adamdewilde
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


ken.vs.ryu wrote:
Why? With a lens it's almost Q territory.


In my personal opinion the Q is great for what it is, a wide angle lightweight AF camera. The crops are far less than ideal and I rarely if ever use them without being annoyed at myself for not bringing an interchangeable lens system.

It's the APS-C hump I can't quite get over. I don't know why, there's just something about the images I don't like. But if I'm not the primary user of the camera I wouldn't mind the crop, and I would still have access to it when needed but don't have to carry it

Also the 35TL isn't a bad lens. I have done quite a few comparisons between a lot of 50mm or 50mm lens equivalents and I feel it's a pretty solid performer despite my dislike for crop sensors lenses/cameras.

Ideally I'd want a 50/1.4 TL so I get a good 75 option. And I wouldn't be apposed to a 23/1.4 either for a 35 option. Sort of like all the same size/weight as the 35TL and with similar performance.
That or I can just stick with the SL and wait for the 35/75 cron lenses... BUT with that I'd have to carry it, and my wife would just stick to the Q since the SL as a body alone is already much to heavy for my wife.
But with that said, who would carry my M kit?



Jul 14, 2017 at 11:39 PM
adamdewilde
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


flash wrote:
It is obscenely expensive. And I still don't know exactly why I hardly ever take out my XPro2. It should be the perfect camera for me but there's something that stops me using it over the T... I've gone through many APSC cameras and didn't really gel with any of them. I'm more drawn to m43, 35mm and mini MF.

It's almost certainly my usage (and the loading times of Xtrans into LR). I've had the best glass Fuji makes and I found I still went for something more substantial if I wanted to get serious and something less serious if
...Show more


The X-T2 doesn't look cool. This is coming from someone who bought literally two bodies 4 flashes and the best 11 lenses the system has (two 2.8 zooms, a f/4 zoom and the rest 1.2-2.0 primes) within a month and sold it all off after a few weddings, a few corporate gigs and some personal testing because I felt uncomfortable bringing it to shoots due to the fact that it was APS-C and not cool looking enough to justify my prices to my clients
To be honest, some days I miss the size/weight and kinda wanna go back to two X-T2 cameras and the 23/35/50 f/2 primes. But then I remember Leica is releasing the 35/75 SL lenses sometime within the next 6-8 months and I think better of it...

I wonder if I'd feel the same way about a TL2 + 35/1.4 for the days when I can get away with a minimal setup?!

And this is also the reason that despite the fact that I don't like the X1D or it's lenses, I kinda still want the limited edition black set, because man does it look cool and feel good in the hand.
And also the reason why I've shot multiple weddings using two M bodies.

Oh also I'll add that there is something about the 35/1.4 from fuji that I love.. I always have, but the 35/1.4 TL is a better lens from the limited testing I've been able to do with the two lenses (sensor pixels weren't equal at the time of testing).



Jul 14, 2017 at 11:49 PM
flash
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


Adam,

I also have the Fuji 35mm 1.4 and I'll be doing some direct comparisons with the TL35 mm next week with 24 inch prints. I think the Leica will be better.

Gordon



Jul 15, 2017 at 11:45 AM
adamdewilde
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


flash wrote:
Adam,

I also have the Fuji 35mm 1.4 and I'll be doing some direct comparisons with the TL35 mm next week with 24 inch prints. I think the Leica will be better.

Gordon


Probably!

In the early days of the 35/1.4 there was a lot of HooHah about Fuji and their digital corrections. Now that Leica does it, nobody seems to mind

Anyway I'm sure the 35TL will yield better prints. Oh and I had a chance to play with the TL2, nice body. Fast enough for vacation use in my limited testing at the store here in Japan.



Jul 15, 2017 at 01:05 PM
mdg137
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


I pre-ordered, and got the call Wednesday that it was ready to pick up.
My intent was to use it as a back up to my M10.
Ultimately, I decided to pass-- there just isn't enough advantage there compared to my other back up, and XPro2 to justify the cost of upgrading.

If the TL system was my primary, would have picked it up in a heartbeat.



Jul 15, 2017 at 09:44 PM
Donzo98
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


adamdewilde wrote:
In my personal opinion the Q is great for what it is, a wide angle lightweight AF camera. The crops are far less than ideal and I rarely if ever use them without being annoyed at myself for not bringing an interchangeable lens system.

It's the APS-C hump I can't quite get over. I don't know why, there's just something about the images I don't like. But if I'm not the primary user of the camera I wouldn't mind the crop, and I would still have access to it when needed but don't have to carry it

Also the 35TL
...Show more


Interesting take on things....

For a non pro... I love the Q!! It comes everywhere for the most part. I crop all the time, but my images are mostly web based stuff.

For a serious shooting day... The SL comes out.

I also have a Canon G7XII for when I need something compact plus flash. I also let me 16 year old take it when she wants a camera (rare, as she usually uses her phone).




Jul 16, 2017 at 01:05 PM
Lee Saxon
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Anyone buying a Leica TL2?


adamdewilde wrote:
In the early days of the 35/1.4 there was a lot of HooHah about Fuji and their digital corrections. Now that Leica does it, nobody seems to mind


Add me to the list of people on the other side. But I already wasn't buying any of these lenses because the everything-by-wire limits their shelf life too much for what they cost unless I start making a lot more money at photography, so meh.



Jul 17, 2017 at 02:00 AM
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