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Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love so...
  
 
BrandonSi
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


I'm a bit lost as to why my prints that involve bright blue are coming out purple. Let me share a bit about my setup and maybe you all with more experience in this matter can help me out.

Camera is a Sony A7Rii and by default the color space is set to sRGB. I import RAW files into Capture One 10 Pro, and make various changes, from there I export to Photoshop (making sure sRBG is the profile the image is exported with and embedded).

The monitor I'm using is calibrated (I use a Spyder 4 Pro).

When I get into photoshop, normally I do the following..

1. Make various creative edits
2. Go to print making sure I have the appropriate .icc profile for the paper I'm using, and that the paper selection is the one recommended by the paper manufacturer. Normally I use relative colormetric with black point compensation checked.
3. Print

At this point, the majority of my prints are a pretty good representation of what I'm seeing on my screen (usually a touch darker, so I do adjust brightness by +10 on a final layer in photoshop which usually works well).

The problem is always with bright, saturated blues, they seem to end up printing purple. I've gone into Soft Proof and used CMYK (the default), and turned on gamut warning and I so see the gamut warning for the bright blues. Using a HSL adjustment layer I'll target the blues in question and desaturate until the warning is gone, and then go one or two slider units beyond that just to be safe.

The problem is I still am getting purple output where the desaturated blues should be. Now usually there's a minor improvement in that I'll see less purple, but it's still there even when the gamut warning is telling me all is OK.

If I change my "Soft Proof" environment to the .icc profile of the paper I'm using, I never even get a gamut warning. If I change the environment to sRBG, I can't do a gamut warning (Which makes sense), but I still get purple output.

Am I missing a step anywhere? Uploading the photo in question for reference. The top of the plastic rail is where most of the purple is, a minor bit in the jacket as well. Any help is much appreciated!!

FWIW, I am using an Epson R2880 (K3 ink from Epson), and the heads / nozzles are all working fine.




  ILCE-7RM2    Zeiss Distagon T FE 35 mm F1.4 ZA (SEL35F14Z) lens    35mm    f/1.6    1/4000s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  




Jul 01, 2017 at 10:32 PM
BrandonSi
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


As a workaround, I ended up changing the hue / lightness of the blue as well to something that mostly worked. I still feel like this blue should be reproducible by the printer though.. I'll try some different paper and their associated ICC profiles and see what happens.


Jul 02, 2017 at 01:10 AM
Peter Figen
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Brandon - The color space you set in your camera is irrelevant to the equation when you're shooting raw. That only applies to in camera jpegs. More importantly, what is the color space you're processing your raw files out to in Capture One. The colors in your image are more cyan than blue and that can be a problem in sRGB but usually only going to four color press cmyk, not large gamut inkjet.

You should be using an output color space from C1 of Adobe RGB or larger, but Adobe RGB is a pretty good match for your Epson, assuming you're using a photo paper and not a fine art matte paper.

Next it is very possible that the profile you're using for you printer, itself, has a hue shift built in to it. What paper and what profile are you using.



Jul 02, 2017 at 02:27 AM
BrandonSi
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Peter Figen wrote:
Brandon - The color space you set in your camera is irrelevant to the equation when you're shooting raw. That only applies to in camera jpegs. More importantly, what is the color space you're processing your raw files out to in Capture One. The colors in your image are more cyan than blue and that can be a problem in sRGB but usually only going to four color press cmyk, not large gamut inkjet.

You should be using an output color space from C1 of Adobe RGB or larger, but Adobe RGB is a pretty good match for your
...Show more

Thanks Peter! It wouldn't surprise me at all if I failed to understand the proper colorspace flow.. it's always been a bit of a mystery to me, I've just done my best to muddle through it all.

I'm currently printing on Red River's Palo Duro Softgloss Rag and the icc provided by them for that paper. For the actual paper type in the printer driver, I'm using 'premium semigloss' as recommended by RedRiver.

I'll try running this print through again from C1 to Photoshop using the AdobeRGB profile (I always choose sRGB), and then seeing if that helps things out at all.

Edit - I did try the export using AdobeRGB and got pretty much the same thing with the Palo Duro SG Rag. I then switched over to RedRiver's Arctic Polar Satin (using the appropriate icc profile from Red River) and swapped printer driver paper type to Premium Luster (as recommended by the Red River print guide). Still purple all over the place.

Soft proofing with the proper paper ICC profile and gamut warning turned on still indicates all should be OK, but sadly the printer seems to still wants to go purple in the final print.



Jul 02, 2017 at 02:38 AM
Peter Figen
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Just to make sure, I'm assuming you've done a nozzle check and all are firing?

"I'll try running this print through again from C1 to Photoshop using the AdobeRGB profile (I always choose sRGB), and then seeing if that helps things out at all."

Then, when you print, you choose Photoshop Manages Color, then choose the RR profile for that paper with Relative Colorimetric and the Black Point Compensation box checked as well.

You can also set up a Soft Proof in Ps with the exact profile you're printing (not CMYK) with and look at what it does with different rendering intents.



Jul 02, 2017 at 03:10 AM
 

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BrandonSi
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Peter Figen wrote:
Just to make sure, I'm assuming you've done a nozzle check and all are firing?

"I'll try running this print through again from C1 to Photoshop using the AdobeRGB profile (I always choose sRGB), and then seeing if that helps things out at all."

Then, when you print, you choose Photoshop Manages Color, then choose the RR profile for that paper with Relative Colorimetric and the Black Point Compensation box checked as well.

You can also set up a Soft Proof in Ps with the exact profile you're printing (not CMYK) with and look at what it does with different rendering
...Show more

Thanks again Peter! Still no go, even with those options. I will run through another nozzle check and cleaning though I haven been printing for quite a while without issues, it probably has been a month or two since I've done one.

Interesting to note that I did try letting the printer manage colors via ColorSync, terrible print output and still purple in that bright blue area, though slightly less so than in the AdobeRGB / PS managed print. The skin tones were terrible though.

If the nozzle check is clear I'll try swapping the cyan cartridges out as well.



Jul 02, 2017 at 03:14 AM
BrandonSi
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Well now.. Nozzle check showing the ENTIRE cyan block missing from the printout. It looks like that is most likely the culprit.. Will try a cleaning and see if that fixes it, then replacing the cyan cartridge. Thankfully that was the only one showing any issues, even the 'light cyan' nozzle check was OK.


Jul 02, 2017 at 03:21 AM
Peter Figen
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


The first step whenever I print is a nozzle check, even if I printed the day before or earlier in the day. You never know and that can save a lot of grief later on.


Jul 02, 2017 at 03:25 AM
BrandonSi
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Bright blue to purple with sRGB (printing)? Would love some help!


Peter Figen wrote:
The first step whenever I print is a nozzle check, even if I printed the day before or earlier in the day. You never know and that can save a lot of grief later on.


Wise words.. I think I'll start using that as my first step as well. It took 3 nozzle cleanings but now the print is coming out great (using AdobeRGB as well).

Thanks again for the help!



Jul 02, 2017 at 03:32 AM







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