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Archive 2017 · A9, anyone?

  
 
henry albert
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · A9, anyone?


Anyone shooting or thinking of shooting with the Sony A9? When indoor sports season returns I think I'll rent one and a 70-200 to see how it goes.


May 28, 2017 at 12:57 PM
PureMichigan
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · A9, anyone?


Thought about the same thing ... but I've cooled my jets a bit as more information comes out. Like to see the indoor ISO performance first and I've heard that at 20fps you need to give up a lot of dynamic range. But that's hearsay: might be worth the tradeoff -- I'll wait to see how it fares in others hands but might five it a shot.



May 28, 2017 at 05:46 PM
Mark Kuhlmann
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · A9, anyone?


Worth a rental at least, but to spend that kind of money on a body it better have as good of weather sealing as the 1D line.


May 29, 2017 at 10:06 AM
fhammond
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · A9, anyone?


I’ve got a 1DX2 and an A9 so I’ve got some thoughts on this. The short version is that for me, the A9 is in no way a replacement for the 1DX2 (or a D5).

On the plus side for the A9:

* Image quality, including high ISO. I did some quick comparisons at ISO 6400 between the A9 and 1DX2 and basically couldn’t tell the difference. I rarely shoot at 6400 and almost never higher than that. I didn’t find any banding issues.

* The AF system seems really good. However, I have so few photos from the 1DX2 where a focus problem is because of the camera making a mistake that it’s hard to make a comparison. Also, I’m mostly shooting sports where it doesn’t make sense to use one of the automatic focusing modes. On the 1DX2, I’ve got AF point expansion/four point expansion assigned to AF-ON and AF point expansion/eight point expansion assigned to AE lock. I use that setup 99% of the time. I did use the A9 to take pictures of my dog running along a beach yesterday and I was really impressed with the camera’s ability to chose a focus point and track movement. That definitely seemed better than the 1DX2 but it’s not really a common use case for my sports shooting so it’s not a significant benefit. I could see it being very beneficial to people shooting sports where the motion is less likely to be interrupted.

* No mirror blackout is great. It’s not as much of a leap as I thought it might have been (see below) but it’s definitely the way of the future.

* Silent shooting is more beneficial than I’d thought. It’s not a benefit for the sports I shoot but I could see it making a huge difference for others.

* The camera is very customizable. I was going to write “very easy to customize” but it’s actually complicated to customize it but that’s ok: there’s so much depth to what you can do that it’s good that it’s complicated. It’s definitely better than the 1DX2 in this area (‘though personally, the limitations of the 1DX2 haven’t affected me) and similar to the D5.

* A few quick things: The body feels solid and well made ‘though definitely not as weatherproof as the 1DX2; I’d use it at the beach but not in the rain. Battery life is good enough to not be an issue; same for buffer size and write speed. Eye focus is practically magic (‘though it doesn’t recognize dog eyes!).

On the down side:

* The benefit of no mirror blackout is outweighed by the poor quality of the EVF compared to the optical viewfinder on the 1DX2. Sometimes, the A9 EVF is much better than the 1DX2’s optical viewfinder. Indoors in low light with shorter focal lengths; fantastic. But outdoors shooting sports, it’s a different story. Even without the mirror blackout, I didn’t feel like I could follow the action nearly as well as I could have with the 1DX2.

* The A9 isn’t as comfortable to hold and the physical controls are not as comfortable to use as on the 1DX2. It’s the price you pay for a camera that’s small and light but I would much, much prefer a bigger body with more space and better controls. The A9 does have assignable back buttons for AF-ON and AE lock buttons, just like the 1DX2, but they aren’t as comfortable to use. They are further apart than on the 1DX2 and both are located on the part of the case that is sloping inwards. Also, the A9’s thumbstick sticks out, getting in the way of my thumb as I’m pressing AF-ON. Consequently, I’m only using AF-ON to recenter the focus point - which I don’t do very often - and I’m using AE lock as the main focusing button, with the thumbstick center button being used for eye focus. As I’m typing this, I’m thinking that I’ll probably end up with my main focusing mode on AE lock, secondary on the thumbstick button, eye focus on the not-very-comfortable AF ON button and focus point recenter button on one of the other custom buttons.

The 1DX2 feels like it was designed to ensure that every button is in the best possible position for as many customers as possible and that dictates the size and shape of the camera. The A9 feels like Sony had a fixed size (the existing A7 series) and had to do the best they could. They’ve actually done a very good job in the size and location of the controls (and there are lots and lots of controls) but it’s just not as good as the 1DX2. There are also places where they didn’t make a good choice: I love having a dedicated exposure compensation dial but the A9 has one that’s just too hard to turn. The new drive speed/AF mode button on the left of side of the camera is also great (I love dials!) but the lock on the AF mode part seems silly, like someone said that pro cameras have locking dials so one was needed here. Also - and now I’m really nit-picking - the mode dial on the right of the camera is slightly harder to turn than the dial on the left. It doesn’t mean affect the use of the camera in any way but it’s a reminder that Canon has been tweaking the design of the EOS-1 body for 30 years. I’d love a D500 or 5D4-sized body for the A9; that could be amazing.

* It’s hard to quantify but the interface of A9 seems a little slower in real-world use than the 1DX2. The 1DX2 feels very optimized to ensure that you’re rarely blocked or even slightly delayed from taking a picture. With the A9, you’ve got to be more careful. For example, on both cameras, you can be in the menu system, looking at the back LCD and immediately take a picture - no lag at all. (The A9 will acquire focus and take a picture even before the menu has disappeared from the LCD; impressive!) On the other hand, if you’re chimping on the A9 and want to quickly take a picture, you’ll be out of luck. One press of the shutter button will switch out of review mode and a second is needed to take a picture. And you’ll really be in trouble if you’re chimping and you press AF-ON or AE lock before trying to take a picture: when you’re in review mode, those buttons are used to zoom in and out, further slowing you down if you’re trying to take a picture. Now, I realize that chimping is a bad idea regardless of how quickly the camera switches modes; I’m mentioning it only because it’s an example of a place where the A9 is oddly slow, while in other places it’s super quick.


Those are the three big things for me about the A9 that mean it’s not going to replace my 1DX2. A better body, better EVF and faster-responding A9 would be amazing and I hope that’s what Canon has in the works.

Fortunately, I had no expectation that the A9 would replace my 1DX2 and I think the A9 is fantastic. I got it primarily because I wanted a small, high quality second camera. My criterial was:

1. Small size and low weight
2. Good low light performance
3. Excellent AF performance, high frame rate, and large buffer (i.e., the dog on the beach scenario!)
4. Ability to use Canon lenses
5. Some weather sealing
6. Good battery life
7. Built-in GPS
8. Customizable button layout
9. Easy to use, high quality video

The EOS 5D4 would be an obvious choice. However, it’s significantly bigger than the A9 and while its video is very high quality, the file sizes involved make it hard to use. The 5D4 has the advantage of having the same interface as the 1DX2 - in theory. In practice, I can’t set up a 5D4 to match the way I have my 1DX2 set up, so this benefit is lost. The 5D4 has a built-in GPS, which for a second camera that I’ll be traveling more with, is a great benefit. However, it’s not enough to outweigh the A9’s small size and fast frame rate and AF. Also, I actually prefer the lower resolution of the A9 over the 5D4, which is also the reason I got the A9 over waiting for an A9r/A7RIII.

I’m happy to go into more detail on any of this and would love to hear from any A9 owners if I’ve got any of this wrong. It’s been a while since I used a Sony Alpha (I had an A7s a few years ago) so I’m sure there are things I’m missing.



May 29, 2017 at 02:30 PM
PureMichigan
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · A9, anyone?


Thank you for the balanced review. Much appreciated! Lots of opinions on the A9 -- including mine -- that are undetered by actual experience and based solely on specs and speculation.


May 29, 2017 at 09:00 PM
WillWeaverRVA
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · A9, anyone?


I personally feel like the 5D Mark IV is a better value for the money, but I can say I've been impressed with what I've seen from the A9 so far (I really wish I could afford one, hah). I want to see more real-world samples before I make any further judgments, though.


May 30, 2017 at 09:47 AM
tntcorp
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · A9, anyone?


this a9 feedback is posted in the sony forum.

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1492788



May 30, 2017 at 10:11 AM
fhammond
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · A9, anyone?


WillWeaverRVA wrote:
I personally feel like the 5D Mark IV is a better value for the money, but I can say I've been impressed with what I've seen from the A9 so far (I really wish I could afford one, hah). I want to see more real-world samples before I make any further judgments, though.


I would agree that the 5D4 is better value for money. For the price of an A9, you can buy a 5D4 and a couple of lenses. The 5D4 is an amazingly well-rounded camera that's great at most things, fantastic at a few things, and just ok for a handful of things that probably aren't important to most people. It's not as wiz-bang as the A9 and doesn't have the A9's hype but I think it's a more solid and polished product than the A9.

For me, the lower bitrate video option, small size, and higher frame rate/AF speed of the A9 won me over. I'd also confess that probably 50% of my reason for purchasing was curiosity about the Sony platform and to see if the hype was justified; I bought the sizzle. In one way the hype isn't justified - for a second camera, the 5D4 is a better choice - but for a mini-1DX2/D5, it's an impressive competitor that's got some compelling features over cameras that are $1500 more expensive.

Edited on Jun 02, 2017 at 04:43 AM · View previous versions



May 30, 2017 at 10:23 AM
Mark Kuhlmann
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · A9, anyone?


fhammond wrote:
I would agree that the 5D4 is better value for money. For the price of an A9, you can buy a 5D4 and a couple of lenses. The 5D4 is an amazingly well-rounded camera that's great at most things, fantastic at a few things, and just ok for a handful of things that probably aren't important to most people. It's not as wiz-bang as the A9 and doesn't have the A9's hype but I think it's a more solid and polished product than the A9.

For me, the lower bitrate video option, small size, and higher frame rate/AF speed of
...Show more

Did you invest in Sony lenses as well? What do you shoot primarily?



May 30, 2017 at 03:10 PM
fhammond
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · A9, anyone?


Mark Kuhlmann wrote:
Did you invest in Sony lenses as well? What do you shoot primarily?


I mostly shoot sports and events with my family. Lots of low light situations. For lenses,I bought the 24-70mm f/4 and the 55mm f/1.8, plus the Sigma MC-11 to use my Canon lenses. I'm also tempted by the 85mm f/1.8. Right now, I'm renting the 70-200 GM lens. I did some testing of the A9's AF system with that lens today; there's a write-up of my experience in this thread: https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1492785/2#14059456



Jun 02, 2017 at 04:47 AM
Mark Kuhlmann
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · A9, anyone?


fhammond wrote:
I mostly shoot sports and events with my family. Lots of low light situations. For lenses,I bought the 24-70mm f/4 and the 55mm f/1.8, plus the Sigma MC-11 to use my Canon lenses. I'm also tempted by the 85mm f/1.8. Right now, I'm renting the 70-200 GM lens. I did some testing of the A9's AF system with that lens today; there's a write-up of my experience in this thread: https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1492785/2#14059456


Thanks for the write up, looking forward to someone posting a review with of a low light sports situation. Also, if you've got any sports use with the MC-11 please share!



Jun 02, 2017 at 07:35 PM
mb126
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · A9, anyone?


For the parent on the sidelines with a 70-200 it's a perfectly suitable sports camera. Or if you shoot golf for a living.

Until there are some gpod long, fast teles it's still a non starter as a primary body for most pros I think. Although if Sony drops a competitive 400 f/2.8 at less than 12k (a huge if IMO) then some may reconsider.



Jun 03, 2017 at 08:47 AM
TT1000
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · A9, anyone?


I've shot with quite a few different bodies but mostly an older Canon 1 series body.

I tested the A9 recently. I won't bore you with my own review because I think you have to try a camera yourself to see how you like it and also I don't do pixel peeping discussions of any kind. However, the A9 is the most fun camera I've shot with in a very long time. And there are features about it that I no longer want to be without like the silent shutter.



Jun 04, 2017 at 01:29 AM
henry albert
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · A9, anyone?


I guess if I was choosing a camera based on the religious fervor of it's adherents, the A9 would be my choice. There's quite the list of testimonials building up in the Sony forum. But despite the hosannas being raised there, the jury is still out on the A9's qualifications for PJ duty. The early returns, however, indicate it's not ready for prime time. It's promising and the technology has made huge strides, but it probably isn't there yet. Personally, I think mirrorless is the inevitable future, but it's just that -- in the future. We'll see, but for now my money stays in my pocket.


Jun 06, 2017 at 01:07 PM
TT1000
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · A9, anyone?


henry albert wrote:
I guess if I was choosing a camera based on the religious fervor of it's adherents, the A9 would be my choice. There's quite the list of testimonials building up in the Sony forum. But despite the hosannas being raised there, the jury is still out on the A9's qualifications for PJ duty. The early returns, however, indicate it's not ready for prime time. It's promising and the technology has made huge strides, but it probably isn't there yet. Personally, I think mirrorless is the inevitable future, but it's just that -- in the future. We'll see, but for
...Show more

If it isn't "there" for PJ use then no camera is "there." As I said I've shot Canon (going back to film) and, if anything, am partial to Canon product but after shooting A9 I think it's fantastic. I'm more concerned about Sony's lousy customer support. It's awful !



Jun 06, 2017 at 07:32 PM
henry albert
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · A9, anyone?


The A9 did well in this review. Worth a look. I was especially interested in how it focused while zooming. Heck, maybe it really is ready for prime time.






Jun 07, 2017 at 09:20 AM
ghostwind
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · A9, anyone?


The above review is pretty useless. This guy is 10x more useful: https://biglensfastshutter.com/2017/06/15/sony-a9-review-by-a-sports-photographer/


Jun 16, 2017 at 07:15 AM
Vcook
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · A9, anyone?


ghostwind wrote:
The above review is pretty useless. This guy is 10x more useful: https://biglensfastshutter.com/2017/06/15/sony-a9-review-by-a-sports-photographer/


haha, great review



Jun 16, 2017 at 09:10 AM
Mark Kuhlmann
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · A9, anyone?


ghostwind wrote:
The above review is pretty useless. This guy is 10x more useful: https://biglensfastshutter.com/2017/06/15/sony-a9-review-by-a-sports-photographer/


Until I see a review that includes a shoot under the lights, all of these reviews are pretty worthless to a sports shooter. Also, I'd like to see someone convert big Canon glass and see how the tracking turns out.



Jun 16, 2017 at 04:23 PM
fhammond
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · A9, anyone?


I didn't find that review very useful. Sure it's got soccer players but if I'm reading/viewing correctly, there's no obstruction between them. Dpreview did an ok review of that and I've done enough of my own testing to come to the conclusion that the A9 is close to the performance of the 1DX2 and D5 but not quite there ('though it's better in several other ways).


Jun 16, 2017 at 04:38 PM
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