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Archive 2017 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please

  
 
bolesauto
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


Have any of you owned both the Minolta 85mm 1.4 and the Zeiss 85mm 1.4 lenses or have you had enough experience editing images produced by both lenses to contribute to this conversation? I've read a good bit about these two lenses. I have read comparison after comparison and I have heard arguments for both.

My main concern is sharpness. I will be picking up the a99ii very soon and would like a native mount 85mm for it. Currently I use a Canon FD 85 1.2L with my a7ii which will not be useful on the a mount body. I'm spoiled by that old FD lens. It is tack sharp across the entire frame. Regarding the Minolta and Zeiss lenses, is the price difference justified by anything noticeable (sharpness, color, etc.)? I have found the Minolta used for about $600 and the Zeiss used for around $900. Too bad the new Sigma 85mm Art isn't available in an A-Mount or I wouldn't even be having this conversation (I shoot mainly Sig art primes).

Thanks for any input. I could just buy one and see if I like it then sell it if not satisfied but I'd rather avoid the hassle if possible.



Apr 25, 2017 at 02:18 PM
mogul
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


bolesauto wrote:
Have any of you owned both the Minolta 85mm 1.4 and the Zeiss 85mm 1.4 lenses or have you had enough experience editing images produced by both lenses to contribute to this conversation? I've read a good bit about these two lenses. I have read comparison after comparison and I have heard arguments for both.

My main concern is sharpness. I will be picking up the a99ii very soon and would like a native mount 85mm for it. Currently I use a Canon FD 85 1.2L with my a7ii which will not be useful on the a mount body. I'm
...Show more

There is whole series of tests on FM comparing the Minolta, ZA, and the renowned Minolta Limited ($3000+)



Apr 25, 2017 at 02:25 PM
Ltgk20
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I've had the Zeiss for several years now and I love it. Wide open it is not perfectly tack sharp but it's definitely usable. Based on my research, up until the latest crop of 85s in the last year or so, it's competitively sharp against the other popular brands. However, beyond the sharpness, this lens is one of my two favorite lenses with respect to how they render (the other is the Minolta 100f2).

I've never owned the Minolta 85s but I have read many comparisons and what it typically comes down to is how you like the lens to render. The Zeiss tends to be a bit more clinical and the Minolta less so. There are many who prefer the Minolta's rendering and have sold Zeiss's to go with the Minolta.



Apr 25, 2017 at 04:07 PM
fsiagian
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


Love the sigma 85mm 1.4.


Apr 25, 2017 at 07:25 PM
TheEmrys
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I am not a fan of the first generation Minolta 85/1.4. However, the 85/1.4 G or (G) D is amazing. Great color transitions and lovely bokeh. The Sony Zeiss has a very Zeiss feel in terms of microcontrast, but has some CA issues.

For my money, I would do the D. Or the Minolta 100/2. What a great lens.



Apr 25, 2017 at 08:12 PM
bolesauto
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please



fsiagian wrote:
Love the sigma 85mm 1.4.


Are you referring to the old Sig 85mm? I haven't paid it much mind since I was so let down by the old 50mm 1.4. I have the 50 and am not impressed. Just a so-so lens compared to others I've used.

Edited on Apr 25, 2017 at 09:06 PM · View previous versions



Apr 25, 2017 at 08:58 PM
trogdon
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I've seen some ZA's go for some impressively low prices, a lot hovering around the $700 mark. One went unsold here for like $685 for quite a while. It's the sharper more well corrected lens, and for the price difference I'd choose it for sure. I'd only choose the Minolta if you could get it for around $500


Apr 25, 2017 at 08:58 PM
bolesauto
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please



TheEmrys wrote:
I am not a fan of the first generation Minolta 85/1.4. However, the 85/1.4 G or (G) D is amazing. Great color transitions and lovely bokeh. The Sony Zeiss has a very Zeiss feel in terms of microcontrast, but has some CA issues.

For my money, I would do the D. Or the Minolta 100/2. What a great lens.


Thank you. I'm concerned about sharpness. My FD 85 1.2 is tack sharp down to the pixel level. Crazy sharp. I doubt I'll get that but I can't have fuzzy eyelashes or soft edges. I think I'll go for a nice copy of a G lens and if it doesn't meet my needs then I'll try the Zeiss. I'm a fan of Zeiss but have found that I really like the new Sig art series though I doubt we'll ever see an A-Mount sig art 85.



Apr 25, 2017 at 09:04 PM
fsiagian
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


bolesauto wrote:
Are you referring to the old Sig 85mm? I haven't paid it much mind since I was so let down by the old 50mm 1.4. I have the 50 and am not impressed. Just a so-so lens compared to others I've used.

The non art 50mm was not good. The 85mm is totally different.




Apr 25, 2017 at 10:12 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


Yeah, if you want to stick with AF, there's not a lot of choice. All of the fast lenses have been mentioned, and nearly all of them are screw-driven focus (I don't know about the Sigma) so they aren't as fast or quiet as the SSM lenses.

I'm not sure I'd recommend any of them over this magical FD 85L you've got. I like mine, but I'm not getting eyelash resolution at the edges until it's stopped down significantly. Maybe you should look into having that converted to A. If you're shooting with an SLT, it may be possible.



Apr 25, 2017 at 11:08 PM
joel022484
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


freaklikeme wrote:
Yeah, if you want to stick with AF, there's not a lot of choice. All of the fast lenses have been mentioned, and nearly all of them are screw-driven focus (I don't know about the Sigma) so they aren't as fast or quiet as the SSM lenses.


The Sigma has it's HSM motor, so it is silent. I would at least consider the Sigma. I haven't had mine for a while now, but I remember when I did have it that I enjoyed it a lot. I too had the Sigma 50 1.4 (non art) and could never fall in love with it.



Apr 26, 2017 at 07:25 AM
farfisa
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I've had two copies of the 1st gen Minolta AF. I sold it to buy the Zeiss, then switched back.

Personally I found the bokeh smoother on the Minolta (not wide open, but a stop down) and the colours nicer (better skin tones).

I had a G D version, and the colours were very rich, much like the 80-200 APO HS G, so if you want punchier colour and don't want the more clinical Zeiss rendering, this could be the best compromise.



Apr 26, 2017 at 08:58 AM
ocean2059
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I find that the Zeiss ZA 85 is pretty sharp in the center (using AF mode of my A99/A900 bodies). But the rendering and color are a bit busy and contrasty. I find it's a very useful as a short tele for landscape uses. The lens that I really like is the Minolta 100/2, which has right amount of sharpness with beautiful color and rendering.


Apr 26, 2017 at 09:21 AM
mogul
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I think you will find the ZA to be sharper than the Canon you so much admire...the only drawback with the ZA is color fringing wide open and slow focusing.

Edited on Apr 26, 2017 at 04:18 PM · View previous versions



Apr 26, 2017 at 09:39 AM
JimUe
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I don't think you'd be disappointed with either the G or ZA


Apr 26, 2017 at 03:41 PM
Eoin
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


Its been a number of years since I used the A system, but I remember it well.
Minolta G always provided nicer colours and tones compared to the ZA.
Hard to say if the ZA was any sharper across the frame, once contrast was increased on the G images.
I always disliked the CA which seemed more pronounced on the ZA.

If I was going back to the A mount, I would be choosing the ZA simply because at this stage the Minolta G would be getting too old and perhaps well used. I'm not sure about repairs and spare parts.



Apr 26, 2017 at 04:22 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


I can provide samples with any if you’d like. I’ve shot the Minolta 85 1.4, ZA 85 1.4, Sigma 85 1.4, Mino 85 1.4 limited, ZA 135 1.8 and Mino 100 2—very familiar with a-mount. I guess it depends on how pick you are, but ZA and Minolta have very different draws, and I don’t find them “about the same” as people often say WO. Not to be difficult, but the Canon FD 85 1.2 is not tack sharp across the frame WO, but not sure if you meant WO. But if it’s sharp enough for you, you’ll be surprised at the ZA 85 1.4 in terms of sheer sharpness all over then. The FD 85 1.2L is sharp centrally with minimal SA WO but with purple fringing (less than ZA, but still problematic at times), but sharpness drops off considerablely in the outer zones and specifically in the very corners. Also, with the a99ii, the only lens you’re getting full AF compatibility with is the 85 ZA. The absolute abstraction of bokeh between the ZA and 85L slightly favors the 85L, but the lens can show some nervousness in transition, where the ZA is better. Given you are quite happy with you're 85L, I would get the Sigma 85 as it has the same type of resolution (high central sharpness, rapid fall off) if you don't mind the color.

Zeiss 85 1.4:
Positive: Zeiss color and contrast, better off central sharpness than others, good separation at comparable aperture (medium 3D effect). It’s draws like a ZA zeiss (sony zeiss, not ZF or ZM glass) slightly lower micro contrast with a balanced feel in the tonal range, maybe a bit less saturation and higher luminosity). Smooth focus transition (but a bit higher contrast bokeh than the Mino 85 1.4) as the lens is higher contrast generaly. Until the recent generation of 85s (Batis, Milvus, GM, tamron, etc) this was as good as anything for sharpness.
Bad: Price, loud and medium AF speed, color fringing in high contrast areas (better af f2, gone by 2.8), some play in the focusing ring.

Minolta 85 1.4:
Good: Price, lightness, softer warmer colors with smoother tonal transitions, lovely bokeh, better with light and highlight detail—does wonderfully for skin tones. A bit more SA wide open helps too.
Bad: Central sharpness is only decent by modern standards. Off center needs a couple stops to catch up to the center. As a lower contrast lens (compared to this field), seems to not far quite as well in lower light and lower contrast scenes than the zeiss (unsurprising). Parts/repair. Minimal 3d affect (for an 85 1.4)

Minolta 100 f2:
Good: Good central and outer sharpness WO, small size/weight, fastest AF (but audible), more vivid colors than 85 1.4 regular--the punchiest Minolta lens I think. Price, less fringing WO than ZA or limited. Pleasent amount of SAa wo
Bad: Loose a stop, dinky MF focusing ring with quick throw with some play. Background bokeh a bit busier than peers and focus transitions are busier than peers (even if all lenses are at f2). Parts/repair.

Minolta 85 1.4 Limited:
Good: Superb color and tonality, smoothest bokeh of any 85 in any mount, especially in the transition zones. Some play in the MF ring. Good central sharpness WO, beautiful balance of SA, clarity and contrast for portraits. My favorite 85 in any mount—files are SUPERB.
Bad: Price and color fringing (both bokeh and fringing), heavy (750g), slower AF than ZA and Mino 85 1.4 regular, off central sharpness needs a couple stops. Parts/repair.

Sigma:
Good: Quick and quiet AF (not screw driven) price, central sharpness on par with ZA perhaps a pinch higher, smooth bokeh, good color fringing control, good transition zones. Minimal SA WO (good or bad depends on you).
Bad: I didn’t like color and seems to have an inferior tonal distinction (photos always looks flatter, more digital) and hard to process out. Least liked of all these lenses.

Edited on Apr 26, 2017 at 06:27 PM · View previous versions



Apr 26, 2017 at 05:47 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


freaklikeme wrote:
Yeah, if you want to stick with AF, there's not a lot of choice. All of the fast lenses have been mentioned, and nearly all of them are screw-driven focus (I don't know about the Sigma) so they aren't as fast or quiet as the SSM lenses.

I'm not sure I'd recommend any of them over this magical FD 85L you've got. I like mine, but I'm not getting eyelash resolution at the edges until it's stopped down significantly. Maybe you should look into having that converted to A. If you're shooting with an SLT, it may be possible.


Can't convert the FD to a-mount--I emailed Leitex several years ago and they said not possible with flange distance.



Apr 26, 2017 at 05:57 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


nehemiahphoto wrote:
Can't convert the FD to a-mount--I emailed Leitex several years ago and they said not possible with flange distance.


Flange distance isn't what makes it impossible. If that were true, there wouldn't have been any FD to EOS conversion kits for the shorter primes, but there were. Mirror interference on a full-frame would be the issue there, and that's not something you have to worry about with the SLTs.



Apr 26, 2017 at 08:00 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · 85mm A Mount Suggestions Please


freaklikeme wrote:
Flange distance isn't what makes it impossible. If that were true, there wouldn't have been any FD to EOS conversion kits for the shorter primes, but there were. Mirror interference on a full-frame would be the issue there, and that's not something you have to worry about with the SLTs.


David over at leitex said he looked at "the figures" and didn't think it was possible. You think he was talking about mirror clearance? I am curious now. FE and A mount are with .5 mm, and both longer than FD. Maybe he was just wrong?




Apr 26, 2017 at 08:45 PM
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