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who needs a9 ?
  
 
nugeny
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · who needs a9 ?


when there is the almighty Sony SLT a99 II. Tell me the reasoning, even for sports, am listening.


Apr 21, 2017 at 04:23 AM
hiepphotog
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · who needs a9 ?


As an enthusiast, I go with the A9 beucase of its ability to go as small and light as I want. It's also the ability to adapt other lenses. But the latest tech Sony can come up with on the A9 is enticing to anyone that can utilize it.


Apr 21, 2017 at 04:49 AM
Matt Grum
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · who needs a9 ?


nugeny wrote:
when there is the almighty Sony SLT a99 II. Tell me the reasoning, even for sports, am listening.


The A9 is twice as fast, lighter, more sensitive, has a very fast electronic shutter, and mounts almost every lens ever made.




Apr 21, 2017 at 09:57 AM
mcbroomf
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · who needs a9 ?


I don't have a single A lens but I have lenses up the wazoo (native or otherwise) that will fit my A7R/R2 bodies (and therefore the A9). vs the a99 the a9 is smaller in my hand and backpack.


Apr 21, 2017 at 10:02 AM
retrofocus
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · who needs a9 ?


Matt Grum wrote:
The A9 is twice as fast, lighter, more sensitive, has a very fast electronic shutter, and mounts almost every lens ever made.



I am curious how third party rangefinder lenses will work on the A9 and its 24 MP sensor. So far we always had some surprises in every A7 series camera with different sensors in this regard. I am not interested in the A9 to buy, but I still want to see if anything has changed here compared to other A7 series cameras.



Apr 21, 2017 at 12:01 PM
Paul_K
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · who needs a9 ?


Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned the whole Sony A9 'thing' is 'much ado about nothing' so far
Sure, the specs LOOK impressive, but of course, in the end the proof is in the tasting

Minolta, now Sony, was always a forerunner with technical innovations and impressive specs, eg in the film days with the breakthrough first affordable AF slr A 7000/Maxxum 7000, and the 'pro' A9000
And later with the Alpha DSLR range with the Alpha 900 as the then full frame top model
On paper, the camera's always had top/the best specs, but under real world conditions, they all too often just fell short of expectations, and in comparison with their competitors

I eg remember well when I got my first D3 in 2008, a acquaintance who worked at Sony tried to convince me into 'upgrading' to the Alpha 900
But after comparing the Alpha 900's AF, high ISO, and IQ, (IMO the real criteria that count when you are taking pictures under real world working conditions) with my D3 shooting surf and catwalk, my choice was easily made, and I stuck with Nikon, despite the 'inferior' specs (and I'm net even talking about the cost of having to buy, if such would have been possible, new pro level glass similar to Nikon's 4/200-400VR and 2/200VR)

Same with the Sony mirrorless (dare I say) hype: sure, great IQ, and indeed smaller (eg compared to a D3/4/5/1Dx etc) body)
But, as widely reported, awkward (to say the least) menu, ditto UI, slow/bad AF tracking, bad batterylife, limited and expensive manufacturer lens choice (sure, you can use other manufacturer lenses with an adapter, but at a cost of AF speed and effective max aperture of the lens)
While under real life conditions, I've always looked in wonder at mirrorless users fighting the unbalance of large pro lenses on smallish cameras

Maybe not an issue when you are an amateur with plenty of time to walk through and eventually select the desired settings, while leisurely taking images of (next) to still objects/subjects
But if you have to, and not just as a professional, shoot moving subjects (fast moving children, amateur or pro sports, weddings and /or events) under constantly and fast changing conditions, those are the things that most likely will leave you frustrated (to use an understatement)

As far as the A9 is concerned, sure it looks great on paper, but only time will tell how 'great' it will actually be in real life (apart from the fact whether you really need those specs, or make you a better photographer, or can afford to to 'upgrade')
So far there has been there has just/only been a lot of PR, and specs, but no real world test reports/reviews

And on a side note, does everybody really have the means to constantly switch/upgrade to the latest gizmo/camera/system that's announced, or is it just a matter of constantly maxing out credit cards?

I personally over the years have spent much on my several Nikon film slr's, DSLR's, lenses, flashes etc
But I am wary/see little justification in losing a lot of money if selling/trading in all that gear to 'upgrade' to a new, yet to be under real world conditions to be proven, system, just to have that new system possibly/probably be replaced by the next new/'best' thing possibly next year

Just look at the improvements Sony eg makes/sees necessary to make on the AF, and AF user interface of the A9 (AF joystick, dedicated AF-On button) over previous bodies, and how over the last few years they constantly made similar quite drastic 'improvements' with each, ever so regularly within a year or slightly more, introduced new one
Basically rendering those 'older bodies 'outdated' in the eyes of the usually very 'techie' orientated Sony audience, and the very least causing them to take a serious hit as far as the 2nd hand demand (and selling prices) are concerned



Apr 21, 2017 at 12:52 PM
hiepphotog
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · who needs a9 ?


retrofocus wrote:
I am curious how third party rangefinder lenses will work on the A9 and its 24 MP sensor. So far we always had some surprises in every A7 series camera with different sensors in this regard. I am not interested in the A9 to buy, but I still want to see if anything has changed here compared to other A7 series cameras.


It all depends on the thickness of the filter stack. I highly doubt they would change anything cause that would affect the native lenses. As the Sony gets more popular, we'll see Voigtlander and other third party lens makers making native lens for the system. Eventually, shooting M lenses on a Sony is no longer needed if you want a small set-up, unless you're after a certain look. Zeiss just needs to expand the Loxia line strategically.



Apr 21, 2017 at 02:34 PM
retrofocus
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · who needs a9 ?


hiepphotog wrote:
It all depends on the thickness of the filter stack. I highly doubt they would change anything cause that would affect the native lenses. As the Sony gets more popular, we'll see Voigtlander and other third party lens makers making native lens for the system. Eventually, shooting M lenses on a Sony is no longer needed if you want a small set-up, unless you're after a certain look. Zeiss just needs to expand the Loxia line strategically.


You are right, we are seeing this trend already with recent announcements of wide-angle CV lenses in E-mount. To me it is a headache because I prefer to use M lenses on my A7R which also fit to my Leica M cameras - I only need one set of lenses to use it with two different camera systems.



Apr 21, 2017 at 04:39 PM
RobCD
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · who needs a9 ?


Paul_K wrote:
On paper, the camera's always had top/the best specs, but under real world conditions, they all too often just fell
Same with the Sony mirrorless (dare I say) hype: sure, great IQ, and indeed smaller (eg compared to a D3/4/5/1Dx etc) body)
But, as widely reported, awkward (to say the least) menu, ditto UI, slow/bad AF tracking, bad batterylife, limited and expensive manufacturer lens choice (sure, you can use other manufacturer lenses with an adapter, but at a cost of AF speed and effective max aperture of the lens)


This might be your personal view of Sony's cameras but you are cherry picking what you don't like (or have heard that others don't like) without commenting on the things people don't like about the alternative options. I don't care for OVFs, terrible live view, limited choices for tilt screens, no focus peaking, limited focus point coverage, micro adjust, and a number of other things that are typically part of the dslr experience (can vary by model and brand though).

But really these types of things won't have a consensus no matter how many people you ask. What can't be as easily disputed is the success that Sony has shown with most of the cameras that they've introduced in the last 3 to 4 years. You may not like the A7r or A7rII for landscape photography but you can't deny the success. You may not like the A7s or A7sII for low light or for video but you can't deny the success. So, who knows if the A9 will be successful at this point but Sony's track record with the full frame E mount cameras is a better indicator of that success than someone's personal preference for a user interface.



Apr 21, 2017 at 05:22 PM
jhinkey
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · who needs a9 ?


Paul_K wrote:
And on a side note, does everybody really have the means to constantly switch/upgrade to the latest gizmo/camera/system that's announced, or is it just a matter of constantly maxing out credit cards?



Not sure about the "constantly maxing out credit cards" comment, but I can comment on the first part of the sentence.

Personally, I upgrade when the features of the new models (or camera system) can make a big difference in how I take my images & don't chase the latest and greatest just to have it.

I tend to put a couple thousand (net) $$ into my major photography purchases each year by selling my current gear while it still has appreciable value, otherwise, in general, the value of the gear really plummets over time and I end up spending a lot to upgrade.

I don't max out credit cards for this, rather I choose to purchase modest other things in life and make the most use of them (like cars - buy modest and drive and maintain it for a long time). This allows me to spend $$ on photography gear. I also don't have other expensive hobbies.

- J




Apr 21, 2017 at 05:35 PM
 

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GMPhotography
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · who needs a9 ?


I hate when money comes into these threads. Your 5 cents may mean 5,50,500 dollars to others. As a hobbyist photography is relatively cheap compared to any other hobbies.


Apr 21, 2017 at 05:40 PM
molson
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · who needs a9 ?


nugeny wrote:
when there is the almighty Sony SLT a99 II. Tell me the reasoning, even for sports, am listening.


The A9 will have a substantially higher per-unit profit margin for Sony since they don't incur the costs of the mirror box, pentaprism, shutter assembly, or the skilled labour and instrumentation needed to install them. Isn't that reason enough?



Apr 21, 2017 at 07:03 PM
molson
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · who needs a9 ?


jhinkey wrote:
I don't max out credit cards for this, rather I choose to purchase modest other things in life and make the most use of them (like cars - buy modest and drive and maintain it for a long time). This allows me to spend $$ on photography gear. I also don't have other expensive hobbies.



Same here...



Apr 21, 2017 at 07:04 PM
retrofocus
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · who needs a9 ?


molson wrote:
The A9 will have a substantially higher per-unit profit margin for Sony since they don't incur the costs of the mirror box, pentaprism, shutter assembly, or the skilled labour and instrumentation needed to install them. Isn't that reason enough?


Unfortunately these have been good reasons for a while - look at the A7RII which is IMO still overpriced. Why? Because of demand - it is a very successful semi-professional camera model on the market with modern sensor technology included. Same is now for the A9 - Sony enters another area, and its uniqueness alone makes up for the price - unfortunately for us consumers.
It would be nice if Canon had a similar FF mirrorless camera to keep pricing in check....oh, wait, they are a bit behind I guess



Apr 21, 2017 at 11:15 PM
akclimber
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · who needs a9 ?


I very well might buy the A9 for whales. I continue to use Nikon for most of my whale stuff but with the introduction of the A9 and 100-400 I'm going to be cataloging what non-sony and even some sony gear I can sell to afford both I think. I'll keep my A7R2 for landscapes, etc. The thought of AF points very near the bottom of the frame is pretty exciting for me since I love to frame orcas, etc low in the frame with ample mountain/sky.sunset backgrounds and DSLR AF points just don't quite do what I need. 20 FPS is also really exciting for breaches and other fun action. :-)


Apr 21, 2017 at 11:36 PM
jhinkey
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · who needs a9 ?


GMPhotography wrote:
I hate when money comes into these threads. Your 5 cents may mean 5,50,500 dollars to others. As a hobbyist photography is relatively cheap compared to any other hobbies.


Plus, back in the film days when I would go through ~50 rolls a year - that now-defunct ~$15/roll (film+processing) cost is effectively put into yearly upgrading of my digital equipment. From that sense for me not much has changed cost-wise.



Apr 21, 2017 at 11:45 PM
stevesanacore
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · who needs a9 ?


Doesn't sound like you like the Sony's very much. That's your choice. I think the A7R was a milestone for my work. I loved it instantly. Then the A7R2 was a worthy upgrade. I do use them under pressure and have no issue finding the settings I need in a hurry. You just need to learn the menus and set up the function buttons. I actually think that the Sony bodies have lived up to their hype very well, or at least as well as other top cameras from Canon and Nikon.

As far as the costs, if you want to compete in the photography world I live in, you need to keep up the tech. A new camera with new features that help me take better images is always welcome and very motivating too. Well worth a few thousand every few years. I usually sell my oldest back up body, my current camera becomes my backup and the new one takes poll position. It's exciting to have the latest gear and excitement is contagious to my crew and clients. Because photography pays all my bills, it's a very worthy investment to me. Other business costs crush gear expenses like this ten fold. Even if I were just a serious amateur working on my craft, a few thousand to upgrade every few years is much cheaper than lots of my buddies spend on motorcycles, boats, cars, etc. So I guess it's all relative.

Paul_K wrote:
Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned the whole Sony A9 'thing' is 'much ado about nothing' so far
Sure, the specs LOOK impressive, but of course, in the end the proof is in the tasting

Minolta, now Sony, was always a forerunner with technical innovations and impressive specs, eg in the film days with the breakthrough first affordable AF slr A 7000/Maxxum 7000, and the 'pro' A9000
And later with the Alpha DSLR range with the Alpha 900 as the then full frame top model
On paper, the camera's always had top/the best specs, but under real world conditions, they all too often
...Show more



Apr 22, 2017 at 12:19 AM
GMPhotography
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · who needs a9 ?


Very true. It sort went into computers and such but I agree my film bills where extremely high. For a hobbyist this is painful money wise. I was able to charge to clients luckily

jhinkey wrote:
Plus, back in the film days when I would go through ~50 rolls a year - that now-defunct ~$15/roll (film+processing) cost is effectively put into yearly upgrading of my digital equipment. From that sense for me not much has changed cost-wise.




Apr 22, 2017 at 12:24 AM
GMPhotography
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · who needs a9 ?


Well said. This is our money making careers

stevesanacore wrote:
Doesn't sound like you like the Sony's very much. That's your choice. I think the A7R was a milestone for my work. I loved it instantly. Then the A7R2 was a worthy upgrade. I do use them under pressure and have no issue finding the settings I need in a hurry. You just need to learn the menus and set up the function buttons. I actually think that the Sony bodies have lived up to their hype very well, or at least as well as other top cameras from Canon and Nikon.

As far as the costs, if you want to
...Show more



Apr 22, 2017 at 12:25 AM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · who needs a9 ?




Paul_K wrote:
Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned the whole Sony A9 'thing' is 'much ado about nothing' so far
Sure, the specs LOOK impressive, but of course, in the end the proof is in the tasting

Minolta, now Sony, was always a forerunner with technical innovations and impressive specs, eg in the film days with the breakthrough first affordable AF slr A 7000/Maxxum 7000, and the 'pro' A9000
And later with the Alpha DSLR range with the Alpha 900 as the then full frame top model
On paper, the camera's always had top/the best specs, but under real world conditions, they all too often
...Show more


Post of the year - well said.



Apr 22, 2017 at 12:40 AM
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