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Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon
  
 
leighton w
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


It's amusing to me. Over on the Nikon and Canon forums, they're starting the debate over mirrorless vs their beloved system. The conversation is becoming tense.

Yet, here we are oblivious to the rest of the camera world and couldn't care less that Sony came out with a new camera.

How sweet it is!



Apr 20, 2017 at 10:06 AM
cvrle59
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


I seems to be a very nice camera, at least what the spec is all about, but for that much money...

Fuji isn't cheap either, but Sony is just so expensive for me, considering what kind of system I would like to owe.

Disease called FF is over, my body is fee of it. Sometimes I get some small attacks, then I make a swing to Damien Lovegrove's website to cure it quickly.

He does magic things with X-system, showing full potential of it.

Edited on Apr 20, 2017 at 12:25 PM · View previous versions



Apr 20, 2017 at 11:56 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


leighton w wrote:
It's amusing to me. Over on the Nikon and Canon forums, they're starting the debate over mirrorless vs their beloved system...


That conversation has been going on for many years. It's old. Most of the time, it's boring and repetitive. Sometimes, it's sad.

Granted, there is a new twist, as the A9 high-fps spec blows away the 1D-series and D4/D5-series cameras, but it'll take a while to evaluate hype vs. hope, by comparing the specs with lessons learned from actual shooting experience.

P.S. Being oblivious to what's going on around you is not the same as being content with what you have.



Apr 20, 2017 at 12:18 PM
leighton w
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


jcolwell wrote:
That conversation has been going on for many years. It's old. Most of the time, it's boring and repetitive. Sometimes, it's sad.

Granted, there is a new twist, as the A9 high-fps spec blows away the 1D-series and D4/D5-series cameras, but it'll take a while to evaluate hype vs. hope, by comparing the specs with lessons learned from actual shooting experience.

P.S. Being oblivious to what's going on around you is not the same as being content with what you have.


You're right about the conversation, but the A9 brings it to a whole new level. Many are calling it the DSLR killer.

You're also right about my choice of wording. I should have said content.




Apr 20, 2017 at 12:49 PM
chez
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


leighton w wrote:
It's amusing to me. Over on the Nikon and Canon forums, they're starting the debate over mirrorless vs their beloved system. The conversation is becoming tense.

Yet, here we are oblivious to the rest of the camera world and couldn't care less that Sony came out with a new camera.

How sweet it is!


Maybe because Fuji just has nothing to compare to the A9. Both Canon and Nikon have established high speed systems that are full frame...Fuji has none.



Apr 20, 2017 at 12:52 PM
ggreene
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


leighton w wrote:
It's amusing to me. Over on the Nikon and Canon forums, they're starting the debate over mirrorless vs their beloved system. The conversation is becoming tense.


I can only speak for the FM Canon forum but I don't believe it's that tense. Certainly some questioning on the design decisions that Sony made though. That group has a lot of users with 1D series gear and large lenses and have a long history of using them so their experience as to what works in the field is not to be discounted.

I've been waiting for a legitimate ML competitor to the Canikon flagships. That duopoly needs some pressure as they have become a little too stagnant lately. The 1DX -> 1DX2 upgrade was minor at best.

leighton w wrote:
Many are calling it the DSLR killer.


How many times over the years has this been said? The A9 before it's even released has two gotcha's that DSLR users will gripe about. Lack of pro level weather resistance and already some handling issues that Max pointed out in his video preview. Sony in their pursuit to keep everything in tiny bodies made compromises that you don't make at the flagship level.

I'm going to rent it at some point and see for myself but the old software adage of never buying a .0 release is bouncing around in my head.






Apr 20, 2017 at 01:12 PM
leighton w
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


chez wrote:
Maybe because Fuji just has nothing to compare to the A9. Both Canon and Nikon have established high speed systems that are full frame...Fuji has none.


Whatever the reasons, I believe that Fuji users (for the most part) are content with their system and don't miss FF at all. Having said that, there are SOME Fuji users that still own FF systems, but I think they are in the minority.

For the record, I came from a Nikon FF system and for what I use a camera for, don't miss it at ALL. YMMV.



Apr 20, 2017 at 01:33 PM
leighton w
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


ggreene wrote:
I can only speak for the FM Canon forum but I don't believe it's that tense. Certainly some questioning on the design decisions that Sony made though. That group has a lot of users with 1D series gear and large lenses and have a long history of using them so their experience as to what works in the field is not to be discounted.

I've been waiting for a legitimate ML competitor to the Canikon flagships. That duopoly needs some pressure as they have become a little too stagnant lately. The 1DX -> 1DX2 upgrade was minor at best.

How
...Show more

Just give it time.



Apr 20, 2017 at 01:33 PM
cvrle59
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


It doesn't really matter if people, who need this kind of camera, would switch to Sony or not, but most of them will hesitate to invest into high end CanNikon gear from now on, IMO.

They will rather just wait how those two will answer to this serious challenge, and if that doesn't make CanNikon to wake up, they will most likely turn their heads towards Sony,

especially, if Sony brings some long glass to the market soon enough.



Apr 20, 2017 at 01:34 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


cvrle59 wrote:
It doesn't really matter if people, who need this kind of camera, would switch to Sony or not, but most of them will hesitate to invest into high end CanNikon gear from now on, IMO.


+1



Apr 20, 2017 at 02:33 PM
 

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Ziffl3
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


Basically ... were is the glass to go with said body.....

Then... how does the gear perform .... especially on a hot summer day.

The electronic viewfinder will need to be sorted out vs an optical version.



Apr 20, 2017 at 03:01 PM
Ziffl3
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


leighton w wrote:
Whatever the reasons, I believe that Fuji users (for the most part) are content with their system and don't miss FF at all. Having said that, there are SOME Fuji users that still own FF systems, but I think they are in the minority.

For the record, I came from a Nikon FF system and for what I use a camera for, don't miss it at ALL. YMMV.


It is good to see fuji roll with their C-sized sensor.

Still waiting for FF though. ... which means I need to see if the MF GFX 50 fits in my wheelhouse for wedding /Engagement/bridal coverage.

Mark




Apr 20, 2017 at 03:03 PM
retrofocus
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


I repeat what I have phrased a few times earlier, but it shows more and more its truth...

Canon is hit by several severe mistakes made in the past:

- Having a 5D MkIII released as only option to compete with high MP/high DR sensors in Nikon-equivalent DSLRs (D800/D800E/D810/D750) and later Sony A7R. Canon lost the leadership in FF sensor technology at this point which it had with the 5D MkII.

- Focusing on high end video and continuation of DSLRs instead of looking early enough in advancing mirrorless technology in opposite to Sony and Fuji. Later some failed attempts to try with APS-C based M series mirrorless cameras when already the rest of the market had to offer better technology for the price.

The only thing going for Canon compared to a camera like the A9 is the bigger variety in long tele glass currently - an advantage which will likely shrink more and more in the next coming years. Canon's 1D series was already sort of a bulky dinosaur, but it certainly doesn't get younger by the A9 either....

With the A9 Sony hits Canon the third time - first with the sensors released in Nikon FF cameras in 2012, followed shortly after by the A7 series which even allowed to use existing Canon glass with adapters. Big success stories for Sony each time as we all know by now. And now the A9....a new professional line, and it is just the beginning. Canon should look out for a partner to merge with its photo business.



Apr 20, 2017 at 03:16 PM
tntcorp
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


leighton w wrote:
It's amusing to me. Over on the Nikon and Canon forums, they're starting the debate over mirrorless vs their beloved system. The conversation is becoming tense.

Yet, here we are oblivious to the rest of the camera world and couldn't care less that Sony came out with a new camera.

How sweet it is!


nah... the proof is where the rubber meets the road. excellent specs but actual real-world results will determine a stud or a bust.



Apr 20, 2017 at 04:30 PM
Robin Smith
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


With the A9 Sony hits Canon the third time

And yet still, somehow, Canon struggles on despite these body blows, selling nothing, losing money...



Apr 20, 2017 at 08:55 PM
Sorbet
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


I'm not interested in a $4500 camera like this new Sony. Both Fuji and Canon offer fabulous cameras that meet my photography needs for much less money.


Apr 20, 2017 at 09:21 PM
PeaktoPeek
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


I don't see how a $4500 body is going to make any better images than my $900 X-T20- in my hands anyway. I think Fuji is actually a great "value" system compared to where I was with Nikon- in regards to price vs performance.


Apr 21, 2017 at 12:59 AM
charles.K
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


As mentioned in the Sony thread kudos to Sony as they are making some excellent advances with MILC FF. The issue is the Sony lens lineup for the A9 is very much lacking for now. If I was back into serious horse sports photography I still would not choose the A9 as the availability of fast tele lenses is very limited. The IQ of the GM 70-200 f/2.8 is still questionable and yet to be confirmed whether the IQ tested versus the specifications is just due to production variations. This is a major work horse of a lens and there are questions still about its performance.

The other major issue is cost of entry. In Australia the price is very high about 7K for the body alone and the GM lenses are also relatively very high.

If I do not require 20 fps, 6.5 fps with the D750 is more than enough with 24MP and superb dynamic AF abilities coupled with lenses that be purchased used for 1/5 of the cost. If your budget is not restrictive of course have fun

The real issue comes down to a value proposition for the combined body and lens system needed. There are great systems available now both new and used Fuji, Nikon, Canon etc.

If Sony had class leading lens lineup the decision making process would be very different. Most photographers align themselves because of superb lenses rather than the body alone.

For this reason alone I had previously aligned myself with the M9/M240/Monochrom because of the superb Leica M lenses even at the very cost of entry.

The truth is no one manufacturer can cater for everyone and while we have competition and choices it is great for the industry.

Edited on Apr 21, 2017 at 01:22 AM · View previous versions



Apr 21, 2017 at 01:14 AM
rbf_
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


I can't wait to see an XTrans'd APS-C version of this 6th Gen Exmor RS stacked sensor in a Fuji XPx or XTx There's been some rumors about a 2018 release of an extreme X series body that alluded to better video (better shutter? e or global?). We'll see but when technology moves forward it puts pressure on everyone to keep up so it's good for the photographer in the long run


Apr 21, 2017 at 01:21 AM
charles.K
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Sony A9 and Nikon/Canon


cvrle59 wrote:
It doesn't really matter if people, who need this kind of camera, would switch to Sony or not, but most of them will hesitate to invest into high end CanNikon gear from now on, IMO.

They will rather just wait how those two will answer to this serious challenge, and if that doesn't make CanNikon to wake up, they will most likely turn their heads towards Sony,

especially, if Sony brings some long glass to the market soon enough.


I do feel many are equally awaiting for Sony's lenses. The A9 looks great on specs but without the gammut of lenses most photographers will wait awhile. There are some excellent lenses available such as the FE 35/1.4, FE 50/1.4 and GM 85/1.4 but there are many gaps.

In contrast Fuji with the GFX detailed very carefully their lenses and how to present the GFX as as integrated system. Same as for the APS-C series with the introduction for the XP2/XT2/XT20 with the XF series of lenses are all excellent. If it were not for the lenses, I would not have even looked at Fuji.



Apr 21, 2017 at 01:27 AM
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