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5d iv replacement for 5dsR?
  
 
rabbitmountain
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


Personally I'm not waiting for a high res 1D series body. Where I shoot the 5DsR there is no need for additional durability or features. But that's just me.
The battery grip for the 5DsR and 5D3 (same model) is the first I really like. Great rubbery surface and the unit really feels as one piece to me. No wiggling. And it has the extra multicontroller so I can select AF points in portrait orientation.



Oct 16, 2016 at 08:36 PM
arbitrage
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


I'd say the chance of a high MP 1 series body is about 0.01%. Does anyone really think Canon will make a new 1Ds?? Seriously??




Oct 16, 2016 at 10:53 PM
Flowernut
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


rabbitmountain wrote:
Like I said in another topic the advantage of being able to use 61 AF points with f/8 combos on the 5D4 is almost entirely compensated by the higher resolution of the 5DsR. In other words, you could take off the 1.4x extender and shoot the bare lens on the 5DsR and have all 61 AF points. Or mount a 1.4x instead of a 2x.

Preview blackout and fps of course is another matter. I don't think 7 fps vs 5 fps is a world of difference but yes it's a difference.

I believe at the end of the day
...Show more

Can't afford to carry too many bodies but I do need a backup. Hadn't thought of the 1.4x gambit and cropping. I think that I will end up with one of each in my life.




Oct 17, 2016 at 01:19 AM
Flowernut
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


According to the digital picture, you can get 36 frames in the buffer with a top level compact flash card before the mark iv slows to 4.4 fps. the 5ds is 17-18 frames. The way I interpret his comments after that 1 or 2 frames a 1fps. This is real life which exceeds canon specifications.


Oct 17, 2016 at 01:30 AM
arbitrage
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


rabbitmountain wrote:
Hi Geoff,

Yes absolutely. 5DsR higher ISO shots only hold up to 5D3 noise levels if sized down to 21mp. So you can't have your cake and eat it too, I mean it's either higher ISO full image or low ISO cropped.

Did you already pick up the 5D4 or are you still debating purchase?

I use a BG for my 5DsR and I have two batteries. When I load two fully charged batteries in the grip, I never have slowdown issues.

Whether or not the 5D4 can be a good second camera for a 5DsR user really depends on how badly you want
...Show more

For now I'm sticking with 1DX2 and 5DSR. I was having a bit of a debate with myself if swapping 5DSR for 5D4 would make sense. I'm still not sure but I only purchased 5DSR in May and selling now would be a substantial loss and the 5D4 is about the same price new so it would have to make sense in all ways and right now I'm torn so will likely stay put.



Oct 17, 2016 at 01:35 AM
stanj
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


I have found both the 1DX2 and 5DSR to be a bit extreme on the two ends: the 1DX2 is great when I need to kill my own dinner, and of course for high frame rate; the 5DSR is great for waterfalls and buildings, but doesn't shoot 4K. Neither is particularly suitable for a kid party. So I added the 5D4 to the lineup as the "sensible middle point". First world problem, I know. I think if I could have only one it would still be the 5DSR.


Oct 17, 2016 at 02:01 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


stanj wrote:
I think if I could have only one it would still be the 5DSR.

That is remarkable. May I ask why? I have the 5DsR and you may make me save 6000 if I cancel my 1Dx2 order.



Oct 17, 2016 at 02:09 AM
EB-1
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


stanj wrote:
I have found both the 1DX2 and 5DSR to be a bit extreme on the two ends: the 1DX2 is great when I need to kill my own dinner, and of course for high frame rate; the 5DSR is great for waterfalls and buildings, but doesn't shoot 4K. Neither is particularly suitable for a kid party. So I added the 5D4 to the lineup as the "sensible middle point". First world problem, I know. I think if I could have only one it would still be the 5DSR.


Yeah, I added the 5D IV as well as a gap filler. Are you using it a fair amount instead of the 1DX II?

EBH



Oct 17, 2016 at 03:26 AM
stanj
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


stanj wrote:
I think if I could have only one it would still be the 5DSR.

rabbitmountain wrote:
That is remarkable. May I ask why? I have the 5DsR and you may make me save 6000 if I cancel my 1Dx2 order.


Depends on your application, of course. If you shoot pro baseball, then maybe stick with the 1DX2 order

This is solely based on my usage pattern. Trip to Ireland? 9/10 5DSR. Safari in Botswana? 2/3 5DSR. Trip to the north pole? 9/10 5DSR.

The frame rate is the same as my 1Ds3 used to be, which was fine even for most sports. The files are fine, although holding Lightroom in a chokehold (that's more about Lightroom than about the camera, though). The files are very future proof at 8.8k resolution, while the 1DX2 really struggles in that regard. The buffer isn't something to write home about, but it got the job done when chasing wildlife from the helicopter. The MJPEG encoding of the 4K60 video is insane, so you need to transcode it or you need to buy a file server (which is what I did). The 1DX2 now really only sees use shooting kid sports, and represents probably the most frivolous purchase of this decade.YMMV.



Oct 17, 2016 at 05:08 AM
dgdg
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


Preliminary testing, referenced here on FM, suggest the 5div long exposure noise (4min) is a little better than the 5Diii which is good. The 5DSR is significantly worse which means I won't use it with my star tracker at night. I do enjoy one night with the stars on a trip.
As Geoff said, one camera doesn't do it all. How many can we fit or want to have in our bag for the optimal IQ in every scenario?



Oct 17, 2016 at 11:31 AM
 

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alundeb
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


dgdg wrote:
... than the 5Diii which is good. The 5DSR is significantly worse....


In what test do you see that? The 300 seconds exposures with the 5DS R seem almost identical to the 5DIII in 100% crops and better at normalized size.



Oct 17, 2016 at 12:10 PM
mathemaphoto
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


here's my quick two cents... i own both the iv and the R, so take that for what it's worth.

i view these two cameras as very different tools. i use the R for landscapes and in the studio. i used the iv for everything else. the R has incredible detail, but you need to use at low ISOs. it also doesn't have the best DR, but i can count on one hand the number of times i was in lightroom and said "man, i wish this file had more dynamic range." the iv is kind of a swiss army knife of sorts - a jack of all trades. it's a versatile camera that does a lot of things very well. i would be more than happy using it for landscapes and in the studio if i didn't have the R as well.

one last point... i'm a long, long time canon shooter. and i have to admit, i'm a bit let down by the iv. is it a great camera? of course it is. but when you compare it against the 5d3, it's competition from other brands, and the fact that we waited 4 years for the camera - it's a pretty big letdown.

i think its biggest weakness is that it does a little bit of everything, but nothing all that well. is it a still image camera that also takes video? is it a video camera that also takes stills? after using the camera quite a bit and looking at the specs, it's really unclear. i'm sure the wedding pros will love this camera... but the rest of us are scratching our heads a bit. there's features absent from this camera that just boggle my mind.

the biggest problem in the camera industry right now is keeping your customers from jumping to another brand - and i don't think canon did themselves any favors with this camera.



Oct 17, 2016 at 01:16 PM
dgdg
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


alundeb wrote:
In what test do you see that? The 300 seconds exposures with the 5DS R seem almost identical to the 5DIII in 100% crops and better at normalized size.


I'd have to dig around since I didn't save the links which looked at the 5DSR and A7R2 which I considered upgrading to. The tests appeared well done and others on FM, including Fred, appeared to accept them. When I rented the 5DSR a couple years ago I didn't have a chance to test it myself. It was second hand information, but was good enough for me to base a decision. Would love to have the results proven wrong.




Oct 17, 2016 at 01:35 PM
alundeb
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


dgdg wrote:
I'd have to dig around since I didn't save the links which looked at the 5DSR and A7R2 which I considered upgrading to. The tests appeared well done and others on FM, including Fred, appeared to accept them. When I rented the 5DSR a couple years ago I didn't have a chance to test it myself. It was second hand information, but was good enough for me to base a decision. Would love to have the results proven wrong.



I understand. Different tests can give different results, i was just wondering if you interpreted the tests from this link differently:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1455339/0#13763460

I am using the 5DS R for long exposures at ISO 100 (not star trails though) and use 10 minutes expsoure without LENR. At 15 minutes I prefer ISO 50 or very good exposures at ISO 100.

High ISO long exposures are somewhat different, in many cases even the higher general read noise from the 5DS R can show up before long expsoure thermal noise from other cameras.




Oct 17, 2016 at 01:42 PM
EB-1
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


arbitrage wrote:
I'd say the chance of a high MP 1 series body is about 0.01%. Does anyone really think Canon will make a new 1Ds?? Seriously??


Sadly, no. I would buy one in a minute if the FPS and AF could be increased beyond the 5D limits.

EBH



Oct 20, 2016 at 12:04 AM
SoundHound
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


You really need carefully controlled conditions to get all the detail that a 50 mP sensor is capable of.
Yes, it is true that you get 50 mP images with a 5Ds(r) but not always all the resolution that a 50 mP sensor is capable of. Previously noted is that you lose resolution to high(er) ISO noise. Other detail compromising situations are motion blur from the subject or a less than optimal body/lens support, etc.

So, for some shooters, they could just enlarge (bi cubic sharper in Photoshop) from 30 to 50 mP the few images that might need to be printed large (or severely cropped and enlarged). This way they have 50 mP output of those few images that need it without processing/storing all 50 mP files.



Oct 21, 2016 at 10:29 AM
NCAndy
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


I just ordered a 5D4. I demo'd a 5DSr and really liked the camera, and I might pick one up used in a year or so. But I think the 5D4 will be a better overall camera for me at this time. I don't print larger than A3+ and while I can print at home to 17" I don't very often if ever. For the type work I've been doing lately, the 5D4 is more versatile. I think Canon did a great job from a marketing standpoint with positioning these cameras. Reading the threads and comments about people having a hard time deciding between the 5D4 and 5DSr means to me they hit the market right where it hurts, in the wallet.


Oct 21, 2016 at 02:02 PM
Jeff Simpson
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


the 5dIV is absolutely a replacement for the 5ds/5dsR if you do not print large regularly, or sell large prints regularly. you could have a 200mp camera but if you don't use those pixels, there's no point.

I would even argue the better IQ/DR/ISO of the 5dIV could be more beneficial (editing wise) than the added MP of the 5ds/r even if you do print.



Oct 21, 2016 at 02:52 PM
rabbitmountain
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


SoundHound wrote:
You really need carefully controlled conditions to get all the detail that a 50 mP sensor is capable of.
Yes, it is true that you get 50 mP images with a 5Ds(r) but not always all the resolution that a 50 mP sensor is capable of.


Exactly. Not always. And you don't need to get it always if your shooting needs are like mine. I use the 50mp in suitable conditions when I need them and I use it as normal FF body for everything else. For zero to mild cropping the detail, high ISO noise and DR are comparable to the 5D3 I had before the R. I can shoot kids sports at ISO 6400 @ 5fps and get away with it as long as I remember to frame tightly while shooting. With this camera, thinking ahead can make it usable for most any type of subject.
I need a second body soon and as I had second thoughts about the 1Dx2, the 5D4 may fit the bill nicely. Silent shutter, good high ISO noise and more MP than I need.

There may be competition from other brands as pointed out above, but I only look at canon so I can use my glass easily and effectively. It's either take it or leave it. Even a 5D3 would make a sufficient second camera I think but the advancements do look enticing.



Oct 21, 2016 at 02:52 PM
Jeff Simpson
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · 5d iv replacement for 5dsR?


rabbitmountain wrote:
Exactly. Not always. And you don't need to get it always if your shooting needs are like mine. I use the 50mp in suitable conditions when I need them and I use it as normal FF body for everything else. For zero to mild cropping the detail, high ISO noise and DR are comparable to the 5D3 I had before the R. I can shoot kids sports at ISO 6400 @ 5fps and get away with it as long as I remember to frame tightly while shooting. With this camera, thinking ahead can make it usable for most any type
...Show more

The high ISO noise was cleaned up (no banding) and the DR noticeably increased with the R. Def not comparable to the 5d3. However, the 5d3 noise/DR is comparable to the 5d2.



Oct 21, 2016 at 04:11 PM
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