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Archive 2016 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R

  
 
robgo2
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


I am wondering about version 2 of this lens. What are its strengths and weaknesses? How does it stack up against other lenses in the same focal length range, in particular the C/Y 180/2.8? The Leica APO version is not under consideration.

Thanks,
Rob



Jun 18, 2016 at 11:19 PM
naturephoto1
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


Hu Rob,

The Version 2 of the Leica R 180mm f2.8 was a substantial improvement over the performance of the original V1. The V1 was no where as good as the Leica R 180mm f3.4 Apo Telyt. The V2 was not as good a performer as the f3.4 Apo Telyt either, but it was about 1/2 stop faster. Without question the Apo version of V2 was the best performing 180mm f2.8 but was quite expensive.

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/index.php/180mm_f/2.8_Elmarit-R_I

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/index.php/180mm_f/2.8_Elmarit-R_II

Rich



Jun 18, 2016 at 11:49 PM
jankap
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


In the "Leica compendium" Erwin Puts comments all 180´s (and many more).
It is available in a version (no pictures) for downloading.
Jan



Jun 19, 2016 at 01:36 AM
jankap
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


You mean this one?
Jan
2.8/180, Elmarit-R,1980
The earlier version of this lens was a heavy-weight with 1300 grams. This redesign is
reduced in weight through the use of newer glass of anomalous dispersion and other
measures for weight reduction. At full aperture the lens delivers medium contrast
and coarse detail is rendered with clean edges over the whole image area, with the
corners being even better than the centre. Overall the performance is equal to that of
the replacement lens. Vignetting is slightly higher at 1 stop. Stopping down to 1:4
improves the contrast, but brings only marginal better definition of fine detail. From
1:4, image quality does improve very slowly, with an improved definition of very fine
detail on axis and a reduction of contrast in the field. Here one sees the effect of the
residual chromatic aberrations. Distortion is visible in the outer zones. This lens has
also improved performance at closer distances. The improvement in image quality
has been made possible by a reduction of lateral chromatic errors and the chromatic
version of astigmatism, which points already in the direction of the apochromat. Not
well-known is the thermic problem. Bigger glass elements, which are cemented or
tightly contained in a mount, will expand substantially when heated. The earlier
prototypes had some trouble here, as the glass has a tendency to crack due to
different thermal expansion coefficients. A careful selection of glass types is needed
to tackle this problem, which has relevance for all large lenses, which are cemented.



Jun 19, 2016 at 01:44 AM
jankap
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


The 3.4/180mm is in the theory much better. Theory, because the MTF curves are calculated at infinity.
So perhaps not in the close focus range.
It was very useful on a Safari tour, also with the 2-extender.
The half stop less is not very good, when you use film. But with a digital camera, who cares.
Jan



Jun 19, 2016 at 01:55 AM
Peire
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


I don't see that much difference between 180/2.8 v2 and Apo 180/3.4.The Apo tend to have less CA wo and has arguably more "Leica" colour rendition at wider apertures,but from f5.6 it is difficult to tell them apart IMO.

Elmarit R 180/2.8 v2 is a very good lens with typical Leica output.It has some minor flaws shared with all fast tele lenses of that time,but nothing to complain about really.It is decently sharp wide open and very sharp stopped down,colours are deep,vibrant and well saturated.Contrast is very good/excellent.There are some CA wide open,but not disturbing and easily removable in PP.

C/Y Sonnar 180/2.8 is similar somehow to ít's Leica counterpart.It has very similar characteristic,but colours and microcontrast are on the Zeiss side.Same story with the CA.

Both C/Y 180/2.8 and Elmarit R 180/2.8 v2 are very good/excellent lenses with character worth having.Chose one depending on whether you prefer Leica or Zeiss,but having either of them is nicer.



Jun 19, 2016 at 02:20 AM
robgo2
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


Peire wrote:
C/Y Sonnar 180/2.8 is similar somehow to ít's Leica counterpart.It has very similar characteristic,but colours and microcontrast are on the Zeiss side.Same story with the CA.

Both C/Y 180/2.8 and Elmarit R 180/2.8 v2 are very good/excellent lenses with character worth having.Chose one depending on whether you prefer Leica or Zeiss,but having either of them is nicer.


Here's my situation. I currently own the C/Y 180/2.8. Overall, I think it is a terrific lens. I love its rendering and rich colors. Center sharpness is good wide open. The problem is that edges and corners remain soft all the way up to f11. This doesn't matter much unless I am trying to isolate something in a landscape. So, my question is whether the 180/2.8 Elmarit R-II will perform better in this regard.

Rob



Jun 19, 2016 at 12:11 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


The short answer is yes, unlike the CY, the vII Elmarit gets better in the corners and edges stopped down for landscape. If you look at the MTF's for the Sonnar, the astigmatism at the edges actually gets worse stopped down (although I do remember having a discussion on these boards in which another member argued that it was CA, not astigmatism). Whatever the case, with the Elmarit, you should see some improvement in landscapes, but you will also see some close-focus differences that may not be to your liking.

Close focus samples with the Elmarit and some zoo birds...

a7II_Elmarit180_BirdHouse2 by Bradley Clemens, on Flickr



a7II_Elmarit180_BirdHouse1 by Bradley Clemens, on Flickr



a7II_Elmarit180_Sam by Bradley Clemens, on Flickr



Jun 19, 2016 at 01:20 PM
robgo2
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


freaklikeme wrote:
The short answer is yes, unlike the CY, the vII Elmarit gets better in the corners and edges stopped down for landscape. If you look at the MTF's for the Sonnar, the astigmatism at the edges actually gets worse stopped down (although I do remember having a discussion on these boards in which another member argued that it was CA, not astigmatism). Whatever the case, with the Elmarit, you should see some improvement in landscapes, but you will also see some close-focus differences that may not be to your liking.



Thanks for the comments and the sample images. I presume that the close focus differences that you are referring to are the circular bokeh highlights. All I can say is that there is no perfect lens. They all involve tradeoffs of some kind. As someone mentioned previously, it would be nice to have both lenses.

Rob




Jun 19, 2016 at 01:33 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Opinions wanted on the Leica 180/2.8 Elmarit-R


robgo2 wrote:
Thanks for the comments and the sample images. I presume that the close focus differences that you are referring to are the circular bokeh highlights. All I can say is that there is no perfect lens. They all involve tradeoffs of some kind. As someone mentioned previously, it would be nice to have both lenses.

Rob



My pleasure, and I agree, but informed consent means you're not giving up something that matters to you more than what you're trying to gain. If you decide to go with the Elmarit, and don't already own the C/Y Sonnar 135/2.8, consider picking that up at some point. It's got all the bokeh-charm of the 180 without the problems.



Jun 19, 2016 at 02:18 PM





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