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Archive 2016 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)

  
 
Sierra Hotel
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Received my 200-400 F/4 yesterday just in time for my grandson's LL playoff game. I was able to stay for only two innings due to work, but apparently it was a great game, with his team falling 13-11. The lens is a beast as everyone states, but it is incredible. I find it a little soft wide open at 400mm, and I slapped my 1.4TC on it which further softened it a bit, but some of it is due to my needing to improve my long lens technique. Here's a few shots from the game, and while not maybe a great baseball shot, I love the facial expressions you get from kids at this age, which to me is the real story to be told in LL photos..

1. Uncropped, slight pp. Sloppy composition as I cut his feet off
2. 20% crop to edit out pitching machine electric cable.
3. Technically not a great photo, but i love the expression on the catcher's face and the fact that the batters eyes are closed, despite the fact that he really walloped the ball shown in the upper right.
4. This kid always has a great facial expression. He's not a bad hitter either . . .

On Edit: C&C always welcome



© Sierra Hotel 2016


Nikon D700 ISO 400 Nikkor 200-400mm f/4VR 380mm f/5 1/2500





© Sierra Hotel 2016


Nikon D700 ISO 400 Nikkor 200-400mm f/4VR 360mm f/5 1/2000







Nikon D700 ISO 640 Nikkor 200-400mm f/4VR 400mm f/5 1/2000







Nikon D700 ISO 400 Nikkor 200-400mm f/4VR 400mm f/5 1/1250




May 15, 2016 at 11:32 AM
P Alesse
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


1... gonna want to sit on the ground to get those eyes. Ball needs to be closer to glove and shoot tighter to allow that tighter crop. Nice light.

2...ball closer to glove to allow for the tighter crop.

3... nice angle but we will need something more compelling here. Batter's eyes being closed and catcher's expression are not compelling. This is typical. It happens all the time.

4... avoid posting swing and miss shots as they rarely work unless something REALLY special is going on. Background spectators are also not helping.



May 15, 2016 at 12:26 PM
P Alesse
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


BTW... whose go pro is that?


May 15, 2016 at 12:29 PM
Sierra Hotel
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Paul, thanks for the comments, as always, spot on. The field is what it is for this year, next year I hope they move to backstops screening the spectators out. #4 the youngster actually hit the ball, but it's tough to tell from the shot.

The go-pro belongs to the coach - he actually has three or four posted around the field . . for 7 year-olds!

Again, thanks. It's folks like you, Tim, and others on the MA2A thread that brought me right back to FM.

Cheers,

John



May 15, 2016 at 12:37 PM
John Skinner
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


I'm going to comment a bit on the technical side of this instead of comp and other obvious issues as stated.

The reason is, the 200-400 is a main stay here. I have used this lens (both versions) on everything from a D2xs on up D3 D3s D4 D4s and D5.

After all of those years, some things stick out. You're one of those fellas that will need to fine tune this lens to that body at a varying focal lengths, and then find a 'happy place' for the 200 +/- to the 400 end range. That body should be producing far sharper images than shown here. And no.. do not believe all that hype about this lens being notoriously soft. It's pure bunk.

The process ahead of you is not for the faint of heart though. It will take some hours to work all of that out. But you'll have much better action with it should you undertake that.

As a side note: I don't know if you're a Lr or Ps guy. Myself? Lr does not belong on computers. It's just IMO kinda thing.

So my tip would be this.

After a RAW output has been established, and the image opens in Ps, rasterize the layer, CNTL J to dupe it, FILTERS -- OTHER -- HIGH PASS, and apply about 1.7 to 2.2 on that layer -- OK.

Change the blend mode on THAT -- now high passed layer to either VIVID, or HARD light, and dial back the opacity if you feel the need. This adds a nice crispy duck to those edges, and has served me pretty well for 8 or so years working with this lens model.

Again... your mileage may vary, but I've seen a lot of these images off of this glass with a huge assortment of bodies attached. And as always, this is just MY way -- not the ONLY way of doing things. It's all what YOU like and what works for YOU. I'm just some old fart from Canada.

Best of luck with your new combo.. and enjoy the zoom zoom.



May 16, 2016 at 08:37 PM
Corillien
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Not to derail the thread, but just curious John, does this yield results that are any better than using something like unsharp mask?


May 16, 2016 at 08:55 PM
guitardirky
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Corillien wrote:
Not to derail the thread, but just curious John, does this yield results that are any better than using something like unsharp mask?


A high pass filter is pretty much an unsharp mask. It sharpens edges. No different than using the Alt/Opt plus the slider for masking in Lightroom.



May 16, 2016 at 09:17 PM
Sierra Hotel
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Thanks John, I'll give your method a try. I have been a LR guy, but am perfectly willing to delve into PS. To be clear- any "softness" arising from my use of this lens is likely attributable to the loose nut behind the ca,era and poor technique,

I've seen what the lens can do in the hands of the skilled, and that has set the bar. Someday, I hope to attain and clear that bar,

Thanks for the feedback!



May 16, 2016 at 10:34 PM
John Skinner
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Corillien wrote:
Not to derail the thread, but just curious John, does this yield results that are any better than using something like unsharp mask?


Users of Ps and their workflows are like Aholes.. Everybody has a way, and everybody thinks the others stink.

More on point. Having been a NAPP member for 7 years with a slew of PSW under the belt. Along with S I's Peter Read Millers camps, working with S I's Damian Strohmeyer, and a few other heavy hitters, I have taken a lot of things into account when it come to people saying 'works just like' in the workflow end of Ps.

This is why I will always, usually say.."This is MY way -- not the ONLY way" to do it.

I find that using the high pass on a PSD is non-destructive and gives me the ability to add a mask, reduce the amount even after application, and choices in blend modes which can change up the outcome.. and few other little things I prefer over unsharp. I mean lets face it here. We are very very limited in how and what we are allowed to do to a journalistic or sports image. I've got between 13 and 17 MP to get the very best image I can produce. So any little tip coming from the likes of Corey Barker, Read Miller at his workshops etc.. Goes a long way with me when I see the results I PERSONALLY like to put out. This not to say my way is best or only way, it's just me, and 10 years of hard study to try and make images. I use other methods in other types of images. Such a frequency sharpening, and inverted unsharp mask. Again, this and these comments more specifically were used in the "Sports" section, as this method I M O only, works best on sports images.

Just as in ISO noise. Years ago I would have spent a lot on things like Noiseware (which I did) and used for a long time. With advances in ACR, I have zero need for that. With the slider and masking in ACR, it does it all now. So things change as the time passes. To each his own !

You guys don't do anything different, I weep seeing the images on this part of this forum. Some of these images and image makers are the very best Nikon shooters full stop. They may not be employed doing it, but they dam sure could be.



May 17, 2016 at 12:45 AM
Vcook
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


great feedback here, good CC.

I'll be the positive guy and point out that these are 1000x better than any parent could get with their iphone through the fence and they'd be stoked to get them. #2 is the strongest. The unfortunate crop in 1 detracts from an otherwise great capture. I love 4 but it's not clear that the ball is coming off the bat and not a strike.



May 17, 2016 at 08:29 AM
guitardirky
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


John Skinner wrote:
I find that using the high pass on a PSD is non-destructive and gives me the ability to add a mask, reduce the amount even after application, and choices in blend modes which can change up the outcome.. and few other little things I prefer over unsharp. I mean lets face it here. We are very very limited in how and what we are allowed to do to a journalistic or sports image.

With the slider and masking in ACR, it does it all now. So things change as the time passes. To each his own !




If ACR and Lightroom do it all then what is the use in doing all the extra time consuming steps in a PSD? If you are shooting RAW, you are already working in a non destructive workflow.



May 17, 2016 at 08:40 AM
John Skinner
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


guitardirky wrote:
If ACR and Lightroom do it all then what is the use in doing all the extra time consuming steps in a PSD? If you are shooting RAW, you are already working in a non destructive workflow.


Gee.. maybe because I can save my layers? And the dam adjustments in Lr are like hauling around cement bucket brush inside Lr. It's just too clunky for me. And don't get me going on importing to catalogs.


Edited on May 18, 2016 at 01:56 PM · View previous versions



May 17, 2016 at 01:31 PM
mikeinctown
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


I don't care what anyone says those are great shots, if for nothing else than their facial expressions and just how small they are. I think sometimes people (myself included) get caught up in going through the checklist of things to not do or do and completely miss the big picture.


May 17, 2016 at 10:11 PM
ThePictureGuy
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Most of these expressions are priceless indeed. Wonder if a tighter crop on them would help, even if you lose the ball in #3, you highlight the expressions?


May 17, 2016 at 11:40 PM
Sierra Hotel
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · First outing with 200-400mm f/4 LL Baseball (little guys!)


Thanks to everyone for the comments. I'm traveling on business right now, but will play around with John S.'s suggestion - I'm always looking for ways to improve. fWIW, I used to process everything in Ps, but the workflow is slow when running through dozens, sometimes hundreds, and even thousands of images.

John



May 19, 2016 at 06:33 AM





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