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Archive 2016 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?

  
 
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Sorry if this is too stupid a question! I have no idea how to achieve the skin tone I see in monochrome fine art photos. In those photos skin tone looks very "clean" almost like a painting. But in my photos skin tone is "dirty grey", like the color of lead. (I sometimes have this problem with outdoor available light photos as well.)

I use a flash and umbrella. Would a soft light box give better results? Also to what extent does postproduction help?



Mar 24, 2016 at 08:08 PM
nolaguy
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Examples would help and what post production software are you currently using?



Mar 24, 2016 at 08:52 PM
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


You mean example of my own photos? I use Capture 1 Pro with GIMP although I'm new to C1.


Mar 24, 2016 at 10:06 PM
myam203
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Examples of what you're trying to achieve—other people's fine art photos.


Mar 24, 2016 at 10:10 PM
nolaguy
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


And your own photos. We can imagine what you're describing but more effective to see the result you're getting.

My best guess is you may be experiencing some underexposure and shortage of contrast.




Mar 24, 2016 at 10:24 PM
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


OK here is an example by Tom Lanzrath

http://www.cruzine.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/059-fine-art-nude.jpg


It has just good contrast. Many more here (some NSFW): http://www.uazone.org/friends/selfdev/aubade/aubade_les_lesons.html

Here is an available light street shot: https://www.flickr.com/photos/126822788@N08/22987676464/in/dateposted/

All of them have such good contrast and are kind of "clean". Now here is a crop of a photo that I took with flash and then edited in C1 (played with the black and white color mixer quite a bit):

http://s11.postimg.org/xje3h1j77/DSC_square.jpg


As you see it looks washed out, not much contrast and skin looks kind of "dirty gray".



Mar 25, 2016 at 06:04 AM
Mark_L
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


From most important to least:

Hire a great makeup artist
Don't underexpose
Use more contrasty light
Boost the orange/red in the b&w conversion
Frequency separation retouching to even out the skin



Mar 25, 2016 at 06:31 AM
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Thanks. More contrasty light like a strobe? In that photo the umbrella was some 10 ft away from her face. My bad!

Make up artist for the looks or does makeup affect contrast??



Mar 25, 2016 at 07:00 AM
Mark_L
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


pixlepeeper wrote:
Thanks. More contrasty light like a strobe? In that photo the umbrella was some 10 ft away from her face. My bad!

Make up artist for the looks or does makeup affect contrast??


Good makeup gives a really nice even response to light since it is designed for photography and film. It is hard to describe but often that is the key to so many great looking beauty shots you see.

Bring the umbrella in closer and make sure no light from it is spilling onto other reflective surfaces and any ambient light is knocked out. This can be very hard with umbrellas so a softbox is often a better bet (especially gridded) then you'll get the deeper shadows and contrast.



Mar 25, 2016 at 08:24 AM
hijazist
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


It looks washed out because you're using key, fill and there is a lot of spill in the room. In other words, there is no directionality nor control over the light. This means that you won't have much contrast in the picture. The type of modifier also affects the contrast levels, a beauty dish provides harder light than an umbrella (all things considered).

The picture from Lanzrath was taken with one light (most likely gridded beauty dish ). I'm also positive that he used black panels for negative fill. Maybe there's a background light but it just could be the spill from his key light.

Finally, there's tons of dodging & burning in PS.

pixlepeeper wrote:

OK here is an example by Tom Lanzrath

http://www.cruzine.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/059-fine-art-nude.jpg


It has just good contrast. Many more here (some NSFW): http://www.uazone.org/friends/selfdev/aubade/aubade_les_lesons.html

Here is an available light street shot: https://www.flickr.com/photos/126822788@N08/22987676464/in/dateposted/

All of them have such good contrast and are kind of "clean". Now here is a crop of a photo that I took with flash and then edited in C1 (played with the black and white color mixer quite a bit):

http://s11.postimg.org/xje3h1j77/DSC_square.jpg


As you see it looks washed out, not much contrast and skin looks kind of "dirty gray".




Mar 25, 2016 at 08:32 AM
tcphoto
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


A great knowledge of lighting is the base of a good career, add to that an understanding of editing and you may become more successful. A good Makeup Artist can make an average subject look beautiful, so you may want to introduce yourself to your community of creatives.


Mar 25, 2016 at 08:50 AM
PhilF
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


the problem there is your lighting.(base on your example).

easy way route is using Nik Silver Efex Pro 2

here's an edit I did... REALLY clean the skin first before you start the conversion and tweaking in black and white

BEFORE


AFTER



Mar 25, 2016 at 12:05 PM
nolaguy
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


pixlepeeper wrote:
All of them have such good contrast and are kind of "clean". Now here is a crop of a photo that I took with flash and then edited in C1 (played with the black and white color mixer quite a bit):

As you see it looks washed out, not much contrast and skin looks kind of "dirty gray".



Did it look like this straight out of the camera? To me the muddy look seems to have happened in editing.

The second image below has a few quick adjustments in LR - not as dramatic a result as what you seem to want to achieve but more natural than your example, I think.







Your original







A few LR edits




Mar 27, 2016 at 01:10 PM
hijazist
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Experiment with the use of different modifiers, grids, etc... A shoot through umbrella has its place, but it gives you zero control over your light. Get a softbox, octabank, or a beauty dish. Learn PS techniques like d&b, Frequency separation, level & curve adjustments, etc... There are plenty books of tutorials online. I am learning new stuff everyday and I feel that I still haven't scratched the surface.













Mar 27, 2016 at 02:04 PM
kaplah
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


hijazist wrote:
Frequency separation,


Since our OP uses GIMP, he can google "wavelet decomposition gimp skin patdavid"



Mar 28, 2016 at 11:27 AM
Javier Munoz
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


Did I hear http://www.amazon.com/Light-Science-Magic-Introduction-Photographic/dp/0240812255 ?
The best 20-25 USD you will ever expend.



Mar 28, 2016 at 12:46 PM
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


nolaguy: Yeah it was more or less like that out of camera. Mostly because I used a strong fill flash I guess.

hijazist: Why does an umbrella give zero control over lighting? When I was first thinking of setting up a little studio I was thinking of getting a softbox but then I was told they didn't provide much light and flash would be a better option.

Javier Munoz: Yeah that's an amazing book. I'm at the beginning yet.



Mar 29, 2016 at 07:18 AM
pixlepeeper
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


And out of curiosity, How do strobes like Gemini or Paul Buff compare to softboxes and beauty dishes?


Mar 29, 2016 at 09:18 AM
pjbuehner
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


You are confusing things.
Softboxes and beauty dishes are light modifiers while Strobes are the light source.

I feaer that you are getting way ahead of yourself which can become overwhelming. Post-processing and editing are crucial parts of every competent photographers workflow but focusing on that would be putting the cart ahead of the horse and it would actually hurt your skills. My suggestion:

first
make sure that you have fully wrapped your head around exposure and the triangle of shutter speed, aperture, and ISO
then
Take lots of natural light photos and critique the crap out of them
then
get a reflector and practice using that to control natural light
then
go to youtube and search for lighting tutorials and study the crap out of them
then
get a flash or strobe and one umbrella and practice the crap out of it
then
Move on to two lights, etc

Slow and steady. If you can learn to see natural light and work with it, you are going to have a much much easier time of moving to artificial lighting. If you don't, it is a bit out of sequence and will make learning more difficult.
Just my opinion. good luck!



Mar 29, 2016 at 10:01 AM
Javier Munoz
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · How to achieve fine art skin tone?


pixlepeeper wrote:
nolaguy: Yeah it was more or less like that out of camera. Mostly because I used a strong fill flash I guess.

hijazist: Why does an umbrella give zero control over lighting? When I was first thinking of setting up a little studio I was thinking of getting a softbox but then I was told they didn't provide much light and flash would be a better option.

Javier Munoz: Yeah that's an amazing book. I'm at the beginning yet.


You need a light source with the umbrella (or any other light modifier). It can be a continuous light source, flash, sun, etc)

I recommend you reading the book first and then ask. You will understand the replies much better.

BTW, do not get discouraged if you dont get to Tom's level right away. It takes time and practice to get there...

I apologize in advance if it sounds patronizing, it is not my intention



Mar 29, 2016 at 11:27 AM
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