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Archive 2016 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?

  
 
Herb
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Will the new camera be able to use a regular CF card in the CFAST slot? This way you have two CF cards being written to?

Thoughts on how this slot might be used?



Feb 07, 2016 at 03:06 AM
EB-1
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Herb wrote:
Will the new camera be able to use a regular CF card in the CFAST slot? This way you have two CF cards being written to?

Thoughts on how this slot might be used?


The CF and CFast pinouts are different. One would expect the case/keying not to allow the insertion of a CF card into a CFast slot.

EBH



Feb 07, 2016 at 03:12 AM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Should be dual CF Fast slots - do an Apple on buyers - force them to update to the newer tech.


Feb 07, 2016 at 03:22 AM
JaimitoFrog
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


CFast card ports don't have pins. Wont get bent pins.

At 1:50 mark, you can see the cards side by side. Even the grooves/guides on the side are opposite. You cannot mistakenly stick a CF into a CFast, or vice versa. Good design.





Feb 07, 2016 at 03:24 AM
dolina
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Paul Mo wrote:
Should be dual CF Fast slots - do an Apple on buyers - force them to update to the newer tech.

The change over is not without cause.

CFast's data transfer limit is 600MB/s (4000x)
CF data transfer limit is 167MB/s (1113x)

The faster card will allow for higher bitrate 4K resolution video without compression, longer burst rate of 170 RAWs or unlimited Large JPEG until full at a larger MP.

I think the change over should have been made in 2012 with the 1D X and 5D Mark IV like how Nikon did it with the D4. Or last year with the 5Ds and 7D Mark II. All those bodies would have benefited with a faster memory card.

A better implementation would be Nikon D5. Nikon allowed a part swap for a module that support dual CF card or dual XQD card.

Hopefully they will use CFast with the 5D Mark V and 5Ds Mark II.

http://www.lemondedelaphoto.com/local/cache-vignettes/L510xH225/cfas_vs_cf_510-907e5.jpg

Above are the interfaces of CFast (bottom) and CF (top).

If Canon was Apple then the 1D X should have a USB-C port.

I expect total phaseout of CF slots by 2020 with CFast 2.0 and SDXC UHS-II cards taking center stage. By then memory cards would cost $100 for 256GB.

Edited on Feb 07, 2016 at 12:17 PM · View previous versions



Feb 07, 2016 at 03:43 AM
Herb
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Other than picking up speed, having two different cards feels like the CF and the SD slots of earlier 1D cards.....


Feb 07, 2016 at 09:52 AM
dolina
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


To be honest I really hated the inclusion of SD slots. I do understand that in case of emergencies it is easier to source any SD card than any CF card.


Feb 07, 2016 at 01:27 PM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Paul Mo wrote:
Should be dual CF Fast slots - do an Apple on buyers - force them to update to the newer tech.


Sounds like Canon has given you a choice, unlike Apple.



Feb 07, 2016 at 01:36 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


As with any decision there are pros and cons of Canon's decision to go with mixed slots on the 1DX MKII.

Pros:
Buyers aren't forced to change over all their CF cards and purchase a whole replacement line of C-Fast cards.

Cons:
Anyone wanting to shoot to two cards is immediately downgraded to the CF specs (like 73 RAW buffer vs 170)
Having to carry two separate card readers on travel or assignment
Having to purchase at least one new C-Fast card (likely more) if you want to shoot 4K video and/or shoot to dual cards.

Other thoughts:
Nikon already went through this phase with D4 and D4s....my understanding is most people weren't in favour of that move.
Nikon now went the correct route with having a choice of dual CF or dual XQD...also service swappable if you change your mind later (at a cost).
It seems that in most markets ( at least in N.A.), Canon is basically giving away a 64GB C-Fast card and reader if you are an early adopter to the new camera.

My personal opinion based on my needs:
I originally thought the best option would be to go to dual C-Fast slots mainly because I was hoping it would be required to push maybe 24MPs at 14FPS as the earlier rumours suggested. I have much preferred having two CF cards in my 1DX vs the mixed slots of 7D2 and 5D3(5D3 was terrible).

After seeing the actual specs for the 1DX2, I would have opted for dual CF slots as 73 RAW buffer is easily enough for me and I don't intend to use the video features very much.

I own a bunch of 32GB 1000x CF cards and prefer that capacity. If i preorder I will get a 64GB C-Fast card and reader that in Canada is almost a $400 value. For me that is like getting 2 32GB cards for the C-Fast slot and usually that is all I need for any given day out shooting. Currently I bring 4 32GB CF cards and shoot mirrored. Now I would bring 2 32GB CF cards and the "Free" 64GB C-Fast card. So in the end, Canon's decision works okay for me but only because I get the free card. Without the free card I would have been happier with 2 CF slots.



Feb 07, 2016 at 01:48 PM
Herb
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


I like to write to both cards so I have a back up. I don't worry about losing photos....I have dual 128gb cards I stuff in my 1Dx.....I realize I can do the same here...but it would be nice if they were the same.....that is my point....


Feb 07, 2016 at 01:51 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Herb wrote:
I like to write to both cards so I have a back up. I don't worry about losing photos....I have dual 128gb cards I stuff in my 1Dx.....I realize I can do the same here...but it would be nice if they were the same.....that is my point....


If you are using both slots in the 1DX at the same time (Multiple), then the buffer clearance is reduced from that of a single card anyway. The 1DX II should have a better buffer with two dissimilar cards than the 1DX has with two of the same cards, but we'll have to see test results for the exact numbers.

EBH



Feb 07, 2016 at 01:59 PM
nrferguson
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


arbitrage wrote:
As with any decision there are pros and cons of Canon's decision to go with mixed slots on the 1DX MKII.

So in the end, Canon's decision works okay for me but only because I get the free card. Without the free card I would have been happier with 2 CF slots.


You think Canon is giving you a free card?
Niall




Feb 07, 2016 at 02:34 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


nrferguson wrote:
You think Canon is giving you a free card?
Niall



Seems that way, not sure who is subsidizing the card, could be Canon, could be the retailers, could be Sandisk. But all I know is that if you order a 1DX2 in Canada and the US before the end of June you will get the card and reader included in the regular price (while supplies last). After that it is $300USD extra to get that package.







Feb 07, 2016 at 02:43 PM
dolina
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


If bought separately a 64GB Sandisk CFast card + card reader comes out as $270.

If I were buying a 1D X Mark II I would go with the bundle.

As for who is footing the bill I doubt it is such a big sacrifice with how thick margins are for high end gear.

Be aware that the Sandisk can read up to 515 MB/s and write up to 240 MB/s at $220. Lexar on the other hand can read up to 525 MB/s and write up to 445 MB/s at $190. Cheapest card reader is $50 from Sandisk.

Would anyone know of compatibility of Lexar with the Canon? I read awhile back that Lexar's XQD card had compatibility problems with Nikon.



Feb 07, 2016 at 03:00 PM
CanadaMark
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Every now and then you need to bite the bullet and move up to the latest tech. At some point the manufacturer has to more/less make that decision for you. It sucks at first because there is usually a small cost involved to the consumer, but everyone benefits down the road (faster speeds, cheaper cards when the become more popular, etc.) Holding on to legacy tech too long usually ends up being more of a disadvantage than an advantage, especially when it comes at a performance cost.

This sort of thing happens all the time in various industries, another example is the HDMI standard, digital TV, etc.

Having two different cards with vastly different speeds is pretty dumb (especially with the limitations it introduces), I think they really dropped the ball there. I think this is going to be a deal breaker for some, especially those needing a huge buffer and not wanting to roll the dice with no backup. I wouldn't be surprised if Canon came out with a dual CFast version in a year or so if a bunch of people complain. The D5 allows you to swap dual CFast for dual XQD even after purchase by sending it to Nikon, I wouldn't be surprised if Canon has left some room to do the same down the road.



Feb 07, 2016 at 04:01 PM
Herb
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


EB-1 wrote:
If you are using both slots in the 1DX at the same time (Multiple), then the buffer clearance is reduced from that of a single card anyway. The 1DX II should have a better buffer with two dissimilar cards than the 1DX has with two of the same cards, but we'll have to see test results for the exact numbers.

EBH


When writing to both (mirror) I have only bumped up against the buffer a few times...

Several years ago we had gone to China at Christmas and I had checked before we left to look at some of the photos. I had a micro drive.....you see where this is going....and when I got home the card couldn't be read any more...I was heart broken. Fortunately my wife had photos as did a friend traveling with us.....and I have done everything I can since then to never let that happen again.

With the dual slots I have written to both....in our 7DII, 5DIII as well as all my 1Ds.....I won't let that happen again....

I realize the risk of a CF failure is minute compared to the micro drive....but they do toss their cookies.



Feb 07, 2016 at 04:06 PM
dolina
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


What I find annoying is there are two formats trying to replace CF cards. These are CFast and XQD. One is based on SATA technology while the other is PCIe.

With the decline in popularity of high end still/video cameras this only means higher costs for memory cards.

This is in contrast to SD cards low end or consumer application. It enjoys lower pricing because of more competition and volume.



Feb 07, 2016 at 04:08 PM
Herb
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


dolina wrote:
What I find annoying is there are two formats trying to replace CF cards. These are CFast and XQD. One is based on SATA technology while the other is PCIe.

With the decline in popularity of high end still/video cameras this only means higher costs for memory cards.

This is in contrast to SD cards low end or consumer application. It enjoys lower pricing because of more competition and volume.


Beta and vhs.......



Feb 07, 2016 at 04:13 PM
Roland W
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


For the 1DX2, the ideal would be if you are sending RAW to the CFast card and JPEG to the CF card, that the data rate would be just what is required for the last card to finish, and not be slowed down to just the rate of writing RAW to the CF card. It could happen, and even is something that might be done in a firmware update.

Quality CF cards are indeed very reliable, and usually it is human error that causes shots to disappear. For those situations, file recovery software will often do the trick. I never liked the idea of micro drives, and the only thing I considered doing with one was to take a broken one apart to look at how it was made.



Feb 07, 2016 at 04:13 PM
dolina
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · New 1DxII, CFAST SLOT?


Herb wrote:
Beta and vhs.......

Blu-ray and HD DVD




Feb 07, 2016 at 04:15 PM
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