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Archive 2015 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

arbitrage
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

This article was brought up in my other general thread for the new 4K and 5K iMacs.

http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/another-new-color-space.html

I'm wondering if this really is an issue or not? If I profile my display with my iDisplay Pro is this an issue at all?? I also read that the iMac comes with aRGB profiles built in that you can switch to anyways.

Oct 16, 2015 at 09:25 AM

theophilus
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

I'd like to see Rodney or Ctein's opinion on this as well.

Oct 16, 2015 at 03:09 PM

Hardcore
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

I like the P3 colour space more than aRGB as I feel the gain in the reds offsets the loss of the green. BUT, I'm also interested to see how this plays out in the real world. If you send a P3 profiled image to print on metal or the likes, are they just going to convert to sRGB or aRGB and your colours are goofed?

Oct 16, 2015 at 09:31 PM

arbitrage
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

Oct 17, 2015 at 08:55 PM

Hardcore
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

arbitrage wrote:
I would assume that you need to convert on export to sRGB for most labs anyways so I guess you can soft proof in LR to see how that looks, or export and view in Finder etc....

Ya, then what's the point of of a p3 colour then? I know a few of the companies I print metal through do aRGB and I send it as that. Output is great, but even p3 can't display aRGB so are you really no better off than just a standard sRGB display?

Oct 17, 2015 at 11:14 PM

ohsnaphappy
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

So if I set the new iMac to sRGB, will it look exactly like the previous generation retina iMac?

Oct 17, 2015 at 11:57 PM

Hardcore
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

ohsnaphappy wrote:
So if I set the new iMac to sRGB, will it look exactly like the previous generation retina iMac?

Yes, exactly the same.

Oct 18, 2015 at 09:17 AM

ELinder
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

Hardcore wrote:
Ya, then what's the point of of a p3 colour then? I know a few of the companies I print metal through do aRGB and I send it as that. Output is great, but even p3 can't display aRGB so are you really no better off than just a standard sRGB display?

The Apple site makes the point that it's important for video to have the wider display gamut, not for still photography.

Erich

Oct 18, 2015 at 09:31 AM

Dr Tone
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

Found this article in regards to the DCI-P3 colour space today:

http://www.astramael.com

Oct 22, 2015 at 02:32 PM

dmcphoto
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

IMO for still photography you should edit in the widest gamut space possible, like ProPhoto RGB. It's far wider than Adobe RGB or these others. Using the widest possible gamut is important to avoid clipping off data that you may want later. In the end the finished image gets converted and to the color space provided by the printer, paper, ink, and their associated profile.

See https://luminous-landscape.com/understanding-prophoto-rgb/

Oct 22, 2015 at 04:02 PM

Hardcore
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

dmcphoto wrote:
IMO for still photography you should edit in the widest gamut space possible, like ProPhoto RGB. It's far wider than Adobe RGB or these others. Using the widest possible gamut is important to avoid clipping off data that you may want later. In the end the finished image gets converted and to the color space provided by the printer, paper, ink, and their associated profile.

See https://luminous-landscape.com/understanding-prophoto-rgb/

what monitor supports prophoto colour space? You have to have a monitor that supports higher gamut or else you will be editing colours that you can't see.

Oct 22, 2015 at 08:38 PM

dmcphoto
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

Hardcore wrote:
what monitor supports prophoto colour space? You have to have a monitor that supports higher gamut or else you will be editing colours that you can't see.

You can see beyond Adobe RGB and similar color spaces, and printer color spaces don't align perfectly with monitor color spaces around the edges of the gamut. Some wide gamut monitors can produce essentially the whole Adobe RGB color space and most narrow gamut monitors fall far short of that, but people edit photos on narrower gamut monitors all the time. Wider gamut monitors may exist a few years from now, and likewise wider gamut printers may be produced. There's just no point in chopping off all the data your monitor or printer can't produce today. If you do your files will not improve as the technologies progress, or you'll have to reprocess them from RAW.

Also don't forget that even if the final image does not exceed Adobe RGB, clipping can occur during the processing that went into producing that final image, thereby degrading it. For instance, if one adjustment layer pushes the image gamut outside the working color space data is lost and the image is degraded. That means another adjustment layer cannot pull all of the data back within the working color space. In a larger space where the first adjustment does not lose any data, the image will not degrade after the second adjustment. The larger color space gives you room to play while lessening the chance of image degradation while doing so. In the end all of the colors are mapped to colors that a printer can reproduce by the printer/media/ink color profile.

Oct 23, 2015 at 07:57 AM

Jeff
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

Hardcore wrote:
I like the P3 colour space more than aRGB as I feel the gain in the reds offsets the loss of the green. BUT, I'm also interested to see how this plays out in the real world. If you send a P3 profiled image to print on metal or the likes, are they just going to convert to sRGB or aRGB and your colours are goofed?

arbitrage wrote:
I would assume that you need to convert on export to sRGB for most labs anyways so I guess you can soft proof in LR to see how that looks, or export and view in Finder etc....

[tangent]In this day and age I can't say I'd be using a lab for professional work that only accepts sRGB-profiles files, but that's for a different thread.[/tangent]

Geoff, have you gotten any more clarity on this issue? Do you own a 4K or 5k iMac? The thread seems to have come to a screeching halt, but I have a 5k on the way and have been digging for info; there's not a lot out there in regard to profiling these new displays. I've read that the super color-nerds are saying that you can't really profile this display with a consumer X-Rite device, but isn't that technically true of any (inexpensive) consumer display?

As far as my understanding goes, using a monitor with a wider color gamut than sRGB is probably a good thing, assuming it is correctly profiled. People on the internet seem to be whining that this display is something other than aRGB, but I can't personally understand why having a higher color gamut than sRGB (a pretty low bar) is a bad thing for critical photographic uses? Of course aRGB would be better for us as photographers (esp. nature and greenery photographers), but output devices are always going to have a different gamut than our monitors, so I guess I'm not getting the partially negative flak that Apple's decision has garnered.

So, has anyone used an X-Rite (or other) device to successfully calibrate a Late 2015 4K/5k DCI-P3 display, and if so, how did the profile look compared to the native profile?

Thanks in advance for any input from owners of these new displays...

-Jeff

Jan 23, 2016 at 11:13 AM

Jeffrey
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

I am using a SpyderPro5 to calibrate my late 2015 iMac 5K. Works great. the stock profile was pretty close. It's a bit better now. Getting 98% of AdobeRGB.

Jan 23, 2016 at 10:09 PM

hugowolf
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

As a practical point, I see more images with out of gamut yellows than any other area. It is especially noticeable in fall foliage images. AdobeRGB seems to beat the new space in this regard.

Brian A

Jan 23, 2016 at 10:39 PM

Jeff
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · DCI-P3 colour space on new iMacs....

hugowolf wrote:
As a practical point, I see more images with out of gamut yellows than any other area. It is especially noticeable in fall foliage images. AdobeRGB seems to beat the new space in this regard.

Brian A

That seems odd looking at the difference in the color spaces; seems like DCI-P3 should perform better in that regard. I'd think AdobeRGB would be better with greens?

Jan 24, 2016 at 12:17 AM


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