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Archive 2015 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...

  
 
RustyBug
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


So, I'm exploring the possibility @ making a platform change. Was looking at the Sony A77 II in this thread:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1384577/0

which led me to the D7200 by comparison.

When I suggested that the D7200 looked to be a full stop better than the A77 II, it was refuted as of little value for wildlife shooters, who typically operate in the 400-1600 ISO range.

My perspective was that the mixture of long lenses and low light, that the difference might be of value, but still no real agreement there.

I guess my real question is with regard to 1) why does (if it does) Nikon (using the same Sony sensor), have seemingly better ISO / noise than the Sony ... and 2) does anyone have any feedback regarding using the D7200 in low light for critters, etc.

The main thing that the A77 II seems to have over the D7200 would be the fps rate. Is there a more comparable camera in the realm of the 7D2 / A77 II in the Nikon lineup than the D7200? Thanks.

Also, DXO is showing the D7200 to have .69 EV better DR @ ISO 100 than the Sony A7R II ... feedback?




Sep 02, 2015 at 09:43 PM
fdevyatkin
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...




RustyBug wrote:
So, I'm exploring the possibility @ making a platform change. Was looking at the Sony A77 II in this thread:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1384577/0

which led me to the D7200 by comparison.

When I suggested that the D7200 looked to be a full stop better than the A77 II, it was refuted as of little value for wildlife shooters, who typically operate in the 400-1600 ISO range.

My perspective was that the mixture of long lenses and low light, that the difference might be of value, but still no real agreement there.

I guess my real question is with regard to 1) why does (if it does) Nikon
...Show more
I shoot the D7200 for birds in flight and sports. For the birds my best results are with a shutter speed not slower than 1/1600 of a second.
Ideally I don't have to crank the ISO too high to achieve this SS so as to maintain the the highest possible IQ. In other words, this is a balancing act, and the more latitude a camera give you, the more likely you get the shot you want.
Nikon has been able to draw that extra "magic" from Sony sensors because of their superb processors. The Expeed 4 in the D7200 (just like the D810 and the D750) is phenomenal. I also enjoy the 24 MP in a DX body (high resolution reach).
Fred



Sep 03, 2015 at 05:19 AM
OwlsEyes
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Hello Rusty,
I don't want to seem like that guy who is driving FM users to their website, but I am going to share this link again: http://btleventhal.com/bruceleventhal/2015/8/13/field-report-and-review-nikon-d7200

This is a link to my blog where I do a pretty thorough analysis and discussion of the D7200 as it applies to wildlife photography. I come from a Canon 5D3/6D/7D/1DmkIII background and adopted the Nikon system nearly a year ago now. Because I do not like to use tele-converters and my longest Nikon focal length is 400mm (via a 200-400mm f4 VR), I depend on the APS sensor to narrow the field of view (and thus increase the apparent focal length). In my journey to the D7200, I've tried using a D800E & D610 (cropping after the fact) and D300/D300s bodies. While the D7200 does not have the build that I want, the sensor and AF capabilities are very good. I have used the camera in Costa Rica photographing rainforest animals at ISO 1600, beavers in sunrise shoots ISO800/1600 and sea otters in overcast situations (ISO800).

At this point, I would happily shoot at ISO800 w/ no fear of printing large (20" or more). At ISO1600, the detail breaks down when the light is indirect. This would be unnoticeable in web images (note, all the pics on my link are 1920px on the long end at 72ppi) and the prints hold good detail at 14" on the long end. I'm not sure that a low light ISO1600 image would hold up as a 32" print unless the subject was so captivating that the noise would be a serious afterthought (like a tiger on the hunt, etc...).

As for comparing the Nikon to the Sony... a few things to consider...
1: At high frame rates, the Sony's EVF does not really keep up and there is a quite a learning curve when you can't really see what you wish to photograph.
2: As a system, it seems that Sony has abandoned the A-mount. Sure they make some good lenses (80-400 v2, 300 f2.8 (though now out of production) and 500 f4 (extremely expensive), but the availability will diminish since it appears that this system is now a serious afterthought.
3: The Nikon is a bargain at less than $1000. With the availability of relatively inexpensive AFS 300 f2.8 lenses and the falling price of both the current 80-400VR2 & older 200-400mmVR f4, high end exotic glass is now something that mere mortals can afford.

Send me a pm if you have specific questions that I might be able to answer.
bruce



Sep 03, 2015 at 10:14 AM
Steve Perry
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


OwlsEyes wrote:
Hello Rusty,
I don't want to seem like that guy who is driving FM users to their website, but I am going to share this link again: http://btleventhal.com/bruceleventhal/2015/8/13/field-report-and-review-nikon-d7200

This is a link to my blog where I do a pretty thorough analysis and discussion of the D7200 as it applies to wildlife photography. I come from a Canon 5D3/6D/7D/1DmkIII background and adopted the Nikon system nearly a year ago now. Because I do not like to use tele-converters and my longest Nikon focal length is 400mm (via a 200-400mm f4 VR), I depend on the APS sensor to narrow the field of
...Show more

+1 for the review - Bruce does a really great job, worth checking out.



Sep 03, 2015 at 01:44 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Thanks, I really appreciate the input.

I think the comment about the detail breaking down at ISO 1600 when the light is "indirect" clearly shows the level of discernment being applied in this consideration, that further validates the integrity of your other comments. I truly appreciate that level of objectivity and discernment.

As to the "plug" ... I think your good, since I asked the question first.



Sep 03, 2015 at 01:50 PM
WestcoastHD
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Was it confirmed recently that a D7200 used a Sony sensor. I haven't seen any post on that topic in a while. The last time I did, most people seemed to agree the sensor was the same brand as the D7100, which is Toshiba.


Sep 03, 2015 at 02:02 PM
morris
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Wildlife photography is frequently done during the magic hour where light levels can be weak. It the past the best way to deal with this was with fast aperture lenses. Today's sensors allow for using less expensive lenses or shooting in even lower light.

I believe this is the direct answer to your question Rusty.

Morris



Sep 03, 2015 at 08:10 PM
monochrome
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


A lot of what I've been shooting lately has my going as high as 3200, because of how early I've been out for song and hummingbirds.


Sep 03, 2015 at 08:33 PM
elkhornsun
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


What is of critical importance with wildlife photography is the speed and accuracy of the autofocus system. The AF for the D7200 is stellar and actually better than that of the D750. If an image is not in focus the sensor and other details are of zero importance. The one thing you cannot really fix in post processing is an out of focus image.

The autofocus depends on the camera and the lenses. For longer focal lengths optical stabilization is important. Don't focus on the technical details that are irrelevant for most wildlife photography.



Sep 03, 2015 at 09:38 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Gotcha @ keeping the main thing the main thing focus (auto or manual).

But isn't shooting at higher ISO facilitating to shooting @ a higher shutter speed for long glass. If the sensor permits a cleaner, higher ISO, would that not be a benefit for using a higher shutter speed to mitigate motion blur @ camera & subject (which IS can't address subject motion blur).




Sep 03, 2015 at 09:45 PM
WestcoastHD
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


RustyBug wrote:
So, I'm exploring the possibility @ making a platform change. Was looking at the Sony A77 II in this thread:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1384577/0

which led me to the D7200 by comparison.

I guess my real question is with regard to 1) why does (if it does) Nikon (using the same Sony sensor), have seemingly better ISO / noise than the Sony ... and 2) does anyone have any feedback regarding using the D7200 in low light for critters, etc.

The main thing that the A77 II seems to have over the D7200 would be the fps rate. Is there a more comparable camera in the realm
...Show more

The premise is that Nikon in the D7200 is using the same Sony sensor, but that never been established. Tom Hogan never states that, and after considerable debate on different forums, no one has technical documentation to show that it is in fact a Sony sensor. The prevailing opinion in that the Toshiba sensor in the D7100 was tweaked and that is why you see better high ISO noise performance.



Sep 05, 2015 at 09:46 AM
OwlsEyes
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Thanks Steve Perry for the positive plug and to others who have read my field report.
I am not a "fanboy" about gear and will readily accept the limitations of what I own... been doing this far too long to not recognize that every piece of camera gear has strengths and weaknesses. In the end, one must ask if the weaknesses are so great that the strengths are irrelevant, or if the reverse is true.

Regarding the manufacturer of the sensor... who cares? I don't give a rat's ass if the sensor is made by Fuji, Nikon, Kodak, Canon, etc... so long as it performs well. The OP asked about the suitability of the D7200 when compared to the Sony A77II for lowlight wildlife. The Sony system has some real strengths with the high-speed frame rate & body construction. On the other hand, the camera relies on a semi-translucent mirror in which light must pass. This is another piece of glass that must be kept clean and robs the sensor of a trace amount of light. This is a theoretical impediment to low light shooting. In addition, because the Sony is an EVF camera, viewing fast moving wildlife will be a challenge when shooting at high frame rates. Users report that they learn to anticipate the EVF delay, others state it is a real problem.

To be completely honest, I doubt anyone would be able to distinguish an image taken with a Sony A77II + 80-400 GII and a Nikon D7200 + 80-400 VRII lens shot at the same place and time. I'd suggest you hold both cameras and shoot a bit in a store to see which feels better to use. Rely on this as your benchmark for making a decision, but recognize that it does appear that Sony is abandoning the A-mount system in favor of their E-mount (did I get his right?... Sony's mount designations really confuse me). If long-term developments are a concern for you, and you are serious about wildlife photography, I still think that Nikon or Canon are the way to go.

regards,
bruce



Sep 05, 2015 at 11:11 AM
mogul
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


Just a quick note on a pretty even handed discussion, the Sony is 70/400 and f4 to f5.6. The 300 is now in the second generation with weathersealing, new motor and nanocoating for flare. (and higher price)


Sep 05, 2015 at 12:52 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


OwlsEyes wrote:
I am not a "fanboy" about gear and will readily accept the limitations of what I own... been doing this far too long to not recognize that every piece of camera gear has strengths and weaknesses. In the end, one must ask if the weaknesses are so great that the strengths are irrelevant, or if the reverse is true.


Amen ... you get exactly where I'm coming from in my questions.

+1 @ of Sony A Mount.

I do however tend to keep my gear for a very long time (still shooting SLR/C), so having a dinosaur in terms of future development isn't as off-putting for me as it probably is for many folks. But, it is a legitimate concern. If they bring out a "wicked awesome" A99 II, or some such thing to instill a bit more confidence in the platform, it could help mitigate some concerns there as well.

+1 @ needing to get "hands on" and shoot some files beyond the plethora of test images under review. But, given my personal proximity to such opportunities (yeah, I could start renting them by the truckload for $$$), I'm trying to narrow down the field before ... AND ... garner a degree of understanding / expectation to take note of for when I do get "hands on" so I can get a better feel for what I'm feeling.

Thanks again.



Sep 05, 2015 at 01:28 PM
mogul
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · D7200 for wildlife shooting in low light ...


The 77II comes with grip (essential with big lenses) for $948...I don't think you can go wrong with either the 7dII, 7200 or the 77II, all are trade off to your kind of shooting. Unless the 99II is something special, aps-c is the way to go for wildlife.
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-a77II-Translucent-VG-C77AM-Vertical/dp/B00PI6N42C/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1441481516&sr=8-9&keywords=sony+a77II



Sep 05, 2015 at 02:38 PM





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