Home · Register · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username  

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Photo Critique | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
  

Archive 2015 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....

  
 
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


I'm still learning (guess that part will never end huh?), but I'm so nervous about which one of these two images I should choose. I've narrowed it down to these. Help me decide. Hubs says my "Ogre's Keep" is a bit garish... ok, I'll admit, it is... but I wanted it to be a little "fairy tale'ish" ... the other is a nice still life... it has a LOT of meaning to me... many of the items are things from my life... so both images are "me"

Hubby is the photog in our family... and he's never candy coated anything while teaching me. I've developed a rather hard exterior when it comes to his "gentle style of CC" (rolling eyes).... If I have handled his critiques... I can prob take yours... (no cussing.... don't make me go Momma on you!)

OK (taking a deep breath).... help me decide on a shot... if YOU were the judge... which one should I enter and why? (and why not the other.... so I can improve).... say what you mean, but do your best not to say it mean

Thanks ya'll! This means a LOT to me!

Gini

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/CarpeBeadum/_DSC5104_6_9_tonemapped%20edited_zpsri3dylsn.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/CarpeBeadum/_wDSC2632_zpsqza9asnp.jpg



Aug 29, 2015 at 05:56 PM
georgetd
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Hmm,

#1, I like the composition, but I think it's over processed. It's got that gritty, over HDR look to it. The noise has come out in the sky. The entire image is over saturated. The greenery seems to have too much color contrast. The building has a sickly "I went to the tanning salon" orange color. And the vignetting is ugly in the upper part of the frame. I know other people like this look, I've seen a bit of it on this forum even, but it doesn't do anything for me. For your goal of a dreamy, fairy tale setting, I think something a little softer would be better.

#2 I like better. Good lighting, nice composition. I like the colors and the processing, it has a nice quiet feel to it. My only worry is that the story of the picture doesn't jump out at me. I know that these objects have some special meaning to you, but not really for me.



Aug 29, 2015 at 07:34 PM
AuntiPode
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


There are some potentially interesting things in the first image of the pair, but as a whole, it doesn't come together in a meaningful way to me. The subject, processing and composition seem to be fighting each other. Critique of the second, later.

Conceptual issues:

How you think about an image matters. For art to be effective most folks are better served if they cultivate a coherent and thoughtful approach. Ask yourself, what do you want the image to say? Ask, how can you compose the scene to say it? For this image, how does the content of the subject scene or the way you cooked the image in post processing say "fairy tale"? A fairy tale is a folkoric fantasy and usually some sort of romance, often with a happy ending, unless you are shooting for something from the brothers Grimm. Stretching the definition, it could be legendary and epic, but legends and epics aren't normally expected to be noir or grittily realistic, are they? Fairy tales are told to children in archetypes. Is a dark border vignette foreboding? Does it say "fairy tale" or hint of something Bram Stoker? Does gritty (noisy) sky say "fairy tale" or something Dickensian about the evils of industrialization and pollution?

Personally, if I can't figure a way to make a scene say what I want, either I change the scene or change what I want to say to something the scene can say.

Composition issues:

In terms of composition for the first of the pair, the tower is basically on the center vertical axis of the frame. That makes for a static composition. Do you want a message of stasis, the slow passage of time? If you want a more dynamic statement, placing the axis away from the center makes would be a better choice. To evaluate an image, ask yourself where is the eye drawn? It will be the nexus of visual interest. There should be something interesting there usually. In a scene with darkened edges and bright brickwork, the eye is drawn to the bright brickwork. The most dominant is the bit in the central vertical axis of the image. The secondary draw, where the eye goes next, is the bright brickwork to the right. What's the interest in the these bright areas? I can't see any. That leaves the eye to wander about the image where it next sees sky through a couple of empty window openings. Do they represent eyes? Seems a stretch. Then the eye wanders around the ivy and is caught by a flagpole of some such on the left. It seems a smudged distraction at best.

What can you do to add fair tale qualities? Offhand, I don't know. My guess is a more easily accomplished meaning might be the way nature takes back from man or the way the works of back crumble to dust. But that's a rather different message than the one you wanted and it may not interest you.



Aug 29, 2015 at 08:59 PM
AuntiPode
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


I like the color and light of the second image. They enhance the message. Unfortunately, some other elements of the composition, or more likely, their positions, reduce the coherence of the message, encouraging my eye to meander around the frame rather than taking it in as a meaningful whole. I suspect re-positioning some of the items a little would result in a stronger and more meaningful message composition.

1. Consider the crowding of the cup, spoon, tea ball and top of the bible. Leaving more space would allow each to carry it's portion of the message without dividing the viewer's attention.

2. Why the blank space on the page? Is it part of the message? The red line on the opposite page? Is there meaning when viewed at a larger scale?

3. What are the objects in the tray? At least on this scale, I can't identify them to determine their meaning. (Perhaps a larger version would resolve the issue as well.)

4. Why are the deer figure and framed photo crowed to the side of the desk compartment so close to the cup cluster? Can you draw the intended object pattern that shapes you composition? The candidates I see don't seem to be helped by the position of the deer and photo.

5. I'm good with negative space, but in this case it adds to the feeling of clutter or jammed together of the cluster of items I've marked as "1".

On a less important note the lamp seems almost tipping itself out of the frame. Moved in a little more it would be a bit more integrated into the message.

Constructing an image like this is a little like writing a short story. Each thing you mention should be a useful part of the story. Things that don't add to the message or function as subliminal background just distract.









Aug 30, 2015 at 12:00 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


georgetd wrote:
Hmm,

#1, I like the composition, but I think it's over processed. It's got that gritty, over HDR look to it. The noise has come out in the sky. The entire image is over saturated. The greenery seems to have too much color contrast. The building has a sickly "I went to the tanning salon" orange color. And the vignetting is ugly in the upper part of the frame. I know other people like this look, I've seen a bit of it on this forum even, but it doesn't do anything for me. For your goal of a dreamy, fairy
...Show more

Thanks Georgetd for your reply!
1. I'm shooting with a D300 so with my being a little heavy handed with processing I guess it does tend to have a lot more noise than my hubby's camera and his lighter processing.... still learning how to not get that tanning salon look.

2. yea, all the objects were more "me"... when hubby and I did similar shots we both collected objects and shot them that described who "we" were... I'd not taken this with the intent of entering into any comp... just so happened this was one I thought would make a good entry. Thanks for your comments! They help!



Aug 30, 2015 at 09:52 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


AuntiPode wrote:
There are some potentially interesting things in the first image of the pair, but as a whole, it doesn't come together in a meaningful way to me. The subject, processing and composition seem to be fighting each other. Critique of the second, later.

Conceptual issues:

How you think about an image matters. For art to be effective most folks are better served if they cultivate a coherent and thoughtful approach. Ask yourself, what do you want the image to say? Ask, how can you compose the scene to say it? For this image, how does the content of the subject scene or
...Show more

AuntiPode,

Thank you so very much! You've given me much to think about the next trip out. Thankfully this is a local landmark (it used to be a fabric mill turned fabric shop... I used to shop at and didn't recognize) so it is not impossible to reshoot... except I have no intent to tromp thru the snake infested kudzu ha ha... but you are right, nature takes back and I was going a little "dark" on my theme... more "Bram" than Cinderella in this one... I truly appreciate everything you've said and will remember when I go out again! THANK YOU!



Aug 30, 2015 at 10:00 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


AuntiPode wrote:
I like the color and light of the second image. They enhance the message. Unfortunately, some other elements of the composition, or more likely, their positions, reduce the coherence of the message, encouraging my eye to meander around the frame rather than taking it in as a meaningful whole. I suspect re-positioning some of the items a little would result in a stronger and more meaningful message composition.

1. Consider the crowding of the cup, spoon, tea ball and top of the bible. Leaving more space would allow each to carry it's portion of the message without dividing the viewer's attention.

2.
...Show more

WOW! Again thanks for such a comprehensive answer! It helps!

Due to my own back issues I tend to read my Bible a bit crooked... so I push everything to the side a bit and leave "elbow room". We (hubs and me) shot similar still life images describing who we are... this was me... shot without thinking of competition composition... so, with all your advice AND the help of hubby (he allowed me to use his camera instead of my D300 which has more noise in low light) we did a do over....

1. I left out the ball and my little mat (couldn't find it as I've stored all my handwoven items... yea, I wove that little thing hee hee)

2. Blank space was just because of the page it was at in my Bible, the Proverbs 31 woman, it was a place for notes if I were to take any, but this time I put my glasses there.

3. The tray is soapstone, hand carved filled with hand cut stones my father and brother cut and my charm bracelet... just trinkets of "me"

4. The picture is my Dad, the deer is one of the first pieces of jewelry I ever made (at 5 years old), he cut the stone and I hand polished it and he mounted it for me... very special to me.

5. Neg space gone, but was for my elbow...

moved the lamp in so it didn't look like it was tipping out.

is this better? Thanks again for all your help!

gini

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/CarpeBeadum/_wDSC9371_zps68ev7cep.jpg



Aug 30, 2015 at 10:15 AM
Greg Campbell
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


#1
Agree with #2, it's IMO pretty awful.
Specifically:
The antenna at left.
The building being neither centered nor far enough off center to look comfortable.
The big halo around the building.
Probably a little too much sky, the wild clouds 'take' too much attention from the rest.

And, well, it's HDR. And we all know what that means.


Work on making a better image first, before getting sidetracked with all the fancy post processing that has become all the rage. PP is an essential part of the hobby, but should never become the focus of your activities. Finding a very good shot of a castle like that should take some time. Try from all different angles, zoom in, zoom out, come back when the light has changed, etc. How long did you work the scene? And how much time did you spend hunkered over the computer, trying to make it 'look good.'

#2 is much better.
I'd agree that there is too much 'dead' space at left. Your crop above is, IMO, a huge improvement.



Aug 30, 2015 at 12:58 PM
AuntiPode
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Definitely, a substantial improvement!


Aug 30, 2015 at 01:56 PM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Greg Campbell wrote:
#1
Agree with #2, it's IMO pretty awful.
Specifically:
The antenna at left.
The building being neither centered nor far enough off center to look comfortable.
The big halo around the building.
Probably a little too much sky, the wild clouds 'take' too much attention from the rest.

And, well, it's HDR. And we all know what that means.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/60092457/Peppers/HDR_Hole.gif

Work on making a better image first, before getting sidetracked with all the fancy post processing that has become all the rage. PP is an essential part of the hobby, but should never become the focus of your activities. Finding a very good shot of
...Show more

PHONES have cameras? geez? mine just has a cord! lol, ok, it does have a camera... but not worthy of mention... yea, got sucked in deep in the HDR hole I can barely see daylight... but I'll climb out, eventually... kinda fun playing around... sorta like finger painting... but not for competition. Love the illustration... may have to steal this one!

Thanks!



Aug 30, 2015 at 02:18 PM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


AuntiPode wrote:
Definitely, a substantial improvement!


Thanks AuntiPote,

My hubby (Walter) just framed it for me... I'm all set for the fair. Lot of good photogs out there... doubt I'll even place, but at least I have had some good instruction and feedback!

Thanks again!

gini



Aug 30, 2015 at 02:20 PM
AuntiPode
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


The chart's too simple. Old hands know the drop to base-line loss of confidence is a five to ten year repeating cycle, not a one-off.

Edited on Aug 31, 2015 at 02:25 PM · View previous versions



Aug 30, 2015 at 02:54 PM
beavens
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Gini wrote:
Thanks AuntiPote,

My hubby (Walter) just framed it for me... I'm all set for the fair. Lot of good photogs out there... doubt I'll even place, but at least I have had some good instruction and feedback!

Thanks again!

gini


I *knew* that you had to be connected to Walt!! He posted a very similar version of #1 that you posted, and I want to say that he mentioned in the post that you had spotted it.

Welcome to FM!

Everyone else has pretty much covered everything here, just wanted to say that I love the rework of #2 - great shot and mood IMO.

Cheers,

Jeff



Aug 31, 2015 at 06:43 AM
lighthound
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


+1 on liking the improvement in rework of #2. Karen shared some great advice and you demonstrated the execution of those suggestions very nicely as shown in your edit.

I much prefer image #2.

A couple years ago I fell into the HDR hole but have slowly climbed out as best I can since hanging around here. I still use the multi-image blending technique but try to keep my images looking natural.

But for some reason I'm still stuck in the "Dammit, I suck" stage with most of my images.

Welcome to FM Gini! Hope to see more of your work in the future!

Dave



Aug 31, 2015 at 09:07 AM
sbeme
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Enormously thoughtful and generous analysis, Karen.
++++++



Aug 31, 2015 at 09:17 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


beavens wrote:
I *knew* that you had to be connected to Walt!! He posted a very similar version of #1 that you posted, and I want to say that he mentioned in the post that you had spotted it.

Welcome to FM!

Everyone else has pretty much covered everything here, just wanted to say that I love the rework of #2 - great shot and mood IMO.

Cheers,

Jeff


Thanks for the welcome Jeff.... yup, Walt is my better half! He's guilty for introducing me to photography! and in my ramblings around town I often spot little gems like that horrid HDR thing up top.... and, now I'm trying to find a way to get onto a property to shoot a local castle... whoda thunk NC would have a CASTLE! now to get permission!

I can't take credit fully for the rearranging of the shot, Walt helped me with it... his "eye" for these things is much better than mine... I did however replace his zippo with an egg .... the zippo just wasn't "me".

I just can't think of anything I'd rather be doing than to be out shooting with him (Walt)

Thanks for the welcome!

gini



Aug 31, 2015 at 10:10 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


lighthound wrote:
+1 on liking the improvement in rework of #2. Karen shared some great advice and you demonstrated the execution of those suggestions very nicely as shown in your edit.

I much prefer image #2.

A couple years ago I fell into the HDR hole but have slowly climbed out as best I can since hanging around here. I still use the multi-image blending technique but try to keep my images looking natural.

But for some reason I'm still stuck in the "Dammit, I suck" stage with most of my images.

Welcome to FM Gini! Hope to see more of
...Show more

Thanks Dave.... yea, I think I'm in the my images suck stage and in the deep HDR hole too... egads :P hee hee... and thanks to Karen and Walt my new image just might at least not humiliate me at the fair .

Thanks again for the welcome Dave!

gini



Aug 31, 2015 at 10:13 AM
Gini
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


sbeme wrote:
Enormously thoughtful and generous analysis, Karen.
++++++



Yes it was... I'm so VERY grateful for her thorough analysis in my newbie attempts. Thank you Karen!



Aug 31, 2015 at 10:14 AM
beavens
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


Gini wrote:
Thanks for the welcome Jeff.... yup, Walt is my better half! He's guilty for introducing me to photography! and in my ramblings around town I often spot little gems like that horrid HDR thing up top.... and, now I'm trying to find a way to get onto a property to shoot a local castle... whoda thunk NC would have a CASTLE! now to get permission!

I can't take credit fully for the rearranging of the shot, Walt helped me with it... his "eye" for these things is much better than mine... I did however replace his zippo with an egg ....
...Show more

I will look forward to the future postings. Very very awesome that you guys have a shared interest in the same amazing hobby.

I'm hoping you both are shooting on the same platform so you can share the lenses.

Jeff



Aug 31, 2015 at 12:20 PM
AuntiPode
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · First time entering local fair, so if you were the judge....


You are most welcome, Gini! It's the sort of advice I wish someone had given me when I was starting. Asking yourself the right questions can be an essential part of learning to understand your intent and visualize images in your mind's eye.

Cheers,
Karen



Aug 31, 2015 at 02:01 PM
1
       2       end




FM Forums | Photo Critique | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username       Or Reset password



This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.